"A Disturbing Trend" - or - "Teenager Girls Are Stupid" - or - "Fuck Rihanna"

[Athena]

Take your pick, because all versions of the title are appropriate.



“She probably made him mad for him to react like that," said a 9th grade girl at a Bronx high school, a comment that appears to mark a widespread sentiment. “So he shouldn’t get into trouble if she doesn’t feel that way,” another said in response to the fact that Rihanna quickly took back her abuser, Chris Brown, after the savage beating he delivered the night before the Grammys. Little abused wives in the making? I think so.

But it's not as though the journalist who authored the article, Teenage Girls Stand By Their Man happened to stumble into the two dumbest 9th graders at Hostos-Lincoln Academy. Nope, a recent survey of 200 Boston teens shows that 46 percent though Rihanna solely responsible for what happened and 52 percent said both were responsible, despite being fully aware of the severity of Rihanna's injuries.

Mimi Valdés Ryan, former editor in chief of Vibe magazine, made all sorts of excuses for the dumb little broads. (Paraphrased:) "They're fans of his." Yep, and you could say most women are fans of their husbands and boyfriends. "Acknowledging he's capable of this would have made them feel vulnerable." They'll be even MORE vulnerable when they're the ones being knocked around. "He was abused as a child." SO?

According to the most recent study, 10% of teenagers report experiencing violence within their relationships, and that's probably a low estimate, as boys are much less likely to report abuse, whether it's committed by them or not. The above mindframe has GOT to stop.

My solution? Automatic dual restraining orders. Make it illegal for abused women to take back their men. Why not? We've got all sorts of legislation in place to protect people from their own bad judgment. This one might actually help prevent children being born into physically abusive households, which is better for everyone, right?

[penelopejo]

Stupid teenage girls. Why? Because they only say that cause he's famous. They are jealous at the fact that she was with them and took away his "single" status that they were oh so trying to fight for. Really girls? You would stay with someone who is rich and famous if they beat you cause you'd lose it all? Blaming her instead of him? All because she took his single status?

And I agree with the dual protection order. Anything to stop the rising numbers of spousal abuse.

[Wicked Doll]

My solution? Automatic dual restraining orders. Make it illegal for abused women to take back their men. Why not? We've got all sorts of legislation in place to protect people from their own bad judgment. This one might actually help prevent children being born into physically abusive households, which is better for everyone, right?

That's brilliant. I think that is a fabulous idea.
-----------------

This is, as the article states, "chilling".

A Boston Public Health Commission survey on teenagers and dating violence released yesterday offered up some pretty chilling results: Nearly half of the kids surveyed said they think Rihanna was "responsible" for what happened between her and her boyfriend, Chris Brown.

Every single one of the 200 12- to 19-year-old kids surveyed had heard about the incident involving the two R&B stars that took place hours before the Grammys on Feb. 8, but in case you don't know the details, here's what allegedly happened, according to the LAPD detective's notes and Fox News:

After Rihanna read a text message on Brown's phone from a woman, he tried to force Rihanna out of the car, but couldn't because she was wearing her seatbelt.

Brown then allegedly slammed Rihanna's head against her window, and when Rihanna turned to face him, he punched her.

The notes said blood spattered on Rihanna's clothing and the interior of the Lamborghini.

Rihanna also called her assistant, according to FOX 11, leaving a message saying, "I am on my way home. Make sure the cops are there when I get there."

Brown then reportedly replied, "You just did the stupidest thing ever. I'm going to kill you," and proceeded to punch and bite Rihanna. He allegedly put her in a headlock so long that she almost lost consciousness.

Rihanna, who turned 21 a few weeks after the incident, was beaten severely enough to require hospitalization. Brown, 19, who reportedly had a history of violence toward Rihanna, turned himself in and was charged with two felonies.

Yet 46 percent of the kids surveyed said that they thought Rihanna was to blame for the beating; 51 percent said Brown was at fault, and 52 percent said that both of them were somehow responsible. And, according to the survey, a significant number of males and females said Rihanna was now destroying Chris Brown's career.

The two got back together, which, while horrifying to many parents, doesn't seem to surprise many teenagers; 71 percent of respondents said that arguing is a normal part of a relationship, and 42 percent responded that fighting (presumably physically) was also normal.

Unhealthy relationships -- rife with physical, verbal, or emotional abuse -- has become so prevalent that kids' entertainment giant Nickelodeon did not bother to strip Brown of his nominations in their Kids' Choice Awards after his arrest, instead saying that Brown "was nominated by kids several months ago, and the kids who vote will ultimately decide who wins in the category." (Over at the Deep South Moms Blog, Ilana has written a great post about it; Brown withdrew his name from consideration on Wednesday).

