ACORN and voter fraud

[celtic friend]

As some of you may know, ACORN is responsible for some heavy duty voter fraud. Just throwing out that it backs Obama and Obama has deep connections to this group. I only threw that out there since I know that had it been reversed this would have already been discussed on here, and also McCain/Palin would have most certainly been brought up. Anyhoo, I am about sick of this election but I do wonder are any of you concerned about this issue? Do you think it will hold up the elections and the decisions? Do you think someone would be falsely voted in?

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10...aud-questions/

[katyk]

As some of you may know, ACORN is responsible for some heavy duty voter fraud. Just throwing out that it backs Obama and Obama has deep connections to this group. I only threw that out there since I know that had it been reversed this would have already been discussed on here, and also McCain/Palin would have most certainly been brought up. Anyhoo, I am about sick of this election but I do wonder are any of you concerned about this issue? Do you think it will hold up the elections and the decisions? Do you think someone would be falsely voted in?

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10...aud-questions/

Well, even if there's some dead people registered to vote by some over-zealous ACORN volunteer, they still can't vote. The zombies of these people aren't going to pop up out of the ground to go to be voting booth. As far as I know, even liberals like myself were appalled to hear that because it's highly unethical, but we can hardly blame Obama. Do you blame McCain for people who post fliers or send out e-mails spewing lies about voter rights? I don't blame McCain for that and I don't think you do. Same thing.

Also, I love how people demonize ACORN during every election, not just this one, when they are a wonderful non-profit who lobbies on behalf of the voiceless in this country - the poor. Those poor who can't hire lobbyists themselves. These are the people who lobby for minimum wage to be increased, more affordable housing, etc. That benefits all of us.

Speaking of someone being falsely voted in...I am worried about that, but not because of ACORN. All I have to do is flash back to the 2000 election for that fear to kick in. There are much more pressing issues than a volunteer community group right now. Much more powerful people to be afraid of.

[polis]

Well, even if there's some dead people registered to vote by some over-zealous ACORN volunteer, they still can't vote. The zombies of these people aren't going to pop up out of the ground to go to be voting booth. As far as I know, even liberals like myself were appalled to hear that because it's highly unethical, but we can hardly blame Obama. Do you blame McCain for people who post fliers or send out e-mails spewing lies about voter rights? I don't blame McCain for that and I don't think you do. Same thing.

Also, I love how people demonize ACORN during every election, not just this one, when they are a wonderful non-profit who lobbies on behalf of the voiceless in this country - the poor. Those poor who can't hire lobbyists themselves. These are the people who lobby for minimum wage to be increased, more affordable housing, etc. That benefits all of us.

Speaking of someone being falsely voted in...I am worried about that, but not because of ACORN. All I have to do is flash back to the 2000 election for that fear to kick in. There are much more pressing issues than a volunteer community group right now. Much more powerful people to be afraid of.

I heard there were democrats looking into studying black magic...so I wouldn't be surprised if I saw zombies at the polls soon (just kidding).
I appreciate ACORN and I don't believe an organization like that should lose it's credibility over what a few wrong employees did. ACORN is really big down here, and I can assure you this county isn't democrat because of them messing with the elections.

I can recall a time in Florida, where something worse than registering deceased voters happened..... did you forget?

[WryBread]

Yeah, it bothers me. It bothers me that Obama doesn't seem to have a clue who he associates with. He seems to float through life with his thumb in his mouth planning his next reflective speech.

It bothers me that ACORN got money to do voter registration drives and seems to have done so little supervision of its employees/volunteers that thousands of false registrations have been turned in, wasting the time of the people who have to verify them or toss them out.

It bothers me that illegal aliens are registered to vote and vote in elections now according to some reports.

Yeah, it all bothers me.

And I'm not a big McCain supporter. I don't think either one of these men will be a good president. I'm voting for the most likely one-termer.

[katyk]

Yeah, it bothers me. It bothers me that Obama doesn't seem to have a clue who he associates with. He seems to float through life with his thumb in his mouth planning his next reflective speech.

Wait...and you're not worried about who Palin and McCain's past associations were? The Keating 5 scandal doesn't bother you? Palin's associations with a secessionist in Alaska doesn't bother you? If we're gonna play the association game, then McCain has 26 years of bad associations we can sift through.

