Melissa G. Dean raised ungrateful brats

[Rotten Apple]

OCALA, Fla. -- A Central Florida mother of four boys was arrested on Tuesday after telling authorities that she went "on strike" more than a month ago, leaving the teens home alone for hours every day because they would constantly fight.

Melissa G. Dean, 33, was charged with child neglect after telling Ocala police and the Department of Children and Families that she leaves her children, ages 17, 16, 14 and 13, home alone.

http://www.local6.com/news/15357269/detail.html

____

Read the article. I feel for this woman. Looks like she had the first one at 16 and was a single mother. I seriously don't think what she did was all that bad. The boys were not babies.

And besides, it probably kept her from smothering them in their sleep.

[impqueen]

yeah, i'm doing this one now. Honestly, she maybe went too far, but I can see why.

[ells9824]

Guess it just depends on which way the wind is blowing. Some moms get cute opinion pieces when they go on strike, this one gets warrants.
Meh..:confused:

[Rotten Apple]

Heh!

The little hellions are still causing trouble!

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,331690,00.html

[LadyValkyrie37]

This is not a case of the mother leaving the teens at home alone to go to the grocery store. The article says that she stayed at a friends house and only spent one night a week at home with her children. The article even says that she would cook meals and bring it over to her house for her children to eat. In my opinion, she should be charged with neglect. Instead of having a backbone, staying in her house with her children, being the mother that her children obviously need her to be, she tucked tail and ran away. We have a name for such parents... deadbeats. In my opinion, something has been wrong in her home long before she left. Kids just don't become rebellious, mean, nasty, and disrespectful overnight. It's obvious that the mother has personal issues when it comes to confrontation when dealing with her own children.

Oh by the way, that woman is 33 years old... same age as me. Her oldest is 17. My oldest is 16. She had her first child a year before me when she was 15. I speak from experience, maybe she didn't have good role models to go by when it comes to knowing how to be a good mother. Still, it's no excuse for running out on her kids. I had no role model either to go by, yet, somehow, I'm doing everything I possibly can to not make the same mistakes as my parents did that has landed me in therapy for all these years.

BTW, anyone else notice that she looks a lot older than 33? I can see in her eyes and in the lines in her face, she's led a very hard life.

[Rotten Apple]

This is not a case of the mother leaving the teens at home alone to go to the grocery store. The article says that she stayed at a friends house and only spent one night a week at home with her children. The article even says that she would cook meals and bring it over to her house for her children to eat. In my opinion, she should be charged with neglect.



Hmmm... she checked on them daily, made sure they were fed, and still kept a roof over their heads, but you think she should be charged with neglect?

And it is obvious that something was wrong in that home way before she left, she stated that she tried to get help but no one would help her. She only left after she got desperate.

And if she abandoned her kids, then their father(s) need to be charged as well. She didn't reproduce asexually.

It may not have been the best decision, but they are wasting their time on this. They need to go after real criminals.

BTW, 33-17 = 16.


Oh yeah, does anyone know where the boys are now? If she's in jail, shouldn't they be in foster care? Obviously, allowing them to live at that house alone is a crime.

[ells9824]

Oh yeah, does anyone know where the boys are now? If she's in jail, shouldn't they be in foster care? Obviously, allowing them to live at that house alone is a crime.

I think I read they were staying with neighbors after the kids chased DFS off. I'll have to go back and look.

[Rotten Apple]

I think I read they were staying with neighbors after the kids chased DFS off. I'll have to go back and look.

They chased DFS off? and this woman is being neglectful?

PUH-LEASE!:rolleyes:

[ells9824]

~~~~~~~~~~~
Sorry,they chased and threatened reporters. They didn't physically threaten the DFS, but both police and DFS were there, and the kids ARE STILL WITH THE NEIGHBORS!
~~~~~~~~~~~

On Wednesday FOX 35 sent a reporter and photographer to the family's home for a story. When they got there Dean’s sons walked up to the news car when they pulled up and started swearing, and yelling out racial slurs three times the kids came back at the news crew. After the first time, the FOX 35 news crew called 911. The four kids then surrounded the FOX 35 news photographer. One of the kids stood behind him with a pipe in his hand while another kid threatened to hit him.