Also... Michael Phelps gets dropped by sponsors for toking up, but Chris Brown beats his girlfriend and is up for a couple of awards?

How did we go from telling our preschoolers "use your words" and "don't hit people" to this?

According to the National Center for Injury Prevention and Control at the CDC, one in 11 adolescents reports being a victim of physical dating abuse. And it starts early: 72 percent of eighth and ninth graders reportedly "date"; by the time they are in high school, 54 percent of students report dating abuse among their peers, according to the CDC.

"The consequences of dating violence can be severe and long-lasting. Teen dating violence victimization can be a precursor to adult violence victimization, and can increase risky behaviors during adolescence," Emily F. Rothman, assistant professor in the Department of Social and Behavioral Sciences at the Boston University School of Public Health, and an adviser to the Boston Start Strong initiative, said in a press release. The CDC reports that both male and female victims of dating abuse are not only at increased risk for injury, they are also more likely to binge drink, attempt suicide, get into physical fights, and take part in unhealthy sexual behavior. "Rates of drug, alcohol, and tobacco use are more than twice as high in girls who report physical or sexual dating abuse than in girls who report no abuse," CDC data shows.

http://www.boston.com/lifestyle/fami...ids_think.html

[sanityslipping]

My solution? Automatic dual restraining orders. Make it illegal for abused women to take back their men. Why not? We've got all sorts of legislation in place to protect people from their own bad judgment. This one might actually help prevent children being born into physically abusive households, which is better for everyone, right?

Athena, I think you are a genius. If you ever run for public office, and win, I will move there.


I don't have anything useful to add as you already said most everything I could say, the best I could do would be to quote you and just write ditto. I saw an article in the paper on this subject, fueled by the Rihanna/chris brown debacle, same info you put in here basically. I was gonna post it, but comp wasn't working at the time, and I forgot. Glad it got put up though. I can't believe the number of teens that don't see anything wrong with being in an abusive relationship.

[Kitty]

Athena, I think you are a genius. If you ever run for public office, and win, I will move there.

I don't have anything useful to add as you already said most everything I could say, the best I could do would be to quote you and just write ditto. I saw an article in the paper on this subject, fueled by the Rihanna/chris brown debacle, same info you put in here basically. I was gonna post it, but comp wasn't working at the time, and I forgot. Glad it got put up though. I can't believe the number of teens that don't see anything wrong with being in an abusive relationship.

Hell, I'd move there to vote for her..

[swivel]

You should add me as your VP to get the white male vote.

[Athena]

You should add me as your VP to get the white male vote.

It'd be the natural choice. Well, then, poli sci it is. It's not too late for me to get into the military, either, so maybe I should look at that.

Of course, two hard-line atheists? Just keep your mouth shut when I play up my Catholic baptism, and we might actually have a chance.

[Sister Iroz]

My solution? Automatic dual restraining orders. Make it illegal for abused women to take back their men. Why not? We've got all sorts of legislation in place to protect people from their own bad judgment. This one might actually help prevent children being born into physically abusive households, which is better for everyone, right?

RIGHT, DITTO, GENIUS

Damn Athena maybe you will be our first female President of the US.

[Peeperann]

Just keep your mouth shut when I play up by Catholic baptism, and we might actually have a chance.

Ahahahahahha!! Ah, i'd still vote for you!

Seriously though, as sad as it is to say, I am so not surprised that the young girls, (or any girls) believe it was her fault for "making him really mad". And those statements scare the hell out me! It is just too scary how many women and girls make excuses for abusers.

The mutual restraining orders? Perfect idea. But I do believe we would have a lot more arrests and court dates for the people who defy them. Because you know it will happen.

[Athena]

Seriously though, as sad as it is to say, I am so not surprised that the young girls, (or any girls) believe it was her fault for "making him really mad". And those statements scare the hell out me! It is just too scary how many women and girls make excuses for abusers.

The mutual restraining orders? Perfect idea. But I do believe we would have a lot more arrests and court dates for the people who defy them. Because you know it will happen.

I just don't get it, Peep. I even grew up in a household that featured the occasional domestic violence. I BEGGED my parents to consider divorce. I've just never been able to grasp it. I can understand if, you know, something was a one time thing. My friend Olivia punched my friend Jessica several years ago, and we're all still friends. Shit happens. But if Olivia had BEATEN THE CRAP out of Jessica? I would not expect them to be friends, and I would encourage Jessica to walk the fuck away.

