Is it ever too late to step forward and report sexual assault?

[Muriel Schwenck]

Justin Trudeau ... okay fine.
[...]
I think MUST Believe ... should be replaced with ... we must CONSIDER.

Absolutely consider.
Just mentioned Trudeau because of the irony and hypocrisy.
He's an embarassment to Canada, and my great great uncle was Laurier! OK, very distant relative indeed but I have lots of Canadian cousins so I have a big soft spot for Canada.

 

[lithiumgirl]

Or because their mother was the judge that signed off on her family's house being foreclosed on in the 90's... Sour grapes?

I heard his mother actually made a judgement in their favour ... not against them.

 

[knockout]

Another

Senate Democrats Investigate a New Allegation of Sexual Misconduct, from Brett Kavanaugh’s College Years

As Senate Republicans press for a swift vote to confirm Brett Kavanaugh, President Trump’s nominee to the Supreme Court, Senate Democrats are investigating a new allegation of sexual misconduct against Kavanaugh. The claim dates to the 1983-84 academic school year, when Kavanaugh was a freshman at Yale University. The offices of at least four Democratic senators have received information about the allegation, and at least two have begun investigating it. Senior Republican staffers also learned of the allegation last week and, in conversations with The New Yorker, expressed concern about its potential impact on Kavanaugh’s nomination. Soon after, Senate Republicans issued renewed calls to accelerate the timing of a committee vote. The Democratic Senate offices reviewing the allegations believe that they merit further investigation. “This is another serious, credible, and disturbing allegation against Brett Kavanaugh. It should be fully investigated,” Senator Mazie Hirono, of Hawaii, said. An aide in one of the other Senate offices added, “These allegations seem credible, and we’re taking them very seriously. If established, they’re clearly disqualifying.”

The woman at the center of the story, Deborah Ramirez, who is fifty-three, attended Yale with Kavanaugh, where she studied sociology and psychology. Later, she spent years working for an organization that supports victims of domestic violence. The New Yorker contacted Ramirez after learning of her possible involvement in an incident involving Kavanaugh. The allegation was conveyed to Democratic senators by a civil-rights lawyer. For Ramirez, the sudden attention has been unwelcome, and prompted difficult choices. She was at first hesitant to speak publicly, partly because her memories contained gaps because she had been drinking at the time of the alleged incident. In her initial conversations with The New Yorker, she was reluctant to characterize Kavanaugh’s role in the alleged incident with certainty. After six days of carefully assessing her memories and consulting with her attorney, Ramirez said that she felt confident enough of her recollections to say that she remembers Kavanaugh had exposed himself at a drunken dormitory party, thrust his penis in her face, and caused her to touch it without her consent as she pushed him away. Ramirez is now calling for the F.B.I. to investigate Kavanaugh’s role in the incident. “I would think an F.B.I. investigation would be warranted,” she said.

In a statement, Kavanaugh wrote, “This alleged event from 35 years ago did not happen. The people who knew me then know that this did not happen, and have said so. This is a smear, plain and simple. I look forward to testifying on Thursday about the truth, and defending my good name—and the reputation for character and integrity I have spent a lifetime building—against these last-minute allegations.”
https://www.newyorker.com/news/news...rett-kavanaughs-college-years-deborah-ramirez

 

[lithiumgirl]

Or because their mother was the judge that signed off on her family's house being foreclosed on in the 90's... Sour grapes?

I heard his mother actually made a judgement in their favour ... not against them.

 

[lithiumgirl]

@knockout ... thanks!

I think Brett is telling the truth ... this did not happen in the way she is alleging.

I think Brett got to third base ... and then completely respected her when she declined to get him home, and that she absolutely was not sexually assaulted, violently or otherwise or raped.

 

[Muriel Schwenck]

We read about horrific assaults here everyday ... we know the difference.

And that is why I wish the discussion would not veer to the political but emphasize ordinary citizens who truly suffer and fail to report whether for fear , shame or craven self interest
Yes, I mentioned Trudeau, but honestly only in a satirical way to point out hypocrisy. I promise not to mention politicians or celebrities again in this thread.

 

[Muriel Schwenck]

Every single woman who's ever lived has had to endure some form of sexual harassment, sexual assault/unwanted touching, to outright rape.
Every. Single. Woman. throughout time.

Not me. I guess I'm unattractive. Or maybe standoffish. I have nothing to complain about, and some events to laugh about.

