Term limits for Congress

[TACO]

We have term limits for the President. WHY don't we have term Limits for congress? I think we need them! I propose the following:
1.) House of Representative - 3 terms
a.) Terms would still be for a 2 year term
b.) No retirement like they have now & they would pay in to the Social Security System like we do.

2.) Senate - 2 terms
a.) Terms would go from 6 years to a 4 year term.
b.) No retirement like they have now & they would pay in to the Social Security System like we do.

It has always been my opinion, that the founding fathers never intended to have people serve decades in congress. They intended for we the people to serve & go home. That way there would always be fresh ideas instead of all the old/tired ones like we have now.
Either we do something or we still have career politicians. Here is an example of what we need to get rid of. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ity_of_service

[Pete Bondurant]

Term limits will mean inexperienced legislators and more power for lobbyists.

[brokenandtwisted]

Term limits will mean inexperienced legislators and more power for lobbyists.

I agree with Pete...a revolving door in the Senate can potentially be disastrous. Radical changes would have to be introduced to implement such a system.

American politics is just a lucrative business. Would you want business management changing every year?

[TACO]

Term limits will mean inexperienced legislators and more power for lobbyists.

Pete the fact of the matter is we DO have lobbyist writing legislation right NOW. The new healthcare bill for example was written by lobbyist with a socialist agenda.

I am sick & tired of career politicians! Say what you will but the system is screwed & needs to be changed. I rather have down to earth American citizen than an out of touch politicians!

[brokenandtwisted]

Down-to-Earth citizens do not have the political acumen required to write legislation. That's their hamartia.

[TACO]

Down-to-Earth citizens do not have the political acumen required to write legislation. That's their hamartia.

In plain old english being flawed is not beholding to just the "Down to earth Citizens". Career politicians are SEVERELY FLAWED in my book too.

And I disagree we the people can write laws. Like I stated in an earlier post, legislation is being written by lobbyist right now, while the career politicians are in. So, lets put the average citizen in office. We the people can not screw up worse than what we have now!

[brokenandtwisted]

In plain old english being flawed is not beholding to just the "Down to earth Citizens". Career politicians are SEVERELY FLAWED in my book too.

And I disagree we the people can write laws. Like I stated in an earlier post, legislation is being written by lobbyist right now, while the career politicians are in. So, lets put the average citizen in office. We the people can not screw up worse than what we have now!

Catch-22 is, the average citizen does not have an Ivy League law degree, public policy degree, international relations degree, political science degree, business degree, economics degree or anything else equally lovely. You need to have the educated class running a country. I can rag on Republican leaders all I want...but they're undeniably intelligent people and they know what they're doing. I wouldn't for the life of me want Bob Lewis, a high-school dropout from Mississippi working cotton farms running the world's most powerful country.

The problem with America is quite simple and changes to Senate cannot fix it. For decades the country has focused on international issues, being the diplomatic peace-dogs yet simultaneously being bloodhounds. It neglected its domestic issues such as education, health care (both are complete and utter shit in America) and illegal immigration (another disaster). America is struggling with these issues on the brink of economic collapse while other nations rapidly rise to power.

Nothing can be done to fix it. The ship is sinking and the rats are bailing, bud. Live and let die.

[TACO]

Catch-22 is, the average citizen does not have an Ivy League law degree, public policy degree, international relations degree, political science degree, business degree, economics degree or anything else equally lovely. You need to have the educated class running a country. I can rag on Republican leaders all I want...but they're undeniably intelligent people and they know what they're doing. I wouldn't for the life of me want Bob Lewis, a high-school dropout from Mississippi working cotton farms running the world's most powerful country.

The problem with America is quite simple and changes to Senate cannot fix it. For decades the country has focused on international issues, being the diplomatic peace-dogs yet simultaneously being bloodhounds. It neglected its domestic issues such as education, health care (both are complete and utter shit in America) and illegal immigration (another disaster). America is struggling with these issues on the brink of economic collapse while other nations rapidly rise to power.

Nothing can be done to fix it. The ship is sinking and the rats are bailing, bud. Live and let die.

B & T, I agree we need to have people with common sense. Where I disagree is where you need a Ivy League education or have a degree to be a politician. Most of our founding fathers did not have a degree and they wrote one of the best, if the not the best constitution evern. A college degree does not give you common sense. Take for example Vice President Joe Biden he is college educated, but he is as dumb as a box of rocks, he is a big fucking deal <sarcasm>. Another thing how do you get knowledge, you get it from experience. All the great diplomats were newbies at one time & made mistakes. So, I say once again lets give the people a try.