I think the dude in the article said it well, that these women don't want the relationship to stop, they just want the violence to stop. But I just don't get how the two can be mutually exclusive when it's that severe. It's not even like he was drunk! And then for people to suggest it was her fault for being jealous? That is a FUNDAMENTAL flaw in logic, and what appears to be a failure on the part of the parents.

It pains me, Peep. It really does.

I do know that it would shoot up the arrest rate, but it's not really even about incarceration as much as making a statement. You do NOT turn around and re-involve yourself with your attacker. Society no longer tolerates this brand of stupidity.

I don't know... we know me, and I'm NOT a fan of nanny legislaion. But it seems like the system reinforces the logic that one girl spouted, that if she's not mad about it, he shouldn't be in trouble. He's not going to get any time for this dramatic assault, largely inpart because she'll be a hostile witness. Sure, the state *can* press charges anyway, but even when they decide to, they're not nearly as successful.

[Peeperann]

I think the dude in the article said it well, that these women don't want the relationship to stop, they just want the violence to stop. But I just don't get how the two can be mutually exclusive when it's that severe. It's not even like he was drunk! And then for people to suggest it was her fault for being jealous? That is a FUNDAMENTAL flaw in logic, and what appears to be a failure on the part of the parents.

It pains me, Peep. It really does.

It pains me to Athena. It is a fundamental flaw in the logic. Having been on the receiving end of abuse (horrific abuse as a child and then again 3 years ago) I have a good perspective on it. The quote in the statement was right on target. The abused do not want the relationship to end, just the violence.

But the scary thing is, they are completely exclusive you cannot have one without the other in these relationships. The abuser will always be an abuser, that will never change. These men (or women in some cases) are missing something inside themselves and to make themselves feel better, they mentally, physically, emotionally (or all three) abuse the weaker partner, it actually gives them a release.

The abused get so confused because one moment he's a monster bent on killing you (whether truly killing you or just your soul) and the next he's the sweet, loving man you fell in love with and is so "sorry" he did it. And then he's wonderful to you for awhile and you begin to question your own sanity.

So many people are so used to seeing some form of violence in their formative years that it seems them to the "right" way to live. You're quite right that it is a FAIL on the parents part.

Every woman and every mother should go to 1AngelAvenue.com and read "The Key". It teaches what love is supposed to be and what it is not. Every mother should teach her daughters the "The Key". It so important and true.

For teen girls to be saying it was "her fault" scares me more than I really want to think about. I want to go out and gather every one of them up and keep them with me until they have the mantra ingrained in their brains that "Love does not hurt".

And every boy and young man needs to be taught and mentored that you just don't hit, push, kick, scream, threaten the women in your life.

[Peeperann]

Here is a short version of "The Key"

The Key

THE KEY (short version)

If the person you are with has a NASTY OUTBURST for no reason that you can understand – this is "The Key" to let you know, that they will eventually turn into a verbal abuser who may end up physically abusing you. The key is that it is nasty and there is no explanation for it - you don’t have to figure it out any more. No matter how nice they have been up until this moment or how nice they are after - you must not further the relationship. This is a person who potentially has a masked out of control anger problem or worse yet an unacknowledged mental disorder - This person may not even understand that their behvavior is unacceptable. Their anger is not personal to you - but will affect your life (negatively) in a huge way if you stay. DO NOT commit to this person...read about "The Key" in more detail below, if this has already happened to you.

[Peeperann]

The Key more detailed version

THE KEY in more detail...

I know some of you do not like to read through a lot of information though there will be a lot of information on this site soon. For now I will give you the quick answer that will set you free from ever encountering this abuse for any amount of time. After talking to hundreds of women and from my own research and experience, the key to knowing that you are with a potential abuser is after that 1st NASTY OUTBURST. I say the 1st because most times this outburst happens after a long time, of this man or woman being the partner of your dreams. They do everything right. They are charming, fun and exciting, almost too good to be true until one day there WILL be a nasty outburst. It could come after the first few months or sometimes it has been known to take a couple of years. Everyone fights and argues that is normal, but the abuser picks on you and starts a fight for no valid reason…this is the key.


Think to yourself…… does my partner have somewhat of a reason to get mad right now? Did they get upset because I did do something really wrong and pushed them to it OR did they get upset over something little - like leaving a light on or accidentally forgetting something. Is the outburst uncalled for so much so that I don’t understand it and would never get that upset over it myself? In other words did the velocity and height of their nasty outburst make you say a huge “huh?” This is the golden key and where the turning point will be… when, why they do what they do makes you say “huh?’ to yourself. Only you will know as they only seem to do it to you or when no one is around. Everyone else thinks they are a good person, some are known to be helpful and the life and soul of the party. They have been hiding who they really are... just to capture you, they could never find a partner showing this nasty side early on in the relationship, These people either have an out of control anger problem, a personality disorder or worse yet a mental disorder that has not been diagnosed yet, but all their triats confirm it. Most times they do not know this themselves or if they do they try to mask it anyway and remain in denial as it is easier for them to handle it that way. That's why they blame it on others, mostly the closest people to them, the people of their household, or partner. Their minds function differently and that is why you cannot figure them out as it makes no sense to you. I hope this explains a lot to those who have experienced this.