 

[knockout]

another one breakingnews A Never Trump claims Kavanaugh used a dildo on her, but best friend says she says she's never heard about it
no link
Dems just going to keep marching them in

 

[CentreAussie]

Every single woman who's ever lived has had to endure some form of sexual harassment, sexual assault/unwanted touching, to outright rape.
Every. Single. Woman. throughout time.

Yet we've been taught forever to stay silent, don't tell, it's a woman's cross to bear, no one will believe you, etc., to the outrageous and extremes of: "You're over-reacting", "Can't you take a joke?", "I was just playing around.", "What the hell is wrong with you feminists?",

What the hell is wrong with you? Feminist?

 

[lithiumgirl]

Not me. I guess I'm unattractive. Or maybe standoffish. I have nothing to complain about, and some events to laugh about.

Or maybe you’re just out of their league and they know it.

 

[lithiumgirl]

another one breakingnews A Never Trump claims Kavanaugh used a dildo on her, but best friend says she says she's never heard about it
no link
Dems just going to keep marching them in

All this means is that Kavanaugh was popular ... I guess all l really want to know is who’s dildo was it. Does Brett just walk around with a bag of fake dicks in his pocket or what?

 

[Muriel Schwenck]

Or maybe you’re just out of their league and they know it.

That's a matter of opinion. Also a matter of self respect.

 

[Siobhan]

It took me 29 years. But I'm not a woman, so I guess I don't count?

No, you absolutely count, as I said this is about all people: men, women, teens, children - everyone.
I'm grateful you were able to come forward, no matter how long it took - you know as a survivor the countless reasons it may take a person (especially a child) not to make an immediate reporting - for each person, it's different situation and often complicated as to why they may fear coming forward and also to find the courage within themselves to eventually speak out.
I am saddened that you were forced to endure something so incredible wrong by another's actions, and IT WAS NOT THEN, NOR WILL IT EVER BE YOUR FAULT!
You were and are still an innocent survivor, who did NOTHING WRONG.
I do hope your abuser dies in fear and self-loathing, without attaining any personal peace that most of have when we're facing the final moments of our own mortality.
#IBelieveCentreAussie <3:hug:

 

[Muriel Schwenck]

Apparently the over the edge nut case hasn’t been informed of the thread so it’s remained civil

I think that person is a weekday only participant. It's still Sunday evening for most of us.
Brace yourself.......

 

[Siobhan]

Considering that only approximately 310 out of every 1,000 sexual assaults are reported even today as women fear the consequences of doing so. Is it ever too late to step from the shadows?

The Criminal Justice System: Statistics https://www.rainn.org/statistics/criminal-justice-system

Study: Sexual assaults greatly underreported

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...xual-assaults-greatly-underreported-/3648197/

No one said not to report
But rational people don’t want to hear about a feel up from 35 years ago, especially if you can’t remember a single detail, not even where you were at the time

It’s not ok to ruin someone’s life because you don’t like their politics

Victoria's quote above yours asks the question: "Is it ever to late to step from the shadows?"
That is asking if it's ever too late to report.
My response was on topic, whereas your reply of "No one said not to report." , is a non sequitur.
We're not going to talk off topic here about politics; what we are talking about are victims of sexual abuse/harassment and rape, and whether or not too much time has ever past for any of them to report or speak out publicly about their experience. Period.

Trying to turn this thread into a political discussion will eventually piss off our moderators, who have more than enough to try to keep up with the countless threads in the forums each day, with little to no appreciation for their hard work by many posters, and will result in this thread getting shut down in the process.

Bill Cosby was just convicted for things he did 35+/- years ago to many women, several of whom have gaps in their memories of when/where their assaults happened because of alcohol consumption and Cosby's own admission of drugging some of them without their knowledge or consent.
We're seeing many now who are being arrested, or losing their jobs for behaviors they did years/decades ago - just as it should be, whether the abuser is a man, woman or teenager who's actions were done yesterday, last week, last month, last year, or even last century.

 

[CentreAussie]

It's never too late to come forward, perpetrators of these sick crimes need to be held to account. Society as a whole needs to stand against the sick mentality that breeds predators.

The problem lies in this whole 'she must be believed' nonsense.

Why must she be believed? Are women inherently incapable of lies? Are women naturally more trustworthy than men? Have no women ever lied to destroy a mans life?

No. In a just society you don't get to make a claim without evidence and get to be automatically believed.
Historic allegations should be respected and investigated, not believed. They can only be said to be true after a trail and a legal judgment.

An allegation of a sexual crime is plenty to ruin an innocent person, that's exactly why believing a 'victim' with no reason other than the 'feels' is an abomination.

If you do think women should be automatically believed, consider my case. One man alleging abuse by another. Who do you believe then?

