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Thread: Texas judge allows the mother (Marissa Evans) collection of dead son's sperm

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    Marshal justmeintn's Avatar
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    Texas judge allows the mother (Marissa Evans) collection of dead son's sperm

    AUSTIN, Texas – A judge has granted a mother's request to have someone harvest sperm from her dead son's body, so she can have the option of carrying out his wish to have children.

    Nikolas Colton Evans, 21, died Sunday at a Brackenridge hospital after being punched and falling outside an Austin bar March 27.

    His mother, Marissa Evans, told the Austin American-Statesman newspaper that he wanted to have three sons someday and had even picked out their names: Hunter, Tod and Van.

    "I want him to live on. I want to keep a piece of him," she told the newspaper.

    Travis County Probate Judge Guy Herman ruled Monday in an emergency hearing requested by the mother, because of the urgency of collecting the sperm intact.

    Court documents said the sperm had to be collected within 24 hours of Nikolas Evans being removed from life support unless the body was cooled to no more than 39.2 degrees.

    Herman ordered the county medical examiner's office to continue storing the body at the proper temperature until the sperm could be collected.

    Other organs and tissues were already going to be harvested from Evans' body, the judge noted, and there would be no other remedy for the mother if time expired.

    Evans and her attorneys were trying on Tuesday to find a urologist or other medical professional willing to collect the sperm for a possible surrogate pregnancy in the future.

    University of Texas law professor John Robertson, who specializes in bioethics, said state law gives parents control over a child's body for organ and tissue donations but its use for sperm "is very unclear."

    "There are no strong precedents in favor of a parent being able to request post-mortem sperm retrieval," he said.

    No arrests have been made in the assault on Nikolas Evans. Investigators said Evans hit his head on the ground after he was punched during an argument with a group of men.
    ___

    Information from Austin American-Statesman:

    http://www.statesman.com
    Last edited by Tazzzz; July 20th, 2009 at 04:31 PM. Reason: fixed formating

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    Grand Baron sanityslipping's Avatar
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    Now she just has to find somebody willing to be impregnated with the sperm, work out whatever sort of arrangement, whether she'll play the part of mom, or grandma.

    I understand the grieving mother probably isn't thinking especially clear right now, but I forsee her quest for grandchildren to be very difficult. Don't most woman opting for artificial insemination want the cream of the crop? College degree, sucessful, talented, good looking etc? Killed in a bar fight is not the first choice. Not to talk bad about the deceased, he may have been an angel, but it's just not something women look for in a sperm donor, unless they are getting the penis a long with it.

    Imagine, say she does go the surrogate mother route, and a woman agrees to carry the baby, and then bows out. I can just imagine the "where did I come?" from talk there.

    It's going to be a long road, and I hope whatever the mother does, is the right choice for her, and the little spermies that may be children one day. Hopefully, she will recover to some extent, from this very unexpected loss.
    This planet has - or rather had - a problem, which was this: most of the people living on it were unhappy for pretty much of the time. Many solutions were suggested for this problem, but most of these were largely concerned with the movement of small green pieces of paper, which was odd because on the whole it wasn't the small green pieces of paper that were unhappy.
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    Grand Count DarkPrincess's Avatar
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    This has to be one of the creepiest things I've ever read.

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    Grand Baron Insomniac's Avatar
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    The alarm bells on my creep meter are ringing.
    I remember everything.

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    Great Count ineedanap's Avatar
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    Glad I am not the only one who finds this completely disturbing! It's actually kind of sick.

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    Great Count Mare's Avatar
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    Maybe he is an only child and this is her way of holding onto him in a weird way.