[Castille]

As some of you may know, ACORN is responsible for some heavy duty voter fraud. Just throwing out that it backs Obama and Obama has deep connections to this group. I only threw that out there since I know that had it been reversed this would have already been discussed on here, and also McCain/Palin would have most certainly been brought up. Anyhoo, I am about sick of this election but I do wonder are any of you concerned about this issue? Do you think it will hold up the elections and the decisions? Do you think someone would be falsely voted in?

What I know is that Acorn is an almost 40yr old community organizing group that has been more successful than any other in mobilizing low income communities to fight for issues important to them. I know, how hugely radical it all is, politically organizing poor people. But it has made them some enemies in business and the right wing who have made a campaign out of harassing them on voter fraud issues. That prosecuter Iglesias was fired for not finding sufficient evidence to persue Acorn. I haven't seen anything that persuades me that false registrations are any more than the activities of individuals breaking the rules, or that they have, or been designed to, affect the outcome of an election or resulting in illegal voting.

Now Acorn has it's legitimate scandals (that embezzlement comes to mind,) like most big organizations, and I think they go out of their way to try to distance themselves from them. But I'm supportive of their larger mission. Poor people get a voice too, ya know? And if that makes their oraganization too democratic leaning in nature, maybe Republicans need to review the elitist nature of their own positions. Saying Obama has deep connections to them I think is a great exaggeration too. He was their lawyer in the early 90's on a case in which they were on the plantiff side along with the Justice Department. He did some unpaid leadership training sessions for them, which doesn't seem bizarre given that Obama worked as a community organizer and what Acorn does is... organize communities. More recently his campaign paid money to an affiliate of Acorn, some of which went to Acorn for get-out-the-vote efforts. So while there is a connection, I'd characterize it as neither insidious or deep.

Now I don't agree with Acorn on all the issues they work for, but damned if I care hearing the right wing talking points thrown out there as if we all accept them as truth.

[Optimus_Rhyme]

within any large group you'll find corruption or at the very least twisted ideas of good intentions that make people's common sense go away.

Its unfair to judge an entire national organization by the acts of a small handful of people. Yes its pro

Voter fraud goes both ways. You look back in 2004 and all the accounts of GOP backed fear tactics in lower income communities that were heavily democratic....putting legal voters on convicted felon lists so that they would be denied and so on. This happens every election.

Its unfair to say that Obama's campaign is behind this. That is some straight up Faux News (fair and balanced lies) conspiracy theory stuff that has no real evidence behind it.

[WryBread]

Wait...and you're not worried about who Palin and McCain's past associations were? The Keating 5 scandal doesn't bother you? Palin's associations with a secessionist in Alaska doesn't bother you? If we're gonna play the association game, then McCain has 26 years of bad associations we can sift through.

Read my post and you'll see that I said I am not happy with either ticket and am voting for the one-term president. The question was about ACORN and Obama.

Yeah, it bothers me more that Obama always seems so darned SURPRISED that he has been associating with shady people. It gets old.

And it bothers me that first he claimed he never heard "Rev." Wright say black theology, then admits he heard but can never disassociate himself with him, then he repudiates him.

Obama was 8 years old when Ayers was a bomber. But he wasn't 8 when he met Ayers and I am to believe that no one EVER told Obama about Ayers' history? That suddenly it all broke in upon Obama?

Yeah, it bothers me. I wonder if he has the character to penetrate the facades that people present. His jetting around the world proving he can manage to shake hands with foreign heads of state is not really all that impressive.

But if he's more likely to be a one-term president than McCain, then he gets my vote. We got well and truly screwed in these election tickets -- just when we needed a heroine or hero, we get these two. The best thing to do is get through one term and move on.

[Pete Bondurant]

The Keating 5 scandal doesn't bother you?

Perhaps it would bother me if John McCain were actually implicated in some wrong-doing. Of course, he was not, and no credible individual has ever proven otherwise.

Palin's associations with a secessionist in Alaska doesn't bother you?

Virtually everyone in Alaska knows someone at least loosely associated with such a group or view (secession). It is a common opinion in the state. It is comparable with living in California and knowing a transvestite.

If we're gonna play the association game, then McCain has 26 years of bad associations we can sift through

John McCain's "bad associations" are not proud of having been involved in bombings of the Pentagon and the U.S. Capitol building (Bill Ayers). John McCain's "bad associations" never screamed "GOD DAMN AMERICA!" from the top of their lungs in the pulpit.