 

[Keepalowprofile]

.

If you do think women should be automatically believed, consider my case. One man alleging abuse by another. Who do you believe then?

I guess the one that looks a little more feminine than the other?

 

[CentreAussie]

I guess the one that looks a little more feminine than the other?

Damn.
I was hoping somebody was going to say "Of course we'd believe you CA, why would you make up that shit?"
Then I could have told them to go re-read my last post... The correct answer is that you believe the facts.

 

[Muriel Schwenck]

Keeps, despite the sarcastic penguins, the answer is really yes.

 

[JackBurton]

Get the feeling quite a few people here are either relying on some trash media outlets to formulate their views of the whole Kavanough situation, or theyre comfortably reverting to their own biases.

Chock me down for one of the few who would like to hear some actual info, yes even if an ACTUAL investigation must occur to get it, before condemning anyone.

Oh and i must say i find it quite odd anyone would be so quick to back Kavanough when some of his own, current backers/friends have boasted about what a partier and drinker he was back in college. Is it seriously that unbelievable that a drunk young man might take things a bit too far? Just odd anyone could so easily formulate a "def false" stance so soon in all this. Meh.

Anyways, no it's never too early to report. And i say that in regards to both the LEGAL side of the coin and otherwise. Even if statute of limitations has passed on a persons victimization, their witness account can potentially help authorities with current or more recent crimes and aid them arresting a shithead if he's been active since. There are also matters like civil lawsuits to consider.

It's not just the asshole who stole her, but why didn't the girls scream for their father the moment that creep entered her bedroom?That's the problem: didn't she believe her parents would help if she screamed for help? Fucking creepy!

He threatened her with a knife. She believed if she made a noise she would be killed.

Her refusal to save herself later on, even when he brazenly took her out in public places, even when she encountered a police officer when out on the town, is quite perplexing though.

Throw away the key for the rapes but I'm getting really sick of actresses who are disgusted with themselves for sleeping with a pig of a man to benefit their own careers claiming 'victim' status. Selling your coochie doesn't make you a victim.

To be fair, many of these stories that have come out arent a matter of, "sleep with me and you get the part!", but instead it's "sleep with me or youll never work in this town again!". And looking at the careers of the women who say they didnt put out really says a lot.

Christine Ford's claims were as credible as any other. The way it has been handled by her and the democrats destroyed that. No one in the media is prepared to say it, but she is a lying whore. She just another delusional vagina hat wearing liberal Trump hater. These people convince themselves that the ends justifies the means, if it takes destroying an innocent man and his family to hurt Trump, then so be it.

If you think the only reason people oppose a conservative leaning judge for the Supreme Court is out of spite for Trump, you have no fucking clue what is actually going on or what the actual issues are regarding the whole shitshow. Perhaps read up on the Supreme Court in America before making such ignorant comments dumbing down the whole thing to such an absurd degree. Just a little FYI, a supreme court judges presence and influence transcends the presidency of whoever appointed them. It's a lifetime gig. Mere dislike for the sitting president has little to nothing to do with it.

I will say however that from a political standpoint, it is quite foolish and pointless for democrats to make too big a fuss over whoever it is Trump nominates. No matter what, a conservative leaning judge is going to get appointed. That is a harsh, unavoidable reality every single one of em should have understood, accepted, and come to terms with the night their trash, absurdly polarizing presidential nominee lost the election.

That doesnt mean sit idly by and let a judge in who may have committed sexual assault at worse, and at best engaged in behaviors that cast major doubt on his morality, integrity, and honesty.

 

[CentreAussie]

To be fair, many of these stories that have come out arent a matter of, "sleep with me and you get the part!", but instead it's "sleep with me or youll never work in this town again!". And looking at the careers of the women who say they didnt put out really says a lot.

To be fair, there were probably just as many or more women who couldn't wait to suck his slimy cock, because it was worth it to them at the time.

If you think the only reason people oppose a conservative leaning judge for the Supreme Court is out of spite for Trump, you have no fucking clue what is actually going on or what the actual issues are regarding the whole shitshow.

I didn't say that, I said that it was a factor in this case and with other verifiable liberal BS. Since you clearly don't have a fucking clue about simple shit like that, If you want I'll skype you later so I can explain things to you slowly.

 

[JackBurton]

Here's a recent article about the fallout of an alleged rape that is said to have happened 35 years ago (link)

Problem here is that it appears her testimony was full of impossibilities. Could have been due to memory fading over the years, losing sight of small but vital details, who knows.