    I am sure she can find a woman willing to give birth for a couple of grand.
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    Grand Count Wicked Doll's Avatar
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    My creep-o-meter is in the red zone. I feel very sorry for this mother, but there really are better ways for her to keep her son's memory alive. Yikes.
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    Great President Castille's Avatar
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    You know, it doesn't really disturb me in the slightest. In the absence of any significant other with some claim on his progeny, why shouldn't his mother have every right to his sperm? He's dead, so he doesn't care. It is her genetic line she's trying to protect and perpetuate after all, and the family she'd hoped to enjoy in her old age. She may or may not get a grandchild out of it, but she may or may not have had a grandchild had he lived. It's preserving the hope for one, more than anything.

    They wouldn't be looking to donate his sperm to anyone. The prefered method of going forward would be to find both a surrogate and an egg donor - it's better that your surrogate have no biological relationship to the infant she's carrying. Legally speaking, anyway. Probably emotionally, for her, too. I hope she's successful in this pursuit and much comforted in the coming years without her son by the presence of his children.

    So really, what is the squick factor that I'm insensible to, exactly? The fact that we can produce children entirely seperate from their biological parents, or that a mom is invested enough in the idea of her future grandshildren that she'd take action in the death of her son to protect the faint possibility?

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    Great Count ineedanap's Avatar
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    Castille- Just because we can, doesn't mean we should.

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    Count Misskittychaos's Avatar
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    I don't know how I really feel about this. If it was a spouse I could honestly say I agree with it. But being her son...it kind of weirds me out. She'll have an interesting time find a doctor to help her with this, alot will say no due to moral standing. I am curious how it will play out with taking into consideration that she claims her son wanted "three sons" and had names picked out, what if the eggs they fertilize with his sperm result in girls? Or is she going to go to a total extreme and have only boys by selection?


    I dunno, I am all for lots of different fertility treatments but I guess I kind of start to hit a gray area when it comes down to picking a prospective child's sex...but when I think about that I start to question "Well what if the males in the family will have a huge chance at some horrible defect...what would I do if that was me?" It just starts a billion questions that I could never give a firm "right" or "wrong" label to..

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    Grand Knight maryhaze's Avatar
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    i think it's creepy & my creep-o-meter is waaay out there.......i've got sons & Goddess forbid anything should happen to them, i just don't want to have their sperm hanging around in nitro.

  20. #12
    Grand King
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    Oh boy.

    I totally feel for her. I sympathize and I think I understand.

    It wouldn't be my choice but I can feel for her.

    She's in lots of pain though over the death of her son. I hope she has a counselor.

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    I will stick with the creepy theme myself. That might be the last thing on my mind...if my son passed away....gag.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  23. #14
    Great President Castille's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ineedanap View Post
    Castille- Just because we can, doesn't mean we should.
    Sure, sometimes. But we need to do better than live by a blind platitude. Or even a vague feeling of creepiness - that just adds up to I'm not familliar with it, sperm just has a sexual overtone to it, and I wouldn't do it.

    Specifically, why not this?

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    Great Count ineedanap's Avatar
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    I just don't agree with it, morally. I'm mostly a traditional gal. Not to say that I can't be open minded at all, but not in this case. I remember a previous case that was similar, only it was the wife who wanted the sperm. I have no problem with that and can totally understand her motivation and reasoning. I don't think parents should have any say in their adult children's reproduction, especially post-mortem. Obviously, a judge disagreed!

    I might have to add a clause to my will: No one is allowed to harvest my eggies and make a bunch of mini-mees when I die.

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    Great Count moonlilly1981's Avatar
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    How do you get sperm out of a dead dude? Its not like he can be whacked off to donate it.
    Silence is golden. Duct tape is silver.

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    I think it is a cool idea. Poor lady. And I am not creeped out at all. Ya'll act like she is going to have herself impregnanted with his sperm. Now that would be creepy.
    Love withers under constraint; its very essence is liberty. It is compatible neither with obedience, jealousy nor fear. It is there most pure, perfect, and unlimited when its votaries live in confidence, equality and unreserve. - Percy Byshe Shelley

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  29. #18
    Great President Castille's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nell View Post
    I think it is a cool idea. Poor lady. And I am not creeped out at all. Ya'll act like she is going to have herself impregnanted with his sperm. Now that would be creepy.
    Or be the surrogate herself with donated eggs. And while that idea makes me a little uncomfortable - you know, giving birth to your own grandchild, which has been done before a few times - I still can't come up with an actual rational objection to it.