[Castille]

Virtually everyone in Alaska knows someone at least loosely associated with such a group or view (secession). It is a common opinion in the state. It is comparable with living in California and knowing a transvestite.

She didn't know "someone," she *was* loosely associated with such a group. And while it may not be a radical viewpoint for an Alaskan - in Alaska, it's an intolerable position for someone serving entire nation in the Federal gov't.

[Pete Bondurant]

radical viewpoint for an Alaskan - in Alaska, it's an intolerable position for someone serving entire nation in the Federal gov't.

This is far less disturbing than being associated with an unrepentant terrorist who is, to this day, proud of having been involved in the bombing of the Pentagon.

[housemom1952]

Hi! I thought you would be interested in this petition from Concerned American Voter

http://www.rallycongress.com/constit...fication/1244/

[celtic friend]

I believe another Pro Obama group was/is going around to the homeless shelters and driving these people to the registration and in some states they are allowed to vote immediately. I know some were upset saying that, that makes the system prone to voter fraud.
I think that is a little dangerous because those people can be easily manipulated into voting a certain way for a couple of dollars. That to me is shady.

ACORN helps people who can't afford to buy houses buy houses, you don't think they are a part of the current crisis?

Also, aside from Fox News, the media is so slanted LEFT it is sickening. I mean who can deny that??

[brokenandtwisted]

Here's an exciting bit on the mentally disabled...

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjxzmaXAg9E"]YouTube - The McCain-Palin Mob[/ame]

[Gilbrit]

But in recent weeks, officials in at least 15 states have raised concerns about Acorn’s work. In Florida it was reported that “Mickey Mouse” had tried to register to vote through Acorn while in Ohio — another swing state — a teenager registered 73 times when offered cash and cigarettes by an Acorn canvasser.

On Monday at an elections board meeting in Cuyahoga County, Ohio — a crucial county in what could be the most finely-balanced swing state — two men gave testimony about Acorn’s methods.

Freddie Johnson, 19, admitted signing 73 registration cards in return for dollar bills and cigarettes given by Acorn workers who said they needed signatures to keep their jobs. “They’d come up with a sob story why they needed the signature,” he said. Acorn has acknowledged that workers paid by the hour were required to fill quotas. Christopher Barkley, a 33-year-old homeless man, said Acorn workers pestered him for signatures when they came upon him reading a book in a Cleveland city square. He said he signed some of the 13 registration cards that bore his name with his mother’s house or workplace as the address.

In Florida, a “Mickey Mouse” was among 152,000 prospective new voters. The registration form bore an Acorn stamp but the group said it did not think the application had passed through its system.

Acorn voter registration fraud

Just so you know, I am a registered Libitarian.

[katyk]

Look -- ACORN is a liberal organization. They fight for causes that typically liberals care about. They don't just stump/support Obama, they do this in every election, from civic and up, in all major cities. I volunteered for ACORN a few years ago during an Albuquerque mayoral race. I didn't register voters, thankfully because the work sucks, but I worked a booth at a living wage benefit just talking to people.

Here's what I saw and I am sure everyone can agree. Some of the people willing to sign up to get paid $8/hour to register voters are the same people who work drive through at McDonalds for a week until management sees on a security camera that he spit in someone's diet lipton iced tea. ACORN, as an organization that fights for better wages and jobs for these same "unskilled" people, have a hard time turning down these people who come looking for work. They also don't call references, usually. Most people don't have references anyway. And they have a hard time finding anyone willing to do that work. I was asked and told them hell to the no.

So some of these people (some, not all by any means) want to get their money and go home. For the most part, they don't even show up the next day. To meet their quota, they might open up a phone book or list the Dallas Cowboys, then turn in their sheets, get their $40, and leave. Obviously, these errors are caught when they enter information into the system.

Is this a problem? Of course. It's a problem during every single election in this country for all voter registration drives, not just ACORN's. As long as the errors are caught and corrected before people show up to the polls to vote and can't or whatever, then it shouldn't be a huge issue like the press (even the liberal media) is making it out to be. Democrats and Republicans alike can agree that this is a problem. But for some reason, it's become Obama's fault? I mean, really?

He's had some ties with ACORN, but you might be interested to know that so has John McCain.