But IF she was actually raped, her speaking out did prevent this man from becoming a general and having an even greater influence. Even if it cost her financially, it could be argued her actions still had significant worth/value.

 

[CentreAussie]

Perhaps read up on the Supreme Court in America before making such ignorant comments dumbing down the whole thing to such an absurd degree. Just a little FYI, a supreme court judges presence and influence transcends the presidency of whoever appointed them. It's a lifetime gig. Mere dislike for the sitting president has little to nothing to do with it.

And in other news the sky is blue. Good thing you're here to expose my ignorance to everyone.

 

[JackBurton]

To be fair, there were probably just as many or more women who couldn't wait to suck his slimy cock, because it was worth it to them at the time.

How in the fuck is that relevant?

I didn't say that, I said that it was a factor in this case and with other verifiable liberal BS

It's a baseless claim, one logic, history, and the actual manner the supreme court operates clashes with. And how is it "verifiable BS" at this point? Whats "verifiable" about a simple "he said, she said"??? I'm sensing a level of bias here touching on the unreasonable side of intelligent discourse.

 

[CentreAussie]

How in the fuck is that relevant?

It's a baseless claim. And how is it "verifiable BS" at this point? I'm sensing a level of bias here touching on the unreasonable side of intelligent discourse.

You brought up the fact that Weinstien probably extorted sex, when I had already said he was probably a rapist, so how the fuck was that relevant? I was pointing out that in all likely-hood, there are bandwagon jumping whores are exploiting #metoo for their own benefit.

I said "other verifiable liberal BS". Not an implication that this event was in fact verifiable BS.

Are you drunk, or is English not your 1st language?

 

[JackBurton]

You brought up the fact that Weinstien probably extorted sex, when I had already said he was probably a rapist, so how the fuck was that relevant?

I was, very clearly and obviously, merely commenting that when it comes to the stories and accusations surrounding Weinstein specifically, it doesnt seem your hypothetical, "some bitches whore their way into acting gigs voluntarily" is particularly applicable or pertinent.

And while it's fair and likely accurate to suggest there no doubt are plenty of sluts thorughout the industry who have taken advantage of such dirty business, and who have exploited anything and everything, i fail to see the value in ranting or raving about it in the context of the specific mentioning of the Weinstein shitshow, which is backed by an immense multitude of VERY believable claims/accusations.

I realize you are just being as antagonistic as possible for some inexplicable reason(aka youre a simplistic troll), but this nonsense is getting to be a bit much. PMs exist for a reason if you want to senselessly engage in petty bullshit nonsense, try not completely hijacking a thread over it.

I said "other verifiable liberal BS". Not an implication that this event was in fact verifiable BS.

I said that it was a factor in this case and with other verifiable liberal BS.

If you didnt want there to be any implication that you were also lumping the current Kavanough story in with "OTHER verifiable liberal BS", you probably shouldnt have, i dont know, lumped mention of the kavanough story in a sentence with "OTHER verifiable liberal BS". Dont make shitty, unclear comments and then bitch and whine when others dont fully get your intended point(which i must be honest i am still a tad unsure on).

 

[Nell]

I agree with your statement regarding Ford.
The real discussion has to be ordinary people. Not celebritries, or any political axe grinding.

Even Elizabeth Smart, she's a minor celebrity in the aftermath, but she was nobody when it started. We have to look at why even her own sister didn't run screaming to the parents the moment Elizabeth was dragged from the bedroom, but waited a few hours out of fear. We have to ask why Smart led her kidnappers to her own cousin's bedroom window so they could acquire another young blond virgin.
It's not just the asshole who stole her, but why didn't the girls scream for their father the moment that creep entered her bedroom?That's the problem: didn't she believe her parents would help if she screamed for help? Fucking creepy!
It's a complicated question.

Her sister was fucking nine, saw a man steal her older sibling, and he threatened her with death.

What the fuck?

 

[Nell]

Good thing everyday people vote ...

Good thing you live in Canada.

 

[Nell]

Apparently the over the edge nut case hasn’t been informed of the thread so it’s remained civil

Yes. Because only she was acting a fool.

Jesus fuck.

 

[lithiumgirl]

, and IT WAS NOT THEN, NOR WILL IT EVER BE YOUR FAULT!
<3:hug:

When I was a kid I had to go to a therapist where I always heard this ... its not your fault ... Blah blah blah. And at some point I recall getting very angry about it and responding ... "I know ... my mom already told me that" I don't know why but for some reason I resented hearing it from people who didn't know me or my family and even at eight I resented being put in the victim box, not by my perpetrator but by the people that were tasked with helping me work through it.