The sad thing is a red flag should actually go up when a person you meet is exceptionally nice and almost too good to be true. Though there are many beautiful people in the world, you have to be educated on this abuse to recognize the traits and signs, which will be coming to the site soon, but you will find on our Myspace link. An additional key being: are they on you like "white on rice", "all in your world", "calling you every day", (overly caring about your well being before they have got to know you??) I know this could seem flattering, to be given so much attention and even attractive and a turn on, but be patient with falling in love - this is a sign to be aware. This person makes you believe they will do anything for you, though the opposite is true. Try to know this person for a long time, their family and friends. Talk to their friends about their past, how he treated other girlfriends. Do they party a lot, take drugs or are they into making money in an obsessive way, into porn on the internet etc? After that 1st nasty outburst they will apologize and be nice again, the perfect partner again for a little while and then it will happen again. By this time you will now know to run, or you will be saying “huh?” so much so, the confusion will immobilize you and you will be exactly where your abuser needs and planned you to be…trapped!!


You will probably be totally in love by this time so it will be very difficult to leave especially as they are so nice right after. You will notice that they do not put much emphasis on their nasty outburst that just happened and sometimes they will not even acknowledge it and will act normal right after - as if it did not happen at all! After reading some of the testimonies here, you will now know for sure it will only get worse and turn into a nightmare and the dream you had for your life is guaranteed to be shattered, and instead it will be filled with torment and pain. The key is to get out now before you make any kind of commitment and count your blessings. If you see a family member or a friend in this position tell them to read “The Key” at 1AngelAvenue.com - a few minutes can change their whole lives around and save them a life of undeserved pain too.

Now when you leave this potential abuser you can instantly know for sure that you will never regret it as you are totally saving yourself a guaranteed life of hell. We have experts confirming the results of this behavior and what it will do to you. This abuser is testing your boundaries with that first nasty outburst, it is almost designed to see if they can get away with it. He/she makes sure they have won you over before they release their monster side. They test you, and if you believe you love them so much, that you will be able to change them back to the person you met, think again as these people are known (once again by some experts who have studied this for years) to NEVER change, You must also remember that the person you first met does not really exist and was made up to capture you and the person you are with now is the real person you fell in love with. Though I believe with the help of God, it is possible for anyone to change if they admit that they are behaving this way, unfortunately with this type of abusers it is extremely rare. After my intense research I would say a person who abuses this way will NEVER change if they don't genuinely seek outside help. So these experts really know what they are saying, because they know these abusers almost never seek outside help and if they do it is for show. Promising to change does not count, you threatening to leave if they do not get help does not count. They have to seek it with their own free will leading them, (which will usually only be after you leave them), and that is why it is rare. It has also been researched and only 3-5% of men who abuse this way and go to therapy - change their ways. If you know of any man that has abused this way and has totally changed his ways, we hope you will write to us and we will post it on our site. We commend and are proud of anyone who has overcome this huge mountain to stop acting this way and will use their story to help others in their position.

The person you first met was never real, just a figment of the abusers’ damaged mind to win you over. 1 in 4 women in the world are abused so there are a lot of these people out there. I think the figure is higher as not many people can report verbal abuse as there are no physical signs. These people are incapable of giving real love and have to act it out (they can only keep it up for a while), otherwise they will never find a partner and will be alone forever something they dread and will do anything to stop from happening. I believe some of them do not believe what they are doing is wrong, as if they believe they are entitled to be this way. Then again why did they act almost perfect in the beginning knowing that they had to, to win you over, that makes it all a little too sinister to think about and if you are dealing with a person who has a masked mental disorder you will never be able to figure it out, so don’t try…it just is.


When you leave them and mean it, they will not truly care anyway. They will move on to find a person they can prey on comfortably, though they will also dump them if you take them back!! They just need someone who they can control for their own uses once again, it is very confusing. It's almost like you are an item to them, remember they probably have some kind of disorder, so it is not hard for them to think this way and it actually means nothing to them in the end. It's almost as if you are something they own and they definitely don't want anyone else to have you. You are the best to them, that's why they chose you and went all out to get you. Treating you like they hate you is just to control you, so you become afraid to leave them. So why waste any of your time, when it is pointless and will only hurt you and your children in the end. The longer you stay with them the more difficult it will be to get away and they will be relentless in not letting you go. If you do get away they will revenge you for leaving them. After a few years it may even turn dangerous, a nightmare you will not be able to wake up from. In domestic violence class it is known as a never-ending cycle and is why it is so difficult to get away. Most people do not know that abusers act nice and make all kinds of promises that they know they are not going to keep just to keep their partner from leaving, once that works after a few months or even weeks they will go back to the dishing out the abuse putting tighter reigns on you. They manipulate and control.