    And as for having no say in an adult child's reproduction - well, obviously, when said child is *alive.* But when you're dead, all bets are off, because, barring legal documents, the opinions of the dead just don't count. While it's established in law that parents can donate or not donate your tissues or organs as they wish (irregardless of the wishes of the dead unless someone live objects,) the sperm bit is just without precedent and slightly different in that it's being collected for the parent for potentially making a new person. I still feel we'll find that they've every legal right to do this if they want too, in the absence of another person objecting who is in a good position to do so. The number of parents who would actually do this is few though, I suspect, and the number that could afford to make use of it even fewer, so it wouldn't worry me even if I did think it was terrible. If you want to be sure your eggs (eggs aren't harvestable after death though,) aren't harvested, by all means, let your survivors know you object to the idea. Be prepared that after you're dead, they get to make the decision regardless of what you write down though. What you can do is create legal documents that specify who that person is exactly, and your written intent will assist them if someone else fights to do something differently.

    To retrieve the sperm - on a brain dead, ventilated person they'd use electroejaculation I guess. On a dead dead guy, they'd surgically open his testicles and suck it out.
    Last edited by Castille; April 10th, 2009 at 11:08 PM. Reason: while I usually leave my sloppy posting errors out there in all their glory, that 'you're' vs 'your' one really makes me nuts

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    Great Count ineedanap's Avatar
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    Oh, Castille, good point. My organ donor status doesn't say anything about WHICH organs I agree to donate! Food for thought. I would personally be crushed if my family felt it appropriate to donate the ovies, though. I take parenting very seriously. When hubby and I were trying to gain custody of his daughter from his first marriage, his lawyer actually said we were too responsible! I do not want any little Needas running around that I am not a party to making :o) or agreeing to parent.

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    Great Count ineedanap's Avatar
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    Castille- Just saw this as a link from another board I post on, and it gave me pause.

    When Chris Biblis was a teenager battling leukemia, he didn't care much when doctors told him the treatments would likely leave him sterile. But because his mother suggested he freeze some sperm 23 years ago, Biblis now has a baby daughter, Stella.

    http://news.aol.com/health/article/f...erm-dad/423360

    Thank God momma had the hope to think her boy would not only live, but want to reproduce!

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  33. #21
    Great President Castille's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ineedanap View Post
    Castille- Just saw this as a link from another board I post on, and it gave me pause.

    When Chris Biblis was a teenager battling leukemia, he didn't care much when doctors told him the treatments would likely leave him sterile. But because his mother suggested he freeze some sperm 23 years ago, Biblis now has a baby daughter, Stella.

    http://news.aol.com/health/article/f...erm-dad/423360

    Thank God momma had the hope to think her boy would not only live, but want to reproduce!
    Now see, parents wanting to save sperm and thinking ahead to the grandchildren they've a pretty good idea their offspring are likely to want one day isn't always creepy - sometimes it's healthy foresight in the best interest of their own kids ;)

    You know, I just have the skewed view of having a mom with good judgement whom I trust implicitly. She'll always look out for my best interest, and her wisdom in what that is is pretty reliable. If she said I wanted kids, it's because I did, and I would trust her to raise them. I'd give her my medical power of attorney before my husband - only I'm pretty confidant he'll listen to her, ha!

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  35. #22
    Great Regent Tazzzz's Avatar
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    Mother Gets Court Order To Harvest Her Murdered Son' "Sperm"????

    Nikolas Colton Evans, 20



    This whole thing creeps me out big time. Harvesting a dead sons sperm, WTF!!. And he had been dead for a few days, big Ewwwww on that one.


    Marissa Evans, whose son Nikolas Colton Evans, 20, (pictured) died on Sunday after an assault on March 27, 2009 in Austin, Texas, has received a court order to preserve her son’s body until his sperm can be harvested.

