US Army SGT kills 16 in Afghanistan, mostly women and children.

[DamagedGoods]

Not sure if this should go here or Reality Bites, but for now. http://www.nypost.com/p/news/interna...GFQky37rJlXJ/1

Moving from house to house, a U.S. Army sergeant opened fire Sunday on Afghan villagers as they slept, killing 16 people — mostly women and children — in an attack that reignited fury at the U.S. presence following a wave of deadly protests over Americans burning Korans.

The attack threatened the deepest breach yet in U.S.-Afghan relations, raising questions both in Washington and Kabul about why American troops are still fighting in Afghanistan after 10 years of conflict and the killing of Osama bin Laden.
[...]

According to U.S. and Afghan officials, Sunday's attack began around 3 a.m. in two villages in Panjwai district, a rural region outside Kandahar that is the cradle of the Taliban and where coalition forces have fought for control for years. The villages are about 500 yards from a U.S. base in a region that was the focus of Obama's military surge strategy in the south starting in 2009.

Villagers described cowering in fear as gunshots rang out as a soldier roamed from house to house firing on those inside. They said he entered three homes in all and set fire to some of the bodies. Eleven of the dead were from a single family, and nine of the victims were children.

There are local claims that it was more than one soldier as one could not have done this much damage, but I'm not so sure I'd say he couldn't. Especially in the middle of the night and with people not about to fight back or even know they were in danger.

Either way he has done a grave dishonour and disservice to his country, his duty and the people he killed. I'm also certain he's effectively sentenced his fellow soldiers to deaths they might otherwise not have faced, and has struck an indirect blow against his own side.

[malq]

I do not know the reasons for this guys actions yet. Lets say they were completely unjustified. It illustrated the need to pull out of Afghanistan and Iraq. Lets get out of their countries and get back to fixing our own. they have done nothing for us, but give us a position closer to the oil. I am not an oil conspiracy guy, It simply true. The original idea of going into iraq kicking ass and getting out was lost.

That said, This guy came from Lewis McChord base in Washington. It has swelled to the size of a small city after 911. There are bound to be some rejects from the factory. If anyone wonders why we are in dept, take a look at what it costs to operate these mills. Each solder costs over 1 million dollars to get on the battlefield. One guy or a few incidents is not indicative of a mass failure. That has allready happened and is a symptom of the wars sickness and need to get back to the US. Can't we see that?
in an election year we will not be able to do anything about it. How sad.

[DamagedGoods]

I do not know the reasons for this guys actions yet. Lets say they were completely unjustified. It illustrated the need to pull out of Afghanistan and Iraq. Lets get out of their countries and get back to fixing our own. they have done nothing for us, but give us a position closer to the oil. I am not an oil conspiracy guy, It simply true. The original idea of going into iraq kicking ass and getting out was lost.

That said, This guy came from Lewis McChord base in Washington. It has swelled to the size of a small city after 911. There are bound to be some rejects from the factory. If anyone wonders why we are in dept, take a look at what it costs to operate these mills. Each solder costs over 1 million dollars to get on the battlefield. One guy or a few incidents is not indicative of a mass failure. That has allready happened and is a symptom of the wars sickness and need to get back to the US. Can't we see that?
in an election year we will not be able to do anything about it. How sad.

I agree on all counts...

Now, the way the military handles him and this incident is what should reflect on the forces as a whole. The larger the group of people, the more likely there are sociopathic douchebags in it, and there are a HELL of a lot of soldiers, it goes without saying that some of them will be capable of and willing to commit atrocities. Leaving the emotional side out of it, (as I prefer to do in scenarios like this) people like this put everyone on their own side at further risk, and do nothing to advance it. They are a detriment and should be dealt with accordingly.

Of course, no matter how they handle it, there will be a bunch of people claiming they did the worst thing they could possible do.

[JGo555]

Sounds to me like a psychopath or someone that went all PTSD bezerk or a psychotic break... I hope that is the case & not the dude being a psychopath/serial killer in Army disguise.

