Why Do We Tolerate Unions?

[Athena]

If anyone, ANYONE here thinks they can defend the continued existance of the American union, please, give it a try. I haven't laughed yet, today.

700 NYC teachers are paid to do nothing

NEW YORK – Hundreds of New York City public school teachers accused of offenses ranging from insubordination to sexual misconduct are being paid their full salaries to sit around all day playing Scrabble, surfing the Internet or just staring at the wall, if that's what they want to do.

Because their union contract makes it extremely difficult to fire them, the teachers have been banished by the school system to its "rubber rooms" — off-campus office space where they wait months, even years, for their disciplinary hearings.

The 700 or so teachers can practice yoga, work on their novels, paint portraits of their colleagues — pretty much anything but school work. They have summer vacation just like their classroom colleagues and enjoy weekends and holidays through the school year.

"You just basically sit there for eight hours," said Orlando Ramos, who spent seven months in a rubber room, officially known as a temporary reassignment center, in 2004-05. "I saw several near-fights. `This is my seat.' `I've been sitting here for six months.' That sort of thing."

Ramos was an assistant principal in East Harlem when he was accused of lying at a hearing on whether to suspend a student. Ramos denied the allegation but quit before his case was resolved and took a job in California.

Because the teachers collect their full salaries of $70,000 or more, the city Department of Education estimates the practice costs the taxpayers $65 million a year. The department blames union rules.

Read more (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090622/ap_on_re_us/us_rubber_rooms;_ylt=AohstOM7Tz5hnN384Yp0wPsDW7oF)

Between the Boeing stike last year, the utter ridiculousness I've witnessed over the years in union shops and certainly the number of absolutely incompetent teachers I've met in my lifetime, I'm so fucking fed up with the drain on American industry that is unions, I'm beyond holding the union in general accountable. Fuck union employees, who greedily turn a blind eye to the malfeasance while they suck on the lucrative tit of mediocrity.

I wonder how many books or facilities $65 million could cover annually?

[Peeperann]

Growing up the grandchild, child and niece of GM shop rats, I believed in unions, backed them completely. But that was back when they did what they were supposed to. Got OSHA standards set up, keep safe working conditions, ect.

But now they just bloat peoples pay, pad their own pockets, cause all kids of trouble, and cost way more than they are worth. So all in all, they should be dis-banded. Look at the trouble they've caused GM.

There was a survey of auto workers, and Toyota and some others that have factories in the US have no unions and their workers were so happy. They had comparable pay, safe working conditions, their bosses treated them great. Guess who were the most unhappy auto workers? GM who has the UAW. It's because the UAW is always telling the workers that the company is trying to screw them, ect.

[McQuest]

these mafia wannabe fuckers feel people are entitled to a paycheck no matter what.
Having a job, working it, and earning a paycheck is a PRIVALEGE just like holding a drivers license. I think many Americans are realizing that in these times now more than ever. I don't know where these assholes get their sense of entitlement but they can suck the big one in the sky far as I care.
I've worked with Union crews, I could build a whole raquetball court by myself in the time their whole crew took to build one little classroom.

Measure the board, take a break. Get the saw out, take a break. Plug the saw in, take a break. Put the saw on the board near the cut, take a break. Make the cut, take a break.
That's about how it goes.

[McQuest]

Growing up the grandchild, child and niece of GM shop rats, I believed in unions, backed them completely. But that was back when they did what they were supposed to. Got OSHA standards set up, keep safe working conditions, ect.

They were definatly started with the worker in mind. To protect the rights of the hard working man. I don't know if the once hard working man is now taking advantage or what. But the only people I see benifiting from the Union anymore are those without work ethics.

[Stella]

They were definatly started with the worker in mind. To protect the rights of the hard working man. I don't know if the once hard working man is now taking advantage or what. But the only people I see benifiting from the Union anymore are those without work ethics.

Completely agree. It began well enough but has run its course.

{S}

[Zealant]

If anyone, ANYONE here thinks they can defend the continued existance of the American union, please, give it a try. I haven't laughed yet, today.

I beileve in God, and that my prayers are answered, but Unions? Let's not push it.

I think unions had their day, but have since outlived their usefulness for the most part. I don't actually feel the unions do all that much for the workers today either. Where was the union this week when a young construction worker died from the heat yesterday in a city only an hour from me.

[petrina]

If anyone, ANYONE here thinks they can defend the continued existance of the American union, please, give it a try. I haven't laughed yet, today.

careful - i might have your kneecaps broken

[Harley_Tech]

Good effin question! No, there is not anyone that can defend them with logical thought. Their time has come and gone. The fatcats screaming that company execs make to much are making just as much off the backs of their membership.

Sounds a lot like pissing on my leg and telling me its raining...

