Oklahoma: Flying Spaghetti Monster Earns You A Passing Grade

[Athena]

The Oklahoma House of Representatives has passed a bill that says that a student can receive a passing grade in an Earth Science class if they say that the Flying Spaghetti Monster created the Earth an hour ago, and then planted false memories into every single living creature on Earth to make it seem like they’ve been around longer.

Of course, that’s not the intent of the bill. The intent is that a student can say the Earth is 6000 years old and still get a passing grade. The bill itself says that a student cannot be graded down if they say that what they are being taught interferes with their religious beliefs.

Specifically, the bill states:

A school district shall treat a student’s voluntary expression of a religious viewpoint, if any, on an otherwise permissible subject in the same manner the district treats a student’s voluntary expression of a secular or other viewpoint on an otherwise permissible subject and may not discriminate against the student based on a religious viewpoint expressed by the student on an otherwise permissible subject.

It’s the "otherwise permissible subject" phrase that’s sticky. That can easily be interpreted as meaning tests, besides just normal classroom discussion.

For a long time, I have been disquieted by the fact that many people want to give patently ridiculous ideas as much standing as reality. One problem with this is that once you open the door to fantasy, any and all flavors of it can walk on through, as in the example above. But it also elevates fantasy to the same level as reality, and that is simply wrong.

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Fuck. That. Shit. Man.

If you want to subscribe to lunacy, that's your gig. I'm not here to stop your delusional ass. But we're not paying billions annually so that kids can hold onto the same ridiculous dogma they'd be otherwise taught at home. School is for learning. If you want to opt out, that's fine, but you don't receive the fucking credit.

Sometimes I think we should have let the fucking South secede.

Rights don't apply in school like they do everywhere else. We're able to tell kids how to dress and style their hair, what they can be in possession of, how they can dance...I don't think it's too unreasonable to be able to determine reasonable passing criteria. As in, even if you don't *believe* what the teacher told you, at least prove that you're capable of parroting it back. Is that so fucking much to ask???

This is nothing but sick anti-political correctness. Why must we go back and forth like this? Why can't it be like, "Hey, you don't be loony and we won't either. Coo?" "Coo."

It works for me...

[impqueen]

Awesome. Next up? Ceiling Cat explains sex ed.

Sheez.

[Athena]

Oh, no, mama. That's not even "next up". In a state like Oklahoma, if the ceiling cat is saying, "Wait 'til marriage, kiddies", he's the foremost authority on sex-ed.

This is exactly why the government should NOT be directly involved in education. Fund the shit out of it! I'm totally down with every kid who want school being in school, free of charge. But, privatise that shit. Let the people who are good at this stuff take the ball and run with it.

America is falling behind, and it's because we let morality stand in the way of the hard facts.

[CPL CHUD]

America is falling behind, and it's because we let morality stand in the way of the hard facts.

Is it morality to allow children to cite religious passages as scientific proof in class? If anything this is evil. This is bankrupt of moral integrity. Wishful thinking doesn't readily adhere to reality. All this is doing is cultivating witch doctors.

[gprime]

And we wonder why, even with increased spending, we're falling behind in math and science compared to the rest of the world. I mean, these dumb sacks of shit are lowering the collective IQ of this nation. On the plus side, it seems we've got plenty of citizens qualified to be African Health Ministers (since they seem to have no understanding of science either).

[Athena]

Is it morality to allow children to cite religious passages as scientific proof in class?

To many, absolutely. It's how the bill got passed in Oklahoma. To those people, religion and religion alone dictates morality. I can't tell you how many Christians have stared blankly at me with their blinking eyes and slightly cocked head, unable to grasp the fact that I've got a moral compass despite the absence of God in my life.

It's scary. @_@

[Pirelli Jones]

I can't tell you how many Christians have stared blankly at me with their blinking eyes and slightly cocked head, unable to grasp the fact that I've got a moral compass despite the absence of God in my life.

My wife loves to tell the story of how we happened upon a family sedan parked roadside on a rural IL blacktop. A man at the wheel (I think listening to tunes) while a woman and a young daughter (I'd guess 9-10) were witnessed a few hundred yards further down the road actively walking in the direction of town.

We stopped and picked up the woman and child, no activity noted from the sedan. I purchased a small can and filled it with gas and drove them back to their vehicle. I want to say she offered reimbursement but don't honestly recall, I accepted no money.

As we dropped them off she asked where we went to church and my wife said "We don't really go to church" and this was the first time I'd really seen that blank stare you talk about. I thought for a minute she might throw the gas out as tainted, she waved as we drove off but I don't think she comprehended that non-Christians had given her a ride, not only letting her live but providing a small token of friendliness. I wonder how she explained that one to her kid.

Sorry for the tangent but I couldn't contribute usefully to the real topic anything that hasn't been well stated already but I couldn't let that stop me from contributing.

[Athena]

I'm bumpin' this shit...Because it really deserves more outrage.

What's the purpose of public education when it's so easy to undermine?

[Pirelli Jones]

I dunno I go both ways with this, folks should have their beliefs respected. I think its going to make it harder for their kids to get that respect when their peers see them as the "fanatics" that can't believe science can deconstruct some of the works of God.

I was raised by fundamentalist Oklahoma Christians and never had trouble realizing that science can now theorize that God's days (7 actually) are like billions of earth years. I had it out with mom this summer on how she could deny evolution but believe in omnipotence. If a being is omnipotent, it seems like evolution would be a screwdriver in the tool chest. She's like ok, evolution is ok if you believe God did it.

[Athena]

I dunno I go both ways with this, folks should have their beliefs respected. I think its going to make it harder for their kids to get that respect when their peers see them as the "fanatics" that can't believe science can deconstruct some of the works of God.

I think beliefs should be respected to whatever extent we can afford. However, in this case, this organisation's primary responsibility is to provide standardised, factual education. Parents are legally provided means to opt-out of such education for religious reasons. We should not be undermining the curriculum in an attempt to accommodate folks.

When I was in math class, there was often more than one way to solve a problem correctly. However, I was charged with the responsibility to show my work the way the text book would have me solve the problem. I could do it the other way and maybe all my answers would be correct, but I wouldn't receive credit because there was reason behind having all the students do it the same way and in having them fully understand it the way it was taught to them.

If I go to class, it is my responsibility to display my ability to GRASP the curriculum, even if it contradicts with my personal beliefs. Illustrating an understanding of evolution does not need to conflict with ones personal beliefs.

[gprime]

See, I don't think that a person's feelings or beliefs ever need to be respected, especially when the cost is so great. We cannot punish people for having a lack of sense and believing in religion, but we can treat them like morons and make them feel socially outcast for their stupidity. And in the context of school, it does no good to spare feelings at the expense of facts.

[brokenandtwisted]

What the fuck? One's religion should not dictate education. That's blinding on so many levels...so as per example, can a student sit through science classes from K to 12 and say "I can't do this, it is against my religion", do nothing...and still pass?

[Pirelli Jones]

And in the context of school, it does no good to spare feelings at the expense of facts.

History has always been written by the victors, facts be damned.

[brokenandtwisted]

History has always been written by the victors, facts be damned.

True. It'd be awesome to get my hands on a history book from the UK, Germany, Italy, Russia, Japan, USA, France, heck add in Brazil...and contrast and compare the differences between the information provided on World War II...

[Athena]

History has always been written by the victors, facts be damned.

Yes, we are looking at the erosion of an already failed system. But should we simply throw our hands up and allow it to happen because the set up is less than ideal?

[Waldowas]

Oh yes, In FSM We Trust!



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