We all have our crazies, this one slipped through the grids & managed to get a few guns.

[LeaveMeBe]

I hesitated to say this, but my son is stationed at Lewis McCord and is set to deploy at the end of the month to this very area. After hearing this on the radio this morning, my hair stood on end. For every story that makes it into the media, there are 3 (or more) that don't. I worry every day about him being sent over, and my worry is equal, if you get my drift. My son is a wonderful young man with an amazing sense of honor and integrity (wish I could say I'm biased because I am his mom, but that's a general consensus from all who know him) and I don't worry about his moral compass (frighteningly enough he'll stick to those values no matter the cost) but I worry about those around him. There are sickos everywhere and sometimes you don't have to look further than your own backyard.

[DamagedGoods]

I hesitated to say this, but my son is stationed at Lewis McChord and is set to deploy at the end of the month to this very area. After hearing this on the radio this morning, my hair stood on end. For every story that makes it into the media, there are 3 (or more) that don't. I worry every day about him being sent over, and my worry is equal, if you get my drift. My son is a wonderful young man with an amazing sense of honor and integrity (wish I could say I'm biased because I am his mom, but that's a general consensus from all who know him) and I don't worry about his moral compass (frighteningly enough he'll stick to those values no matter the cost) but I worry about those around him. There are sickos everywhere and sometimes you don't have to look further than your own backyard.

Why hesitate?

[TheMorningStar]

Did Obama apologize yet?

[malq]

I hesitated to say this, but my son is staioned at Lewis McChord and is set to deploy at the end of the month to this very area. After hearing this on the radio this morning, my hair stood on end. For every story that makes it into the media, there are 3 (or more) that don't. I worry every day about him being sent over, and my worry is equal, if you get my drift. My son is a wonderful young man with an amazing sense of honor and integrity (wish I could say I'm biased because I am his mom, but that's a general consensus from all who know him) and I don't worry about his moral compass (frighteningly enough he'll stick to those values no matter the cost) but I worry about those around him. There are sickos everywhere and sometimes you don't have to look further than your own backyard.

Your son should be fine. He has a better chance of surviving a tour in Iraq than walking through Central Park This person and event is a very small % of the big picture. It just gets great press because the time is ripe to get out. This war is nothing compared to Vietnam. what this guy did was done on a daily basis for a decade. We would fly over the villages and jungles firebombing everyone we could. People were shot on site. This war is tame and benign compared to all other wars we have had.


civil war

At least 618,000 Americans died in the Civil War, and some experts say the toll reached 700,000.

http://www.civilwarhome.com/casualties.htm

More soldiers committed suicide in 2010 than were killed in combat(which wasn't much compared to other wars.

For the second year in a row, more American soldiers—both enlisted men and women and veterans—committed suicide than were killed in the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Excluding accidents and illness, 462 soldiers died in combat, while 468 committed suicide. A difference of six isn't vast by any means, but the symbolism is significant and troubling. In 2009, there were 381 suicides by military personnel, a number that also exceeded the number of combat deaths.

http://www.good.is/post/more-us-sold...ombat-in-2010/

[Pete Bondurant]

This incident does not surprise me at all. What is odd is that such things do not occur more often. The United States has been in Afghanistan for a decade now and there is absolutely no improvement therein. This war has been lost.

[malq]

This incident does not surprise me at all. What is odd is that such things do not occur more often. The United States has been in Afghanistan for a decade now and there is absolutely no improvement therein. This war has been lost.

Right!
Compared to Vietnam, this war is lukewarm daycare under a microscope. One shootout and our whole military is tarnished. We care way too much what the enemy thinks for someone who is at war with them. When did war become a PC, feelgood event where there are fucking rules? There are no rules as long as you are trying to achieve something. What that is, is long gone.