B & T, I am an idealist I guess & hard headed. I believe (to a fault) that we the people can make a difference! Just read my signature.

[Habeas corpus]

Catch-22 is, the average citizen does not have an Ivy League law degree, public policy degree, international relations degree, political science degree, business degree, economics degree or anything else equally lovely. You need to have the educated class running a country. I can rag on Republican leaders all I want...but they're undeniably intelligent people and they know what they're doing. I wouldn't for the life of me want Bob Lewis, a high-school dropout from Mississippi working cotton farms running the world's most powerful country.

The problem with America is quite simple and changes to Senate cannot fix it. For decades the country has focused on international issues, being the diplomatic peace-dogs yet simultaneously being bloodhounds. It neglected its domestic issues such as education, health care (both are complete and utter shit in America) and illegal immigration (another disaster). America is struggling with these issues on the brink of economic collapse while other nations rapidly rise to power.

Nothing can be done to fix it. The ship is sinking and the rats are bailing, bud. Live and let die.

Those who are and have run our country over many years, majority of them have an Ivy League education. Look at where we are now, our country is a mess and its due to alot of these highly educated people. My boss who is a high court Judge, his Law Clerk had an impressive Ivy League education and he was the biggest do nothing he has ever come across and was glad to see him go. There should be education under that persons belt when he/she enters the political arena but it doesn't have to be an Ivy League education.

Christina Romer our current departing chief economistis is a really good example of a highly educated woman from Berkeley, she still can't grasp that spending more money to get the economy going is not working. Some of these highly educated people have such an ego they just refuse to admit they are wrong, well her leaving the WH is a sure sign she was wrong, wrong, wrong.

I agree that international issues our country has focused on for so long has really done a number on us such as alot of our jobs have and still are shipped overseas. America has always been the country to worry about other countries and doing whatever to help out and we really need to start paying attention to the problems here and focus on our own country for a change, we need to be a bit selfish.

As far as term limits, I think it needs a bit of a makeover, change and risks don't always turn out to be bad.

[Athena]

Some of these highly educated people have such an ego they just refuse to admit they are wrong...

In my experience, that's a problem even more prevalent among the not so highly educated. Ego exists at all levels...

[cubby]

Thank you B&T, I have learned a new word today.

Hamartia, noun, tragic flaw.

it fits nicely.

[brokenandtwisted]

Thank you B&T, I have learned a new word today.

Hamartia, noun, tragic flaw.

it fits nicely.

Pffft. Learn some more Greek loanwords, noob!

[brokenandtwisted]

Oh I definitely agree there are idiots running amok in American politics (Obama, as an example...a bright man yet totally disillusioned)...but they have an understanding of what is required to run a country. When you rip away that fundamental principle, you face total collapse. How would a standard citizen effectively communicate with foreign dignitaries? Does anyone have advanced knowledge of international law outside of those who've studied it? I sure as Hell don't...and I am pretty fucking smart if I may say-so myself.

America is a plutocracy (or, rather, a plutarchy)...the best way to abolish that is amend the First Amendment to edit the right to petition to make lobbying illegal.

[TACO]

Oh I definitely agree there are idiots running amok in American politics (Obama, as an example...a bright man yet totally disillusioned)...but they have an understanding of what is required to run a country. When you rip away that fundamental principle, you face total collapse. How would a standard citizen effectively communicate with foreign dignitaries? Does anyone have advanced knowledge of international law outside of those who've studied it? I sure as Hell don't...and I am pretty fucking smart if I may say-so myself.

America is a plutocracy (or, rather, a plutarchy)...the best way to abolish that is amend the First Amendment to edit the right to petition to make lobbying illegal.

I think Obama is over his head. JMO
How can Obama have any experience, all he was a community organizer for unions & ACORN. Oh wait he lived outside the US, I forgot. That trumps everything <being sarcastic>

Look as a Captain on the boat I deal with different personalities everyday. I have to mend fences between people. I have to watch ow I talked to the pilots on the ships so I do not hurt there feelings. Now I know I am not college educated & yes I am not on an international level but Diplomacy can be learned through experience. B & T, I do not doubt you are book smart. You seem to be very intelligent. But do not take me or anybody to being ignorant for just graduating from high school. It is like Sun Tzu wrote in his book "The Art of War", never under estimate your opponent.

America was never meant to be a plutocracy. It was suppose to be a government for the people by the people. But it was convoluted by a cabal of elitist self serving politicians over the last couple of decades. There is no need to edit the first amendment, we have laws in place. What we need is enforcement & people that would put whats right before party politics.