When you know for sure that your partner is only being nice again to keep control of you - and has no intentions whatsoever of changing their ways. When you know for sure that they are incapable of feeling compassion or empathy for anything you feel and will become abusive in a matter of weeks after being nice - turning back into the abuser again guaranteed, you will not accept it for one more day or let’s say should not.

If you are married to this abuser, you must learn how to stop the confusion that is happening in your life by going on the mini course explained in the" Recovery Room". This course is actually good for all those who have ever been involved with this type of abuser.


Let’s pass this word on through word of mouth or e-mails. If everyone tells just one person, to visit 1 Angel Avenue in order to read the “The Key”….just one page. I believe the world will become a safer place to live.


That 1st nasty outburst opens the door to your freedom….BE STRONG as this person will probably be the one you thought was “the one”, though instead this is the person who definitely is NOT!!

Stella

Founder of 1 Angel Avenue

SIGNS TO LOOK FOR....

1. DOES HE LIKE TO PARTY A LOT

2. DOES HE DRINK A LOT

3. DOES HE LIKE TO BE THE LIFE OF THE PARTY

4. DOES HE HAVE SOME KIND OF OBSESSION...WORK, SPORTS, MAKING MONEY, PORN, VIDEO GAMES ETC.

5. DOES HE REFRAIN FROM TALKING ABOUT HIS MOTHER, LOOK INTO HIS EYES WHEN HE TALKS ABOUT HER, DO THEY LIGHT UP OR DO THEY GET DARK

6. DID THEY HAVE A BAD RELATIONSHIP

7. WAS HIS FATHER/MOTHER ABUSIVE

8. DOES HE DO DRUGS

9. DOES HE ONLY HAVE FUN WITH HIS FRIENDS, NOT SO MUCH WITH YOURS

10. DOES HE CALL YOU EVERY DAY AND ACT LIKE HE LOVES YOU (IN THE BEGINNING) ALMOST TOO QUICKLY

THESE COULD BE THE TELLING SIGNS BEFORE THAT 1ST NASTY OUTBURST OCCURS. ONLY WHEN YOU ARE YOUNG AND IN LOVE THESE THINGS DO NOT SEEM SO BAD AS HE IS STILL BEING NICE. PUT IT ALL TOGETHER AND YOU DEFINTELY WILL HAVE A GOLDEN KEY TO AN AWESOME ESCAPE BEFORE YOU EVER COMMIT....JUST GO TO THE TESTIMONIAL ROOM AND READ ALL THE TESTIMONAILS TO CONFIRM HOW SCARY IT WILL BE IF YOU STAY.

IF YOUR MAN HAS ANY OF THESE SIGNS OR TRAITS BUT IS NOT ABUSIVE, THEY MAY HAVE A PROBLEM WITH INTAMACY ALSO. THERE IS SOMETHING PERSONALTHAT THEY ARE NOT ADDRESSING AND IT WILL GET WORSE IF NOT DEALT WITH. COUNSELLING AND THERAPY CAN WORK IN THESE CASES AND CAN HAVE A POSITVE AFFECT ON YOUR RELATIONSHIP

PS THERE ARE GREAT GUYS OUT THERE, LOOK OUT FOR THEM NOW YOU HAVE THIS INFO. THE EXCITING GUYS ARE USUALLY THE GUYS WHO END UP ACTING THIS WAY, SO KEEP THAT IN MIND.

IF YOUR ARE LOOKING FOR MR.RIGHT, THE BEST WAY TO FIND A HUSBAND IS SPIRITUALLY. AT LEAST CHECK THAT YOUR MAN HAS INTENTIONS OF GOING IN THAT DIRECTION. IT WILL BE COMFORTING TO YOU AS A SPRITUAL LIFE IS NECESSARY FOR A SUCCESSFUL LONG TERM RELATIONSHIP, ESPECIALLY NOWADAYS WITH ALL THE CRAZY DISTRACTIONS OUT THERE.

THE LESS HE HAS OF THE SIGNS OR TRAITS (ABOVE), THE MORE HE WILL BE A SAFE AND LOVING PARTNER. THOUGH THIS IS ALWAYS NOT GUARANTEED, HE HAVE LESS CHANCE OF TURNING ABUSIVE.