When police showed up they talked to some of the kids, who had scattered then took a report. A woman with the Department of Children and Families also showed up. We’re told the boys are staying with neighbors. No word on where the mother is after bonding out of jail.

[LadyValkyrie37]

Hmmm... she checked on them daily, made sure they were fed, and still kept a roof over their heads, but you think she should be charged with neglect?

And it is obvious that something was wrong in that home way before she left, she stated that she tried to get help but no one would help her. She only left after she got desperate.

And if she abandoned her kids, then their father(s) need to be charged as well. She didn't reproduce asexually.

It may not have been the best decision, but they are wasting their time on this. They need to go after real criminals.

BTW, 33-17 = 16.


Oh yeah, does anyone know where the boys are now? If she's in jail, shouldn't they be in foster care? Obviously, allowing them to live at that house alone is a crime.



You make it sound like the children are pets that a neighbor is kindly checking in on while the owner is away on vacation. There is more to being a parent than keeping a roof over a child's head and keeping food in their belly. And yes, she asked for help in the past, but is it really anyone else's responsibility to make her children behave? I don't think so. She is the mother and therefore is ultimately responsible for how her children are reared and disciplined. If she has problems dealing with how to proprerly discipline her children then she has the right to seek counseling/therapy for herself and/or her children. Did she do that? There are parenting classes and support groups that she could seek out. Did she do that? It seems that what she wanted was for someone, anyone, to be the parent for her. She said she petitioned the police and the courts to help her. It is not the police's or the court's responsibility to rear and discipline her children! It's her responsibility!

As for your little math lesson, It all depends upon both the mother and child's bithday. My birthday is 9/16/74 and my son's birthday is 8/31/91... I was 16 when I had him and he is 16 years old now.

Oh and the following article http://www.ocala.com/article/20080220/BREAKING_NEWS/983782670/1356/NEWS01 says that she's 43 which makes more sense as to why she looks much older than 33.

[Rotten Apple]

You make it sound like the children are pets that a neighbor is kindly checking in on while the owner is away on vacation. There is more to being a parent than keeping a roof over a child's head and keeping food in their belly. And yes, she asked for help in the past, but is it really anyone else's responsibility to make her children behave? I don't think so. She is the mother and therefore is ultimately responsible for how her children are reared and disciplined. If she has problems dealing with how to proprerly discipline her children then she has the right to seek counseling/therapy for herself and/or her children. Did she do that? There are parenting classes and support groups that she could seek out. Did she do that? It seems that what she wanted was for someone, anyone, to be the parent for her. She said she petitioned the police and the courts to help her. It is not the police's or the court's responsibility to rear and discipline her children! It's her responsibility!

As for your little math lesson, It all depends upon both the mother and child's bithday. My birthday is 9/16/74 and my son's birthday is 8/31/91... I was 16 when I had him and he is 16 years old now.

Oh and the following article http://www.ocala.com/article/20080220/BREAKING_NEWS/983782670/1356/NEWS01 says that she's 43 which makes more sense as to why she looks much older than 33.

I am 33 also. And I am also a parent. I don't need lessons on how children are not pets. I am very much aware of that. It is her ultimate responsibility and I 'm sure counseling and therapy are within the financial means of someone who is NOT a single mother with four teenage boys, but I doubt it was something she could afford. So she did the next best thing, went through the courts where it would probably have been provided free of charge if it had been ordered.

Now. I still stand by what I said. They are wasting taxpayer money on this case.

These are not infants or small children we are talking about, these are teenage boys who from the looks of the video seem to be larger than I am. Maybe this woman feared for her safety. Would you rather have stayed around until one of them hurt her, or she ended up hurting them?

There was no harm done here.