[brokenandtwisted]

I think Obama is over his head. JMO
How can Obama have any experience, all he was a community organizer for unions & ACORN. Oh wait he lived outside the US, I forgot. That trumps everything <being sarcastic>

Look as a Captain on the boat I deal with different personalities everyday. I have to mend fences between people. I have to watch ow I talked to the pilots on the ships so I do not hurt there feelings. Now I know I am not college educated & yes I am not on an international level but Diplomacy can be learned through experience. B & T, I do not doubt you are book smart. You seem to be very intelligent. But do not take me or anybody to being ignorant for just graduating from high school. It is like Sun Tzu wrote in his book "The Art of War", never under estimate your opponent.

America was never meant to be a plutocracy. It was suppose to be a government for the people by the people. But it was convoluted by a cabal of elitist self serving politicians over the last couple of decades. There is no need to edit the first amendment, we have laws in place. What we need is enforcement & people that would put whats right before party politics.

Sorry, I may have insinuated the educated class as being better people than those whom are not. I do not believe that to be so...I have highly intelligent friends I attended high school with happily in the Canadian Forces as technicians, working as baristas etc. There are many bright people on this very forum that never attended post-secondary education (such as Athena).

I would feel uncomfortable living in a country governed by the uneducated (in their field), just as I would feel uncomfortable having a surgeon perform a cricothyrotomy on me with only one high school science course under their credentials, or flying a plane with no knowledge of aircraft and basic physics. The same can be said for government...if you have no knowledge you cannot properly do whatever you're supposed to be doing. To implement radical changes such as 'down-to-Earth' people running the country, you'd have to start from scratch. Everything.

[TACO]

Sorry, I may have insinuated the educated class as being better people than those whom are not. I do not believe that to be so...I have highly intelligent friends I attended high school with happily in the Canadian Forces as technicians, working as baristas etc. There are many bright people on this very forum that never attended post-secondary education (such as Athena).

I would feel uncomfortable living in a country governed by the uneducated (in their field), just as I would feel uncomfortable having a surgeon perform a cricothyrotomy on me with only one high school science course under their credentials, or flying a plane with no knowledge of aircraft and basic physics. The same can be said for government...if you have no knowledge you cannot properly do whatever you're supposed to be doing. To implement radical changes such as 'down-to-Earth' people running the country, you'd have to start from scratch. Everything.

OK, so what I am not bright? LOL,.....UGH Don't answer that! LMAO

But seriously, I see what you are saying. I agree, I would not just want anyone off the street per se. Where I had disagreed with you is where they would need a degree to hold a spot in the state department or to be a politician.

[Pete Bondurant]

The People.....are morons. The lower the voter turnout is, the better off the nation is. The people take voting in an election about as seriously as a vote for America's Gayest Fat Dancing Bachelor.

[Athena]

The average citizen is too anti-intellectual and bound by "beliefs" to be suitable for office. And we think representatives now are too easily influenced by lobbyists? The average citizen is a broke ho unable to balance his own fucking checkbook. The average citizen carried, on average, $8K in debt GOING INTO the recession (meaning they accumulated it back when things were actually GOOD) and 40% of them spend more than they make every year. I don't want those idiots ANYWHERE NEAR a smooth talking ex-lawyer-turned-lobbyist who promises them all sorts of riches in return for a "small favor". Fuck THAT.

But, seriously, it's the anti-intellectualism that scares me. We got as close as I ever want to get having an "average citizen" acting as representative when we were threatened with Palin, that book-burning, bridge-to-nowhere-championing banshee. She made a mess of her state, then quit because she stood to get more out of a BOOK DEAL. And that was AFTER actively trying to turn "real Americans" against anyone who could speak English properly.

While we're not exactly graced by "philosopher kings" currently, inviting truly average citizens into congress would be swinging way too far in the other direction.

[TACO]

The average citizen is too anti-intellectual and bound by "beliefs" to be suitable for office. And we think representatives now are too easily influenced by lobbyists? The average citizen is a broke ho unable to balance his own fucking checkbook. The average citizen carried, on average, $8K in debt GOING INTO the recession (meaning they accumulated it back when things were actually GOOD) and 40% of them spend more than they make every year. I don't want those idiots ANYWHERE NEAR a smooth talking ex-lawyer-turned-lobbyist who promises them all sorts of riches in return for a "small favor". Fuck THAT.

But, seriously, it's the anti-intellectualism that scares me. We got as close as I ever want to get having an "average citizen" acting as representative when we were threatened with Palin, that book-burning, bridge-to-nowhere-championing banshee. She made a mess of her state, then quit because she stood to get more out of a BOOK DEAL. And that was AFTER actively trying to turn "real Americans" against anyone who could speak English properly.