[Dr. Salvador]

i have a thought:

women are emotional wrecks who appear to not know the difference between "come here" and "sick em". illegal to go back? a law? who is next? ze germans?

if she goes back and gets her ass kicked the second time, i dare say she had it coming. i tell ya man, if a girl beat my ass...................well i would like it, but thats another topic.

[Peeperann]

i have a thought:

women are emotional wrecks who appear to not know the difference between "come here" and "sick em". illegal to go back? a law? who is next? ze germans?

if she goes back and gets her ass kicked the second time, i dare say she had it coming. i tell ya man, if a girl beat my ass...................well i would like it, but thats another topic.

Doc, I didn't "go back". The first time he hit me, he was gone! But a month later he tore my front door off it's hinges (with two dead bolts on it) and I ended up with a broken nose, wrist, a few ribs and fractured skull. In the hospital for a week.

So not all go back and the ones who do? Well abuse is insidious, it starts very slowly and the person gets so confused, she ends up thinking she's the one who's crazy.

And if you have children, as Raven said in another thread, some women have no "place" to go with their children. So what are they supposed to do.

The entire point of this thread is to teach boys and girls while they're young that it is wrong and totally unacceptable. So that it never has to happen in the first place.

[Dakota Valkyrie]

I have never been and will never be one to shy away from saying what I think. I have always been considered a "strong woman" by those that know me. Our family never experienced domestic violence.

That is what made it all the more surprising to family and friends that I ended up black and blue all over with a broken nose, dislocated jaw, and throttle marks around my neck... refusing treatment, lying to authorities, and paying for the damage to my apartment out of my own pocket.

Yes, that ended the relationship. What was a shock to all was that it was not the first time... just the first time I couldn't hide the marks and other damage from everyone.

To this day I have a hard time explaining how I even ended up in that position. The position that allowed it to happen more than once. The position that made me cover it up with lies to authorities. friends, family, and mostly myself.

I can map out every little tick of the relationship and "see" how things progressed. I can dissect it out to understand my own actions and reactions. But to this day, I can't put it together into a picture that makes sense.

Luckily, that was my one and only step into that irrational reality. Even now, I say what I always have said... If a man ever lays a hand on me, that is the last he will ever see of me. I just know that it is far easier to say than to do. I worked very hard to overcome the things I think led me to allow this... and pass that to my daughters (it happened long before their time, thank goodness).

When I say it now, I think I mean it... and believe it. May I never have to find out.

Even in my "darkest hours" I allowed it and may have accepted fault for the anger. But never once did I think think the violence was right or justified. It saddens me that these girls think that getting hit is acceptable... but all too often we see them here dealing with things that way. Not just with partners.

That is the greater issue for me. Violence.

People getting mad at each other and using violence to solve it. There are segments of our society that believe a simple "wrong glance" deserves a violent reaction. You can get beaten or killed for even the smallest perceived slight... you don't even have to know the offender.

When did violence become the first reaction and not the last?

[Rockin Ma]

I'm curious how the girls would answer if they then asked "what if this same situation was between your mother and father"

or "between you and your boyfriend"

[Castille]

While disturbing, I don't think this outlook of teenaged women is especially new. Young people are stupid. Most of us live long enough to get a little smarter, and thankfully most of us never have to live domestic violence lessons first hand. I had a pretty clear unacceptable domestic violence line as a teen, and I still ended up in a relationship with someone who turned out to be a mean-ass drunk that it took me a little time to accept there was no intervention to be had on the drinking problem front before I kicked him to the curb. I'd be a lot faster on that front today, ya know? I knew plenty of young women that tolerated totally unacceptable behavior in relationships though... because they loooooved him.

Oftentimes kids are more invested in the romance fantasy then the ugly reality staring them in the face and quick to blame themselves. Sort of like when I was bitten by a dog as a kid and always blamed myself instead of the dog. I laugh at that now, but it seemed rational to me at the time. My neice was recently bitten and I see the same thought process in her. It's just how kids filter the world through themselves. The "I-am-the-center-of-the-universe-so-it-must-be-me" syndrome I guess. They outgrow it in stages. Not counting the narcissists anyway.

It reminds me of how teen girls love that book Twilight and think the freaky stalkerish behavior like finding the guy having broken into her bedroom is just soooo romantic instead of sound reason to change the locks, buy a dog, and get a protection order. I think a more committed national campaign to make young people aware of what's crazy, inappropriate and red flagging things to come is the right place to start. Because yeah, teen girls are that stupid. But teen boys are too. And it's not a recent trend.