R

[MichaelJCheaney]

Here is a good case of union incompetence:

Part of my weekend gig is delivering lime to U.S. Steel in the toilet bowl that is called Gary Indiana.
(So yes It can be said that I wake every Saturday and Sunday with my head firmly entrenched in the toilet bowl)

U.S. Steel invested 1 BILLION dollars in a new "Super Furnace" produce more steel and better quality steel

Well that 1 BILLION dollar investment was ruined in exactly 4 months, when some over paid union guys neglected to check the temperature a blasted a hole in the side of the blast furnace....(this apparently occurred many times over the course of the 4 months, and the furnace was routinely run at temps that FAR exceeded the normal operating temps)

9 guys were supposed to be fired but due to their union contracts they can't be.....

Unions: Rewarding incompetence for over 100 years!

[petrina]

i dont really see much difference between unions, farm subsidies, and old boy networks in general. except i can see some good in unions - theoretically.

we can all cite fucked up things that were done in the name of unionizing. that doesnt mean that everything they do is fucked up.

ive lived in union cities and non-union cities. they both have their own challenges. high prices for product and a hard time firing the asshat vs shitty pay and work conditions across the board and little to no standards in regard to operating procedures.

[brokenandtwisted]

Unions are so...Communist.

[Just my luck sucks]

I hate, hate, HATE Unions!

I work for a company that has both union and non union entities. The non union entities have had their employee’s work 3 and 4 day work weeks so they would not have to lay anyone off. The union group unfortunately cannot offer that solution, so we are laying off people.

I personally know that in this economic time, the 200 people who are working reduced hours are much happier than the 200 we just laid off due to us not being able to reduce hours.

The union does not allow us, as a business to be nimble enough to offer flexible solutions to today's changing economic climate.

Trouble is, the unions aren’t just “tolerated” they are granted protections under the law not granted to business itself.

We checked into selling our trucks, a solid business decision because we can rent trucks cheaper than it costs us to run our own with a union driver. The union reps big dealed the possible transaction saying it wasn’t a valid business move we were making, rather, it was our desire to “bust” the union. Our attorney’s advised that we keep the fleet as legal fees fighting the union and the NLRB would crush us.

Instead, as it is a truck breaks down, we can’t afford to fix it –it sets, and we rent trucks anyway….stupid tit for tat games that are costing US business and productivity.

I could go on and on, how they protect moron members...etc just suffice it to say I HATE unions!

[DarkPrincess]

My dad's a Teamster. His job requires it, but they haven't done a damn thing for him. The Italians get everything, everybody else on the job is on their own.

[Pete Bondurant]

They'll only get worse under B.O.

[swivel]

I disagree with those of you that say unions EVER had a fucking place. Bullshit. Working conditions were already improving, and would have continued to improve, without their heavy-handed tactics. Competition in the workplace has improved the lives of workers far more than unions and government regulation. Looking at two or three examples of unions winning minor concessions, and trying to justify the waste, violence, and damage caused to global markets by work stoppages is like trying to justify religion because of a few soup kitchens.

Fuck unions. The soon we get rid of them, the better. Democrats fighting to expose union votes in the workplace is probably the worst atrocity in American politics right now, and nobody gives a shit.

[solange82200]

What I dont get about unions is why do only certain types of jobs get it? If the rest of us are able to get by without them, why cant they?


I hate, hate, HATE Unions!

I work for a company that has both union and non union entities. The non union entities have had their employee’s work 3 and 4 day work weeks so they would not have to lay anyone off. The union group unfortunately cannot offer that solution, so we are laying off people.

I personally know that in this economic time, the 200 people who are working reduced hours are much happier than the 200 we just laid off due to us not being able to reduce hours.

The union does not allow us, as a business to be nimble enough to offer flexible solutions to today's changing economic climate.

Trouble is, the unions aren’t just “tolerated” they are granted protections under the law not granted to business itself.

We checked into selling our trucks, a solid business decision because we can rent trucks cheaper than it costs us to run our own with a union driver. The union reps big dealed the possible transaction saying it wasn’t a valid business move we were making, rather, it was our desire to “bust” the union. Our attorney’s advised that we keep the fleet as legal fees fighting the union and the NLRB would crush us.

Instead, as it is a truck breaks down, we can’t afford to fix it –it sets, and we rent trucks anyway….stupid tit for tat games that are costing US business and productivity.

I could go on and on, how they protect moron members...etc just suffice it to say I HATE unions!

Thanks for that real life example, I honestly was very ignorant to the damage that unions cause. Wow, I hope the Demorats can wake up on this one.

[biteme]

My dad's a Teamster. His job requires it, but they haven't done a damn thing for him. The Italians get everything, everybody else on the job is on their own.

Maybe you don't get anything because your family's a bunch of racist disgusting lazy losers. Could it be the italians work for what they get?
How are other hard working teamsters not related to you doing, bet they're doing alright even the non italians
LOL

[biteme]

I beileve in God, and that my prayers are answered, but Unions? Let's not push it.