While we're not exactly graced by "philosopher kings" currently, inviting truly average citizens into congress would be swinging way too far in the other direction.

So you would rather the status quo? Not me, maybe I am naive in thinking that we can do better then we have now, but I do. To say you do not want change is just accepting the screwing we are getting. And if that is the case, that is sad. JMO

To me some things are worth fighting for!

[Athena]

So you would rather the status quo? Not me, maybe I am naive in thinking that we can do better then we have now, but I do. To say you do not want change is just accepting the screwing we are getting. And if that is the case, that is sad. JMO

To me some things are worth fighting for!

The problem is, sometimes the status quo is truly as good as it gets. We can't always attain the ideal.

I entertain ideas as they come, but I don't think term limits is any solution. As people have pointed out, it would only lead to MORE campaigning, among other things.

I'm not condoning the screwing we're getting - I just think the average citizen would screw us even harder.

[Angelinfl]

I believe America is dumbed down. Americans have been enabled and shown that one doesn't have to work for things and the gov't will provide in some manner, shape or form. People know how to work the system and sell drugs on the side or work under the table.

Now ... we need people who would go to Washington and think what is good for America... not is this a Republican or Democratic issue. Stop this party line voting thing.... and think is this best for the good of America.

We need to bring jobs home. Jobs are the whole issue to this economy. More people working, more people paying taxes, less welfare, unemployment, Medicaid, food stamps etc. We need to concentrate on our domestic issues and let the world spin without our aide. We need a job creation program at home where we put people to work fixing our aquaducts, roads, bridges etc.. pay these people a wage.. they in turn will pay taxes and social security etc... and start the wheel spinning again. Make parts here in America. Tax foreign goods so that its more profitable to produce in America.

So people will have to live with less electronics and few items. Maybe things will mean more to people and less is better but life is still good.

Send people who are well read, educated and who can think to political office with term limits. It is such a shame a poor man like Jimmy Stewarts character in Mr. Smith Goes to Washington could never even get there because he wouldn't have the backing of a political party (MONEY) and not enough private money to buy his way to Washington. That is also a shame.

There can be no hidden agenda.

I'm amazed at the wonderful Constitution and the 10 amendments that were written by our forefathers. We are a Republic. We are governed by laws but now the laws are enacted for the benefit of few who benefit. I'm saddened by how our gov't is maintained, run and our very lives.

I believe our quality of life has diminished as far as values, morals and perceptions of society. You may have 3 tv's, 3 cars and lots of credit cards and electronics and stuff from dollar stores but that doesn't make you happier or give you a better family life. I'd rather a strong homefront and stronger families. I'm not liking where society is and where it is heading. This is not the America I ever knew in growing up.

I am sad for America.

[TACO]

BTW Pete do you know my Uncle Kemper Boyd by any chance?

[Pete Bondurant]

BTW Pete do you know my Uncle Kemper Boyd by any chance?

He's been dead for nearly forty-seven years.

[TACO]

He's been dead for nearly forty-seven years.

Sorry for the typo it should have read like this:
BTW Pete did you know my Uncle Kemper Boyd by any chance?

[backlash]

We should make voting more American. There should only be 2 candidates. These 2 candidates have to run the gauntlet of voting that we currently have now. However, there is no final vote. The grand finale is a WWF style cage match, with Rosie O'Donnell as the referee. The winner gets a sweet belt that they get to wear for the entirety of their term in office. I am also willing to accept a hot dog eating contest in lieu of the violence. It's time we Americanized American politics people.

[CPL CHUD]

I apologize off the bat for not taking the time to read all the posts in this thread in case this has already been said, but I feel like diminishing terms only mean more time on the campaign trail trying to secure votes and less time addressing the issues we the people have elected them for. Keeping with the same logic I would like to see the president's term increased as well.

[TACO]

I apologize off the bat for not taking the time to read all the posts in this thread in case this has already been said, but I feel like diminishing terms only mean more time on the campaign trail trying to secure votes and less time addressing the issues we the people have elected them for. Keeping with the same logic I would like to see the president's term increased as well.

What is the difference now? They (House of Representatives) presently serve two years per term in Congress. They are on permanent campaign mode. Thats why term limits would work, they know they have two, two year terms then there gone, maybe just maybe they would concentrate more on doing there job of legislating instead of campaigning.