And while I wouldn't support a law telling anyone what risky relationships they aren't permitted to engage in - especially since in dv arrests there may not have been any party calling the police or complaining - I do think domestic violence should be an automatic CPS report, and given more scrutiny within that system.

[Harley_Tech]

My solution? Automatic dual restraining orders. Make it illegal for abused women to take back their men. Why not? We've got all sorts of legislation in place to protect people from their own bad judgment. This one might actually help prevent children being born into physically abusive households, which is better for everyone, right?

So you are saying the state has a say in who you can date, marry, co-habitat, have kids with?

So all those thousands of restraining orders that are violated each year, ending in the death of women across the country make you think this will work?

If you are OK with this plan, then why not just make every woman who is assaulted or abused be sterilized? That would assure fewer kids are born into abusive relationships wouldn't it? Better still, make both be sterilized and then they can get back together and beat and abuse each other till their little heart is content.

R

[Harley_Tech]

Doc, I didn't "go back".

Well then, he was not talking about you...

R

[Pixie]

So you are saying the state has a say in who you can date, marry, co-habitat, have kids with?

So all those thousands of restraining orders that are violated each year, ending in the death of women across the country make you think this will work?

If you are OK with this plan, then why not just make every woman who is assaulted or abused be sterilized? That would assure fewer kids are born into abusive relationships wouldn't it? Better still, make both be sterilized and then they can get back together and beat and abuse each other till their little heart is content.

R

Yeah, no way. If I want to get beaten daily - it's my business.

I always love your thinking though Athena!

[LDhummingbird]

It reminds me of how teen girls love that book Twilight and think the freaky stalkerish behavior like finding the guy having broken into her bedroom is just soooo romantic instead of sound reason to change the locks, buy a dog, and get a protection order. I think a more committed national campaign to make young people aware of what's crazy, inappropriate and red flagging things to come is the right place to start. Because yeah, teen girls are that stupid. But teen boys are too. And it's not a recent trend.

I kind of wish I could thank this two or three times, Castille. I'm glad to know I'm not the only one who thought the Twilight books had some really creepy, disturbing overtones to them, especially considering how many young women are completely enraptured by them.

[Harley_Tech]

My solution? Automatic dual restraining orders. Make it illegal for abused women to take back their men. Why not? We've got all sorts of legislation in place to protect people from their own bad judgment. This one might actually help prevent children being born into physically abusive households, which is better for everyone, right?

Since I disagree in a prior post I figured I should at least offer an alternative solution.

And Athena, I like the spirit of your plan, just not the plan to get to resolution.

How about in order to file a restraining order on an abusive spouse, the filer is required to attend a class taught by women that have seen the light and removed themselves from a similar situation. Maybe at a woman's safe haven (shelter) where they can listen to women who have made the break tell them all the things they experienced.

Listening to a judge, cop, prosecutor, etc. tell them about what they should do probably falls on deaf ears. Listening to someone that has "been there, done that" should carry a lot more weight IMO.

My only reservation about this plan is the the woman is likely to only hear the "Get out, get out NOW" plan of action instead of a mixture of that, and how the couple might work on repairing a broken relationship.

IMO a high priority should always be teaching both the abuser and the abused, how to live together in harmony without the violence and abuse.

R

[LDhummingbird]

How about in order to file a restraining order on an abusive spouse, the filer is required to attend a class taught by women that have seen the light and removed themselves from a similar situation. Maybe at a woman's safe haven (shelter) where they can listen to women who have made the break tell them all the things they experienced.
...
My only reservation about this plan is the the woman is likely to only hear the "Get out, get out NOW" plan of action instead of a mixture of that, and how the couple might work on repairing a broken relationship.

I like this. If you have to attend classes to get WIC, for example, and you can be ordered to attend therapy or classes of various kinds in other situations, why not in this one? I agree it might have the undesired side effect of making those filing the restraining/protective orders a little too jumpy, but maybe it'd make some of them think.

[Harley_Tech]

I like this. If you have to attend classes to get WIC, for example, and you can be ordered to attend therapy or classes of various kinds in other situations, why not in this one? I agree it might have the undesired side effect of making those filing the restraining/protective orders a little too jumpy, but maybe it'd make some of them think.

WOW! less than 10 post and one is in 3 things? I'm impressed. This can be a scary place and is not for the meek or thin skinned. :) Welcome! ATHENAAAAAAA, Hooked another one. :)

R

[Harley_Tech]

How screwy is this? As I type, Punk'd is on TV and this episode has both Chris Brown and RiHanna.

