One step forward, one step back...

[brokenandtwisted]

Early Polls Show California's Prop 8 Gaining

NOVEMBER 5, 2008, 3:50 A.M. ET

Early poll results Tuesday night showed California voters leaning toward overturning same-sex marriage in the state in a decision that could impact how the issue plays out elsewhere in the nation.

Approval of Proposition 8 would be a stunning upset in a $70-million campaign that just weeks ago looked to be running in favor of preserving gay marriage rights.

By 12:34 a.m. in California, 53.1% of voters favored passing Prop 8, as the measure is known, and 46.9% were against it, with 60% of precincts voting, according to the Secretary of State. However, both sides cautioned the vote could be very close and that it might still be early to declare a winner.

The passage of Prop 8, as it is known, would be a major victory for religious conservatives seeking to ban gay marriage in other states, and a crippling setback for the gay rights movement nationwide.

Link

Now, if you run on over to the state of California's website, it has the current updates (this article is hours old). With 88.9% ( 22,608 of 25,423 ) precincts partially or fully reporting as of Nov. 5, 2008, at 3:54 a.m., Prop 8 is winning with 51.8% of votes.

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[Athena]

No kidding, huh? We can elect a black man with a middle name like "Hussein" to the highest office in the nation, but those fags are just gonna have to wait for their's.

Morticia's worried about the government coming after our civil liberties...when citizens are gunning after each others'. Until the people of this country are done trying to impose personal values on legislation that affects everyone, we'll have a hard time expecting better of our elected officials.

Here's the thing that bugs me about Prop 8 and the gay marriage issue. Heh...I say that like there's just one thing. Anyway, California's Supreme Court already ruled without question that same-sex couples have the right to marry. In my opinion, when a Supreme Court rules something, the decision should never, EVER be turned over to the populace so that they can nullify a ruling that establishes rights for a faction of society. To me, that contradicts the very purpose of a Supreme Court.

Of course, in MY opinion, the question of "marriage" shouldn't be a legislative function at all. Marriage is a religious union. Churches that want to marry same-sex couples should be free to and those that don't shouldn't. Simple as that. On the legal side of things, all unions should be recognized as domestic unions or partnerships. There should be no distinction between the domestic unions of heterosexual or homosexual couples. This leaves the definition of "marriage" where it belongs - to churches. Problem fucking solved...but that would be far too easy to for the fucking religious ASSHOLES whose sole purpose for pursuing legislation like Prop 8 is to punish gay people for existing.

Lastly, let's talk a bit about the way Protectmarriage.com, the primary organization responsible for Prop 8, has been doing business. From Wiki:

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On October 22, a contributor who recently helped underwrite a San Diego event that raised money to defeat Proposition 8 received a letter from ProtectMarriage.com, proponents of Proposition 8, demanding a donation of at least $10,000.[39] The letter requested that the recipient "withdraw its support of Equality California," the organization that is part of the campaign against Proposition 8, and threatened to publish the names of companies and organizations that supported Equality California but "chose not to donate in like manner to ProtectMarriage.com."

“ Were you to elect not to donate comparably, it would be a clear indication that you are in opposition to traditional marriage. You would leave us no other reasonable assumption. The names of any companies and organizations that choose not to donate in like manner to ProtectMarriage.com but have given to Equality California will be published. It is only fair for Proposition 8 supporters to know which companies and organizations oppose traditional marriage.[40] ”

The letter was signed by Ron Prentice, the campaign chairman for Yes on Prop 8; Edward Dolejsi, executive director of the California Catholic Conference; Mark Jansson, an executive committee member of ProtectMarriage.com; and Andrew Pugno, general counsel for ProtectMarriage.com.

When asked whether ProtectMarriage.com planned to name businesses that have supported the No on 8 campaign, Prentice initially said he was unaware of any such effort. "I'm not familiar of any organized attack against organizations that have given to No on 8," he said. But when asked about the letters, Prentice confirmed they were authentic. A ProtectMarriage.com spokeswoman estimated that 36 companies were targeted for the letter.

The executive director of Equality California, Geoffrey Kors, said that two other business owners had also received the letter, saying, "It's truly an outrageous attempt to extort people."[41]

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Unbelievable, right? Fucking weasles, if you ask me.

...And since we're on the topic, I must say I smiled at the preface someone has very recently added to the Wiki article. It's a perfectly normal Wiki article once you get past this rant that comes before it:

Isn't the United States of America supposed to be FREE? Aren't all people supposed to have RIGHTS and be EQUAL? Prop 8 was passed, and all those people who voted for it should be ashamed. You want to restore traditional marriage? What about restoring the Constitution??!!! Gays should have the right to marry each other if they have American Citizenship; they should, after all, have the same rights as the rest of us-because we're all equal, right? No, we're not. If we were all equal then this propostition would never even have been proposed! And back to the "restoring marriage" thing. If you want to restore it, make it so that Blacks can't marry-they couldn't do that way back when it was "traditional". Oh, no. We can't do that...they have RIGHTS. If America was truely free, then EVERYONE should have RIGHTS. Think about this: what if traditional marriage was Gays, and no other people could marry. Would you want it restored? No because, you want to get married, too, AND YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO SO. I'm not even gay-I'm totally straight- and I think this is BS.

[bogustoo]

Here's the thing that bugs me about Prop 8 and the gay marriage issue. Heh...I say that like there's just one thing. Anyway, California's Supreme Court already ruled without question that same-sex couples have the right to marry. In my opinion, when a Supreme Court rules something, the decision should never, EVER be turned over to the populace so that they can nullify a ruling that establishes rights for a faction of society. To me, that contradicts the very purpose of a Supreme Court.

Excellent point. What kind of precedence has this just set? The general population can void any and all Supreme Court decisions?

As for protectmarriage.com, what do they believe they are protecting marriage from? If the premise is to protect the sanctity of marriage, I think the straight people have already fucked that one up. The divorce rate is at an all-time high. The majority of people don't go into marriage with the "until death do us part" mentality.

Don't get me wrong. I am both straight AND divorced. I just don't see a reason to decide that gay people cannot get married.

[Peeperann]

Aw hell, if California, one of our more 'progressive' states over turns this, what the hell is going to happen with the rest of the country? What is going to happen to all the gay couples who have already gotten married there? Is theirs still going to be a legal marriage?

I hate that this is happening. Why should anyone care who marries who?

[Sarabei]

This makes me sick....why are people so threatened by anyone different from them? Who CARES who marries who? It doesn't affect "marriage" or the "sanctity" of marriage. The right wing bigots make me wanna puke!

[brokenandtwisted]

California voters outlaw gay marriage

Nov 05, 2008 01:45 PM

LOS ANGELES–California voters have approved a constitutional amendment outlawing same-sex marriage, overturning the state Supreme Court decision that gave gay couples the right to wed just months ago.

The passage of Proposition 8 represents a crushing political defeat for gay rights activists, who had hoped public opinion on the contentious issue had shifted enough to help them defeat the measure.

It also represents a personal loss for the thousands of couples from California and others states who got married in the brief window when they could.

Legal experts have said it will have to be resolved in court whether their unions still are valid.

Voters in Arizona and Florida also approved propositions to ban gay marriage.

http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/531108

[Athena]

Boooooooooo!

I still don't get how voters can overrule the SC. Not much protection against mob rule, if you ask me...

[lwags]

If California really wants to protect the "sanctity" of marriage why not ban pedophiles and wife beaters from getting married and leave the gays and lesbians alone?