    Travis County Judge Guy Herman signed the temporary restraining order and mandatory injunction at 3 p.m. Tuesday. Nikolas was assaulted in the Sixth Street bar district of Austin two weeks ago while heading home with a friend around 2 AM. His head hit the concrete after he was punched, eventually causing his death.

    Marissa Evans, 42, who says she wants to use her son’s sperm to have grandchildren through a surrogate mother, repeatedly asked officials at University Medical Center at Brackenridge–where Nikolas died–as well as representatives from an organ donation agency, to a extract her dying son’s sperm. They declined, so she was forced to get a court order.

    The sperm must be collected within 24 hours of Evans’ death for it to remain viable or his body must be cooled to no more than 4 degrees centigrade. Evans agreed to donate her son’s organs, which required him to be on life support until 9 p.m. Monday, documents said.
    http://guanabee.com/2009/04/austin-n...-harvest-sperm
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  36. #23
    Great Count Angelinfl's Avatar
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    You know this would be a legal test case... I THINK.... father deceased would the offspring be entitled to Social Security Benefits because the father was deceased and genetically could be tracked back to dead daddy..... THink on this one....

  37. #24
    Great Regent Tazzzz's Avatar
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    Marissa Evans & her now dead son Nikolas Colton Evans



    Holey Moley, she doesnt want just one. Looks like she is shooting for 3 boys. WTF!!!


    A Texas mother who tragically lost her 21-year-old son hopes that she will be able to raise her grandchildren after a judge granted her request to posthumously harvest sperm from his body.

    “It would help to heal my heart somewhat,” Marissa Evans told TODAY’s Matt Lauer Thursday from Bedford, Texas, during an exclusive interview.

    Evans’ son, Nikolas Colton Evans, died Sunday in an Austin hospital, two weeks after he was punched outside an Austin bar early in the morning of March 27. His heart was kept beating until Monday, when Evans gave permission to doctors to harvest his organs. But she also wanted to harvest his sperm.

    Legal experts say that there have been cases where permission was granted to harvest sperm from others after their deaths, but none had involved a mother and her son. Evans was initially told by medical personnel they could not do it, and she went to court to get permission, which was granted Monday. A urologist performed the procedure Wednesday, but published reports say the viability of the sperm has not been confirmed.

    “It really wasn’t difficult,” Evans said of her decision. “It was something that he’d talked about since he was a little boy. I always dreamed about watching my children have children of their own … What was difficult was actually losing my son and not being able to see him graduate from college and get married and have children the way other people have children. The whole process has been horrific; this had actually given me a bit of a bright light at the end of this devastating experience.”

    Evans, who has one other son, age 22, told the Austin American-Statesman newspaper that Nikolas wanted to have three sons someday and had even picked out their names: Hunter, Tod and Van.

    Remembering Nikolas
    She described Nikolas as an athletic and quick-witted young man who loved to write and who was planning to go to film school.

    “He was compassionate. He loved to help me with animal rescue; liked to write comedy skits,” Evans told Lauer. “He was very deep, very artsy — kind of an old soul, very worldly, loved to talk about politics with his friends and get into heated discussions about that.”

    Lauer asked Evans if she had wrestled with the ethics of her decision.

    “I have thoughts about it,” she said calmly. “Of course … his first choice would not be to have children like this. He would want to raise his children, but the bottom line is he can’t. Somebody took that opportunity away from him. As the mother to a son I knew so well, I feel he would have wanted me to do this.”

    Nikolas hadn’t declared himself as an organ donor, but his mother authorized doctors to harvest his organs.

    “I was able to donate his organs to help other people live. He would believe in this and want me to help him live on as well,” she said.

    Evans was joined by Mark Mueller, the Los Angeles lawyer who successfully argued her petition. He said it wasn’t a complicated issue.