The presidents term extended? What do you want a dictator? We had 8 years of Bush & we will have 4 years (I hope just 4) of Obama, to me that is quite enough! Bush was in hindsight not a Republican, he was a R.I.N.O. (Republican In Name Only). He started the fiasco of bailing out the banks. Then Obama kept it going, then it was the bloated with pork stimulus bill, & now healthcare. Further into debt we go where it stops nobody knows. We need a fresh start. All the people behind the scenes need to change to. Everyone thinks we elect a new president every 4 years...well we do, but there advisors are all political hacks from previous administrations. We need to take our country back!

Sorry for the rant! <stepping off my soap box>

[Pete Bondurant]

The presidents term extended? What do you want a dictator?

Si....si.

[Hellsbells]

They are all a bunch of crooks

House investigators back Rangel reprimand

According to the specific charges, Rangel allegedly failed to report more than $600,000 on financial disclosure forms, improperly used a rent-subsidized apartment as a campaign office for over a decade and failed to report rental income on both a home in the Dominican Republic and a residence in Manhattan.

An investigative subcommittee report on Rangel's dealings also detailed a lengthy series of meetings the congressman held with business leaders to raise funds for the Charles B. Rangel Center for Public Policy at the City College of New York. His repeated attempts to woo potential donors violated the House's solicitation and gift ban, the report said.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/07/...ex.html?hpt=T2

William Jefferson

William Jefferson, a Democrat who represented parts of New Orleans for nearly 20 years, was convicted in August of taking roughly $500,000 in bribes and seeking millions more in exchange for using his influence to broker business deals in Africa.

The sentence, while severe, was still far less than what prosecutors had sought.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33915800/

Sentences of Other Congressmen Convicted of Crimes
The Associated Press

Since the 1970s, more than a dozen congressmen have been convicted in criminal court. Their cases and sentences include:

- Rep. Andrew J. Hinshaw, R-Calif., spent a year in jail after being convicted in 1976 of accepting bribes when he was county tax assessor. He lost the primary election and resigned at the end of his term.

- Rep. Charles Diggs Jr., D-Mich., was convicted in 1978 of operating a payroll kickback scheme in his congressional office. He served seven months of a three-year prison term. He was re-elected, then resigned in 1980.

- Rep. Michael Myers, D-Pa., served 20 1/2 months of a three-year prison sentence for accepting bribes from FBI agents impersonating Arab businessmen. He was convicted in 1980 and expelled from Congress.

- Four other House members were convicted in the Arab businessmen bribery scandal: Democratic Reps. John Murphy of New York, Frank Thompson of New Jersey, John Jenrette of South Carolina and Raymond Lederer of Pennsylvania. Thompson and Murphy were sentenced to three years; Jenrette, two years; and Lederer, one year.

- Rep. Mario Biaggi, D-N.Y., was convicted in 1988 of extorting nearly $2 million from defense contractor Wedtech Corp. He resigned from Congress and served two years and two months of an eight-year sentence. He was defeated for re-election in 1992.

- Rep. Mel Reynolds, D-Ill., was sentenced in 1995 to five years in prison for having sex with an underage campaign worker. He resigned from Congress, then was sentenced in 1997 to 6 1/2 years for bank fraud and other violations. The second sentence, which was to run at the same time as first, was commuted in 2001 by President Clinton.

- Rep. Walter Tucker III, D-Calif., was sentenced in 1996 to two years and three months in prison for accepting and demanding bribes while mayor of a Los Angeles suburb. He resigned from Congress a week after his 1995 conviction.

- Rep. Dan Rostenkowski, D-Ill., pleaded guilty in 1996 to two felony mail fraud charges, lost re-election and served 15 months in prison. Clinton pardoned him in 2000.

http://www.papillonsartpalace.com/sentencSe.htm

They are just the ones that got caught

[TACO]

I found this article rather interesting. Yes, it is a poll & I do not put too much trust in them. But I found this one pretty interesting, if it is true. Which I think it does have some truth to it.

Finally, an issue both Democrats and Republicans agree on: term limits. Nearly 8 in 10 American voters like the idea of imposing fixed time limits in office for all members of Congress -- including their own senators and representatives.

A Fox News poll released Friday found that 78 percent of voters favor establishing term limits for Congress. That’s nearly five times as many as oppose limiting the number of terms members can serve (16 percent).

Large majorities of Republicans (84 percent), Democrats (74 percent) and independents (74 percent) favor the idea.

The poll also shows 70 percent of voters disapprove of the job Congress is currently doing. That includes most Republicans (84 percent) as well as more than half of Democrats (54 percent), despite the fact that their party controls both houses of Congress. About one voter in five gives Congress a thumbs up (22 percent approve).

This is the link to the rest of the story, if you would like to read it http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010...mits-congress/