A goldfish's lifetime ago, Sen. John McCain was happy to accept the honors and acclamation of the Service Employees International Union, People for the American Way, UNITE HERE -- and ACORN. Here he is, on Feb. 20, 2006, telling immigration rights activists at a rally in Miami that they "are what makes America special." ACORN co-sponsored the rally, and its volunteers surround McCain, and while there's no evidence that McCain ever formally teamed with the group, the video serves as a reminder that he did not mind being associated with them when the politics of the moment were different.

Like I said before, this association game is long and tiresome and more importantly, irrelevant, unless it comes out that he plays golf with the Bin Ladens. Oh wait, that's Bush. My bad. It's one reason McCain's campaign is faultering. When will he talk about the real stuff we care about? We can spend literally days and weeks going over everyone Obama and McCain have associated with and questioned their motives and morals. I've known some pretty shady ass people in my day, but I'm a good person. I would hope if I ever ran for any office (ha!) people wouldn't meet my old childhood friend who ran over mailboxes for fun and knifed a mail man when he confronted her. He's a federal worker, so she's a terrorist, too.

[Gilbrit]

But for some reason, it's become Obama's fault? I mean, really?

I did not mention Obama. This thread is about ACORN.

Like I said before, this association game is long and tiresome and more importantly, irrelevant, unless it comes out that he plays golf with the Bin Ladens. Oh wait, that's Bush. My bad. It's one reason McCain's campaign is faultering. When will he talk about the real stuff we care about? We can spend literally days and weeks going over everyone Obama and McCain have associated with and questioned their motives and morals. I've known some pretty shady ass people in my day, but I'm a good person. I would hope if I ever ran for any office (ha!) people wouldn't meet my old childhood friend who ran over mailboxes for fun and knifed a mail man when he confronted her. He's a federal worker, so she's a terrorist, too.

How does this tie into ACORN and voter fraud?

[katyk]

Gilbrit, I wasn't addressing you. I was addressing the thread in general and in Celtic's first post:

Just throwing out that it backs Obama and Obama has deep connections to this group

Also -- I don't think it's too far out in left field for me to bring that up since every GOP site is blaming liberals and specifically those who support Obama for letting something like this happen.

If you look back, I addressed the voter fraud aspect of this not only in this post, but in the previous post of mine. So I am not ignoring that issue. Am I on Mars? Has Obama's association with ACORN, in light of this recent voter fraud not been pounded into our heads by the media and McCain's campaign every day?? Why are my comments suddenly innapropriate and off-topic? I'm not here stirring shit, I'm just giving my opinions on the whole subject. Sorry.

[Gilbrit]

Why are my comments suddenly innapropriate and off-topic? I'm not here stirring shit, I'm just giving my opinions on the whole subject. Sorry.

I did not say nor insinuate you were off topic.
I simply asked for the revelance to ACORN registration fraud, to the quote below.

Like I said before, this association game is long and tiresome and more importantly, irrelevant, unless it comes out that he plays golf with the Bin Ladens. Oh wait, that's Bush. My bad. It's one reason McCain's campaign is faultering. When will he talk about the real stuff we care about? We can spend literally days and weeks going over everyone Obama and McCain have associated with and questioned their motives and morals. I've known some pretty shady ass people in my day, but I'm a good person. I would hope if I ever ran for any office (ha!) people wouldn't meet my old childhood friend who ran over mailboxes for fun and knifed a mail man when he confronted her. He's a federal worker, so she's a terrorist, too.

Were you venting?
Yes?
Okay.

[katyk]

It's relevant because of the associations between Obama and other people that seems to to be the hot topic of the week -- including his association with ACORN. No venting going on here. I'm as cool as a clam. Or, err, cucumber.

[Optimus_Rhyme]

There has been no voter fraud. No votes have been cast. This is nothing more than a small isolated incident that has turned into a fox news propaganda tactic and a GOP distraction talking point. Even the Republican Governor of Florida publicly said that this whole ACORN voter fraud issue is blow out of proportion and is not really an issue.

It is highly doubtful that people will show up claiming to be homer simpson, bruce wayne or the entire offensive line of the Dallas Cowboys on election day and try to cast ballots.

I believe the explanation that was given, a bunch of low paid freelance employees were worried they wouldn't get paid if they didn't meet a quota and they just filled out some forms so they could get their very small paycheck.

People who are trying to tie this to Obama are just looking for a cheap side show because they know McCain is losing on the issues.