Chicago more dangerous than Iraq?

[Piper]

125 Shot Dead In Chicago Over Summer
Total Is About Double The U.S. Troop Death Toll In Iraq
CHICAGO (CBS) ― An estimated 125 people were shot and killed over the summer. That's nearly double the number of U.S. soldiers killed in Iraq over the same time period.

In May, cbs2chicago.com began tracking city shootings and posting them on Google maps. Information compiled from our reporters, wire service reports and the Chicago Police Major Incidents log indicated that 125 people were shot and killed throughout the city between the start of Memorial Day weekend on May 26, and the end of Labor Day on Sept. 1.

According to the Defense Department, 65 U.S. soldiers were killed in combat in Iraq. About the same number were killed in Afghanistan over that same period.

In the same time period, an estimated 247 people were shot and wounded in the city.

http://cbs2chicago.com/local/chicago.summer.shootings.2.810166.html

Obama should go back to Illinois and be a better "community organizer"

[Just my luck sucks]

Scary. Accidentlly got off the freeway once, while trying to bypass Chicago.

Ended out at an Italian restaurant--some of the best food I've ever eaten. But, being from the Seattle area and not knowing the Chicago neighborhoods probably wasn't the smartest move I've ever made--venturing into a strange area in the dark...

[katyk]

Is is sad that the first thing I thought when I read the headline was, "what does Peter Cetera have to do with Iraq?" But then I got it.

I have a friend who moved to Chicago out of college. For the entire 2 years she was there, she witnessed about 6 gang fights in her front yard, and as a reporter for a newspaper, her story assignments were 90% homicides. Anyhoo, she just moved back to NM and is happy again.

[Athena]

From TheAgitator.com (http://www.theagitator.com/2008/09/05/iraq-and-chicago/):


An estimated 125 people were shot and killed over the summer. That’s nearly double the number of U.S. soldiers killed in Iraq over the same time period.

War proponents are using that line to draw the asinine implication that we’ve made Iraq as safe as Chicago.

I don’t mean to insult you by explaining this, but here goes: The CBS story is comparing homicides in the entire city of Chicago with the number of U.S. troops killed in Iraq. There have been 125 citizen deaths in Chicago since Memorial Day. Depending on who’s doing the counting, there have been 1,000-2,500 citizen deaths in Iraq.

I can’t find a site that looks specifically at Baghdad deaths over that period, which would be the most appropriate comparison to Chicago, but it doesn’t take much effort to show how ridiculous the comparison really is:

- A car bomb killed 63 people on a single day in June.
- Another 32 were killed on a single day in July.
- Seventeen died in a bombing three weeks ago.
- Another 25 were killed in an attack at the end of August.

That’s a quick Google search of the first few stories about mass bombings in Baghdad this summer, and we’re already well over 125 fatalities.

If U.S. troops were gangbangers on the south side of Chicago maybe, maybe, they’d have a greater chance of violent death than they do on duty in Iraq. But to look at these figures and draw the broad conclusion that all of Chicago is as safe as all of Iraq–even in gest–is not only intellectually dishonest, it’s pretty insulting to the people who live in both places.

[Piper]

Athena- you don't insult me at all. One reason I posted this is to show that so much depends on how the media spins things. These deaths in Chicago are citizens who don't wake up that morning generally expecting to die. The deaths you made mention of are also citizens but their everyday lives are full of dangers such as car bombs and suicide bombers. These events existed prior to our engagement and will more than likely be there after we leave (18 months if Obama has his way). The main difference is that as long as the draft is not in effect these soldiers have chosen to be there (or at least knew what they were getting into). Unlike the people in Chicago who simply cannot afford to move to a safer neighborhood.

Perhaps we should utilize more resources here on the domestic front and try to make places safe for all, perhaps we should just say "screw you" to those people living in Iraq everyday under these conditions and just focus on things at home.

[Dakota Valkyrie]

... be there after we leave (18 months if Obama has his way).
Every quote I've heard (and I don't listen to that many - so missed a lot) has Obama saying "combat troops" out in 18 months. We have non-combat troops all over the world. I'll lay money that we will have troops in Iraq for a long time even if Obama has his way. In fact, I don't think Obama is saying anything that isn't already planned. He just put a date on it... current plans involve, always have involved, pull out when the Iraqis are able. ("able" being the key sticking point). I don't get all "woo woo" about Obama and his plans... it's in the works already.

Since the Iraqis are in charge of Baghdad security, I don't see how a rush to pull out is going to help.

Next week my husband leaves for his second tour (4 months). I don't mind one bit. As a soldier, he was safer in Baghdad than Chicago and even on many highways. If he was out with the civilians, I would worry.

[mjkforever]

It's true that the murder rate in Chicago has increased over 18% from 2007, after an overall decline in 2006.

I've lived in Chicago from 1977 until moving out to the suburbs in 2003. Yes, certain neighborhoods (known for their heavy gang activity) are more dangerous than others. But I sort of bristle at the implication that it's a more dangerous than being in Iraq. That news article compares the number of US soldiers killed in Iraq, not overall murders, which, as Athena references, is much higher.

I loved living in the city, and like with most everything, you take the good with the bad. I moved out to the suburbs because it was just too expensive to buy a decent house in a decent neighborhood in the city. Not because of the crime - although I sure don't miss it, or the horrible traffic and parking, or higher-priced goods and higher taxes. But then again, I don't miss the White Sox fans, either.

I would gladly walk down a Chicago inner-city street (probably deemed unsafe by someone who doesn't live here) as a free citizen than to be in Iraq for one minute.

[Pete Bondurant]

I feel safer in Chicago than anywhere in South Africa.