She is one very pretty girl. (I had never seen her before now, except her pic after Chris beat her up)

R

[LDhummingbird]

WOW! less than 10 post and one is in 3 things? I'm impressed. This can be a scary place and is not for the meek or thin skinned. :) Welcome! ATHENAAAAAAA, Hooked another one. :)

R

Heh, thanks. Not meaning to impress or anything, just stating my opinion.

[Alf]

My solution? Automatic dual restraining orders. Make it illegal for abused women to take back their men. Why not? We've got all sorts of legislation in place to protect people from their own bad judgment. This one might actually help prevent children being born into physically abusive households, which is better for everyone, right?

Big problem.

An active restraining order against a person is a disqualifying factor for firearms ownership. Where the injured party takes the aggressor back that's not such a big deal, but when I was working firearm sales I did sell quite a few Serious Handguns (defined as anything that fires a 9mm or bigger bullet with more than 250 ft-lbs of muzzle energy) to women that knew their exes would not stay away because a piece of paper told them to. Mutual restraining orders would have left them defenseless.

--Al

[Dakota Valkyrie]

Automatic restraining orders would be a useless waste of government time. If the parties don't want them, it's not going to happen.

In areas that have automatic arrest on DV calls - whether the victim wants to press charges or not - the victims rush to post bail for their abusers. The reasons are varied but all apply to why they would ignore the orders also.

It is very difficult to remove a victim from the situation and keep them out unless they themselves are committed to it. Ask any DV shelter.

When it comes to emotional, physical, and financial security, things get very convoluted in DV situations. It tends to defy "normal" logic and thinking.

You really can't make someone stop allowing themselves to get the snot kicked out of them if they don't want to. There have to be varied and plentiful options in place for victims of DV who truly want out but feel trapped. But if they don't want out, you can not make them... sad.

You can remove the abuser but that is no guarantee that it will not start again once he is out. You can take kids out of the situation, which I feel should happen more often.

DV victims need education before it happens and options while in the midst of it. They need counseling just to see how the available options can work for them, to say nothing about all the reasons that go with being a DV victim itself.

“She probably made him mad for him to react like that,” the other ninth grader said. “You know, like, bring it on?”

Even getting this generation of teenage girls to see violence as abuse has its own challenges. Tricia Rose, who teaches African-American culture at Brown, said that the singers and their young fans are a generation steeped in commercial hip-hop, which has influenced the smack-down tone of so many recent comments.

“This is the air that hip-hop breathes,” said Ms. Rose, author of “The Hip Hop Wars.” “The celebration of a stereotype of an aggressive, physical, often misogynistic masculinity that often justifies resolving conflict through violence. It can’t be held responsible for this, but it can’t be ignored.”

I don't necessarily think it's limited to a specific generation or even just dometic situations, but it does seem to me that there is a rise in the number of people acting and re-acting like they were spawned from a Jerry Springer show.

[brokenandtwisted]

This news is really startling, actually. To be honest Rihanna doesn't appear to be exceptionally bright. She became a star in her teens and as we all know from the past ten years - celebrity teens don't quickly mature. Aside from that, they're also reading A Handmaid's Tale in high schools now. If that isn't the most diabolical portrayal of the female condition then I don't know what is.

My solution? Automatic dual restraining orders. Make it illegal for abused women to take back their men. Why not? We've got all sorts of legislation in place to protect people from their own bad judgment. This one might actually help prevent children being born into physically abusive households, which is better for everyone, right?

Improbable, Athena. Sure, it's logical...but you're ignoring the biochemical aspect of a relationship. Love, limerence or what have you is basically a complex chemical process. So...my solution would be to drug them both so they never want to see one another again.

I kind of wish I could thank this two or three times, Castille. I'm glad to know I'm not the only one who thought the Twilight books had some really creepy, disturbing overtones to them, especially considering how many young women are completely enraptured by them.

Awww, come on... a stalker 90 years older than you that watches you sleep, impregnates you with an abomination and turns you into an eternally damned creature of Hell is totally romantic. Personally I was more-so horrified about the Mormon undertone, but whatever.

Big problem.

An active restraining order against a person is a disqualifying factor for firearms ownership. Where the injured party takes the aggressor back that's not such a big deal, but when I was working firearm sales I did sell quite a few Serious Handguns (defined as anything that fires a 9mm or bigger bullet with more than 250 ft-lbs of muzzle energy) to women that knew their exes would not stay away because a piece of paper told them to. Mutual restraining orders would have left them defenseless.

--Al

Yes, because we all know a trigger-happy nation needs more firearms. I'm a huge fan of paranoia, I find its' psychological element fascinating - but not on the scale, albeit latent psychological scale, of America's firearm obsession. I believe that would warrant discussion in another thread though.