    “There wasn’t anybody that objected to it. It was a fairly straightforward procedure,” Mueller told Lauer. “It was just a matter of proving some legal justification for the physicians to go forward without concern that they would be getting into some deep water. It’s not that complicated. It’s what the son would have wanted as far as we know, and what the mom wanted.”

    Travis County Probate Judge Guy Herman ruled Monday in an emergency hearing requested by the mother, because of the urgency of collecting the sperm intact.

    Court documents said the sperm had to be collected within 24 hours of Nikolas Evans’ being removed from life support unless the body was cooled to no more than 39.2 degrees.

    Herman ordered the county medical examiner's office to continue storing the body at the proper temperature until the sperm could be collected.

    University of Texas law professor John Robertson, who specializes in bioethics, said state law gives parents control over a child's body for organ and tissue donations but its use for sperm “is very unclear … There are no strong precedents in favor of a parent being able to request post-mortem sperm retrieval,” he said.

    No arrests have been made in the assault on Nikolas Evans. Investigators said Evans hit his head on the ground after he was punched during an argument with a group of men.

    Published reports quote Marissa Evans as saying she will probably engage a surrogate to carry a baby, if one can be conceived. She intends to raise her grandchild herself.

    Lauer asked her if she intends to begin the fertilization process sooner rather than later.

    “Yes,” she said. “Definitely.”
    http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/30133582/
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  38. #25
    Great Marshal dougxthexwookie's Avatar
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    Woah....

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    Great Regent Tazzzz's Avatar
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    Marissa has a website & blog up. Its quite touching. Her son got beat up, outside a bar in Austin and to help catch the guy who did it, she plastered info about it "ALL" over town, billboards, bus stop seats and bathroom wall advertising. They did catch the guy and its moving through the courts.

    MoMs web site
    http://nikolasevans.com/
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  40. #27
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    I watched a show recently where a woman got her HUBBYS sperm b/c he was brain dead after an accident ,thats one thing.This is fucking nasty,creepy and shes not mentally stable so theres the first road block.Second how many boys do you know grow up dreaming of having babies and picking out baby names with mommy when they are small??She whacked I cant see a legal councel even granting her permission to use it.They conduct psychological tests before anything is written in stone and shes obviuosly not the sharpest tack in the box.

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    Great Regent Tazzzz's Avatar
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    Yeah, I got no probs at all if it was your husband. But a son?, that takes it down a real strange road, I totaly understand her hurt and loss.

    Another article mentioned she does have another son, so its not like she will not have any grandkids at all. Even though Nikolas wasn't a organ Donner, she ended up authorizing it so he was. So in a way he is still alive in other people. I guess thats not enough for her though.

    This certainly is going to open lots of interesting doors, who is going to be the legal guardian?? Just because she used his sperm , does that make it her?? A surrogate usually signs off all rights to the child. Does the mom then have to go to court and get custody?? Way to many unanswered questions and new territory.

    I also wonder who's egg she is going to use?? The surrogates or some one Else's??
    Some people are like Slinkies. They aren’t really good for anything, but they still bring a smile to my face when I push them down a flight of stairs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tazzzz View Post
    Yeah, I got no probs at all if it was your husband. But a son?, that takes it down a real strange road, I total ly understand her hurt and loss.

    Another article mentioned she does have another son, so its not like she will not have any grand kids at all. Even though Nikolas wasn't a organ Donner, she ended up authorizing it so he was. So in a way he is still alive in other people. I guess that's not enough for her though.

    This certainly is going to open lots of interesting doors, who is going to be the legal guardian?? Just because she used his sperm , does that make it her?? A surrogate usually signs off all rights to the child. Does the mom then have to go to court and get custody?? Way to many unanswered questions and new territory.

    I also wonder who's egg she is going to use?? The surrogates or some one Else's??
    that's
    exactly what I was thinking.
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  43. #30
    Marshal Fayebella's Avatar
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    to each their own. but I'm hoping mom finds peace somehow.hopefully in a less desturbing way.

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