[Akelda]

and I just heard on tv that the taliban is threatening to behead Americans. Big surprise there. We should get the hell out of there and start trying to work on our problems at home, imo. As for wars having rules... I think there was more of a code of ethics and stuff way back in ww1 and ww2,..but times are very different. If we keep trying to be polite and ethical in our wars around the world, we're just going to look even more laughable. Armies have to fight to win. If the enemy fights dirty, then we have to fight dirtier. They certainly are not considering whether or not our 'president' apologizes for those actions. They aim to kill any American they see. (btw, my opinions don't really have anything to do with this soldier who went nuts, I'm just saying that if we keep trying to apologize and take a higher ground,.we'll just keep dying faster).

[Akelda]

Just look up "bacha bazi". We're not the only sick minded savages, but I suppose that would depend on ones definition of "savage".

[Cape Town Girl]

War is not a pretty thing, it doesnt matter which nation is fighting it.

I am suprised these kinds of breakdowns are not more frequent given how long they have been there. The body and brain can sometimes only handle so much stress.

[Dakota Valkyrie]

War is not a pretty thing, it doesnt matter which nation is fighting it.

I am suprised these kinds of breakdowns are not more frequent given how long they have been there. The body and brain can sometimes only handle so much stress.

I agree... but this guy was trained as a sniper. "Stress" kind of goes with the job and is hard to avoid.

He seems to have undergone frequent mental evaluations (according to reports). I wonder if something was missed during one of those, if something was missed by his fellow soldiers while in theater, or if no one saw it coming and the guy just out-n-out snapped.

[Cape Town Girl]

Hmm you could find the powers that be knew something was "not quite right" but looked the other way as they need experienced soldiers out there. Although we will probably never find someone who will admit to that.

I just dont get all the bad press about a few (given the length of the war) US soldiers action's and yes they are terrible actions but this is war we cant apply our reality to the situation.

[Dakota Valkyrie]

I just dont get all the bad press about a few (given the length of the war) US soldiers action's and yes they are terrible actions but this is war we cant apply our reality to the situation.

What this soldier did is a crime - in war or peace. What he did is against MILITARY rules at ANY time. He created a danger for all of our soldiers. "This is war" is NO excuse. He endangered not only the mission but the lives of thousands of other soldiers.

If we waged war that way, we may as well put signup sheets outside the local bar and ship any one who wanted over to play shoot 'em up at willy nilly targets.

[Cape Town Girl]

I hear you, I really do however I come from a country where we might have paid lip service to the rules but we broke them all.

LOL at the sign up sheets, here in SA our boys were automatically drafted for two years straight out of school NO exceptions unless you were crazy then you spent your 2 years in an institution. If our government didnt have the constant supply of "fresh meat" joining the forces they probably would have put sign up sheets outside the local bar, no problems with that at all :)

[princessgrandma]

With 4 tours in 10 years, I'd not be surprised at all at whatever the final diagnosis is. PTSD is something dealt with in some way by every single soldier who has to go into a situation so horrible that you couldn't even imagine it in your nightmares.

I'd never justify something like this, killing anyone, much less women and children in the middle of the night. I'm sure at one time, he was an excellent soldier, qualified for what he was trained to do. Unfortunately, killing is a part of that. Not indiscriminately, but he's trained to kill anyway. It doesn't make him worth less as a person. It's all so sad. I want to see him punished to the fullest extent, but I'd like to see that he got help b/c he's definitely got some serious mental and emotional problems, among other things. All the families, including his, are going to deal with some serious pain and loss.

[malq]

I agree... but this guy was trained as a sniper. "Stress" kind of goes with the job and is hard to avoid.

He seems to have undergone frequent mental evaluations (according to reports). I wonder if something was missed during one of those, if something was missed by his fellow soldiers while in theater, or if no one saw it coming and the guy just out-n-out snapped.

Just because you have a mental condition does not mean you have a low IQ. ANYONE with any intelligence at all will tell people what they want to hear when being evaluated, especially if there is personal gain. I think they are pretty worthless myself.