I think unions had their day, but have since outlived their usefulness for the most part. I don't actually feel the unions do all that much for the workers today either. Where was the union this week when a young construction worker died from the heat yesterday in a city only an hour from me.
I agree they had their day. However workers today don't realize they wouldn't have the current benefets without the union of old, and as the union loses more and more power, employees lose more and more benefits, it's slowly reverting back to the 10 to 12 hour days without overtime if you want to get ahead, and emplyees are paying for medical benefits they didn't when the union was strong
You should realize the only reason employers where giving employees benefits was to keep the union out not competition amongst themselves
And you are slowly losing those benefits as the union loses.
I believe the unions went to far and screwed themselves, but in the end it will be the employees that lose. Companies do not give anything out of the goodness of their hearts

[biteme]

I disagree with those of you that say unions EVER had a fucking place. Bullshit. Working conditions were already improving, and would have continued to improve, without their heavy-handed tactics. Competition in the workplace has improved the lives of workers far more than unions and government regulation. Looking at two or three examples of unions winning minor concessions, and trying to justify the waste, violence, and damage caused to global markets by work stoppages is like trying to justify religion because of a few soup kitchens.

Fuck unions. The soon we get rid of them, the better. Democrats fighting to expose union votes in the workplace is probably the worst atrocity in American politics right now, and nobody gives a shit.
what the world really needs is to get rid of all lawyers and physcobabalist, the physcobabalist do more damage to people than every illness combined

[pissedoffindaytona]

I agree they had their day. However workers today don't realize they wouldn't have the current benefets without the union of old, and as the union loses more and more power, employees lose more and more benefits, it's slowly reverting back to the 10 to 12 hour days without overtime if you want to get ahead, and emplyees are paying for medical benefits they didn't when the union was strong
You should realize the only reason employers where giving employees benefits was to keep the union out not competition amongst themselves
And you are slowly losing those benefits as the union loses.
I believe the unions went to far and screwed themselves, but in the end it will be the employees that lose. Companies do not give anything out of the goodness of their hearts

Yup very true, My son was in the union for many years till he moved to florida, he had a plan with $6000.00 in it the last time he checked 2 yrs ago, he's been paying into the plan even though he wasn't working thru them, He got a letter stating he can cash out as a financial bailout, his statement read $1200, he cashed out and called them to tell them to fuck themselves, at least he wasn't charged the 20% penalty

[DarkPrincess]

Maybe you don't get anything because your family's a bunch of racist disgusting lazy losers. Could it be the italians work for what they get?
How are other hard working teamsters not related to you doing, bet they're doing alright even the non italians
LOL

Or because they run the union. My father works more than the 20 somethings on his job and he's 62 years old. You're trying to start shit because that's what you do. I've seen your posts, speaking of racist disgusting losers.....

[biteme]

Or because they run the union. My father works more than the 20 somethings on his job and he's 62 years old. You're trying to start shit because that's what you do. I've seen your posts, speaking of racist disgusting losers.....
Originally Posted by DarkPrincess
My dad's a Teamster. His job requires it, but they haven't done a damn thing for him. The Italians get everything, everybody else on the job is on their own.

I see it's Ok for you to make derogatory comments about Italians
but heaven forbid someone should throw it back in your face
I'm trying to start shit, I didn't like your derogatory comment about another race, and responded in kind
maybe you need to take a good look at yourself

[DarkPrincess]

Originally Posted by DarkPrincess
My dad's a Teamster. His job requires it, but they haven't done a damn thing for him. The Italians get everything, everybody else on the job is on their own.

I see it's Ok for you to make derogatory comments about Italians
but heaven forbid someone should throw it back in your face
I'm trying to start shit, I didn't like your derogatory comment about another race, and responded in kind
maybe you need to take a good look at yourself

If I said all Italians were like that sure. I'm talking about on my father's job. That's how it is. If the Jamaicans were running the union there and only did favors for their own, I'd say the same shit about them. Or any other group of people. Maybe you need to start living in the real world. I've had Italian friends, still do. So don't even fuckin' go there.

[crown]

If anyone, ANYONE here thinks they can defend the continued existance of the American union, please, give it a try. I haven't laughed yet, today.
Q: Why do we tolerate unions?


They are a necessary evil.

If employers were more trustworthy, and we didn't have to constantly babysit them to do the right thing in situations that pertain to employee safety and protection then unions would be absolete by now.

Unions,employers, and employees are prone to self serve. Unions give us the elusion that there is some arbitrator between the boss/company and an employee. That was their original sales pitch, it didn't last long, till is was full of mob bosses and corruption and now serves mainly the lazy workers and themselves.

They have no defense that is merely MO on why we tolerate them.

[Pete Bondurant]

Labour unions are simply a cash-box for the Democratic Party.