And oh yeah, unless you have some inside information on their birthdays, 33-17 still = 16.

However, 43 does make more sense.

[thepooh5]

OCALA, Fla. -- A Central Florida mother of four boys was arrested on Tuesday after telling authorities that she went "on strike" more than a month ago, leaving the teens home alone for hours every day because they would constantly fight.

Melissa G. Dean, 33, was charged with child neglect after telling Ocala police and the Department of Children and Families that she leaves her children, ages 17, 16, 14 and 13, home alone.

http://www.local6.com/news/15357269/detail.html

____

Read the article. I feel for this woman. Looks like she had the first one at 16 and was a single mother. I seriously don't think what she did was all that bad. The boys were not babies.

And besides, it probably kept her from smothering them in their sleep.


I couldn't agree more. This woman being prosecuted is almost as bad as the Teresa Baker story, from WVA. :mad: I have never struck my child - I have spanked him - but honestly, if my son ever talked to me like that, I would sock him right in that big nasty mouth of his. I think these boys were probably physically abusing this woman and she is too ashamed to admitt it. :mad:

[LadyValkyrie37]

I am 33 also. And I am also a parent. I don't need lessons on how children are not pets. I am very much aware of that. It is her ultimate responsibility and I 'm sure counseling and therapy are within the financial means of someone who is NOT a single mother with four teenage boys, but I doubt it was something she could afford. So she did the next best thing, went through the courts where it would probably have been provided free of charge if it had been ordered.

Now. I still stand by what I said. They are wasting taxpayer money on this case.

These are not infants or small children we are talking about, these are teenage boys who from the looks of the video seem to be larger than I am. Maybe this woman feared for her safety. Would you rather have stayed around until one of them hurt her, or she ended up hurting them?

There was no harm done here.

And oh yeah, unless you have some inside information on their birthdays, 33-17 still = 16.

However, 43 does make more sense.

Please do not preach to me about the whoas of being a single mother. I've been a single working mother. If a mother truely cares and wishes for things to change, she will do what is needed for that change to happen. That may mean taking advantage of certain programs that are in place for those like struggling single mothers. I've lived in 3 different states and I've attended state funded counseling centers in all three states. Such facilities take most all forms of insurance and even have what is called a sliding scale fee for those who have no insurance at all. Those fees are usually very, very low... just a mere fraction of what a counselor, therapist, or psychiatrist would normally get. Every state in this nation has state funded medicaid that a single mother with a low income and no access to health insurance can take advantage of. Some states like Pennsylvania have a program that is called chip http://www.chipcoverspakids.com/ that is health insurance for those families who make too much money to be considered to be eligible for state funded medicaid programs. The key is swallowing ones pride and doing what must be done so one can bring one's family out of darkness and into light. There is help for single mothers is they will choose to help themselves. Melissa G. Dean chose to run away from her problem.

If any of her children hurt her it would be because she never taught them to respect her as an authority figure. Instead they would see her as an equal or even inferior. If her children hurt her, she would be reaping what she sowed. You will get out of your children what you put into them. The same goes for life... you get out of life what you put into it.

If she hurt her children, we are back to the square one, she would be charged with child abuse and she still has major issues within herself that she needs to work on in therapy. But in my opinion, she is hurting her children by running away from them and running away from the problems instead of facing them head on. She's not teaching her children anything except the concept of "When things get tough, tuck tail and run for the hills."

[thepooh5]

"Oh yeah, does anyone know where the boys are now? If she's in jail, shouldn't they be in foster care? Obviously, allowing them to live at that house alone is a crime."

Exactly - if they can charge her, why wasn't DFS, charged for leaving the "little babies" at the home once the mother was arrested?

*still fuming* :mad:

[thepooh5]

"If any of her children hurt her it would be because she never taught them to respect her as an authority figure. Instead they would see her as an equal or even inferior. If her children hurt her, she would be reaping what she sowed. You will get out of your children what you put into them. The same goes for life... you get out of life what you put into it."

Are you kidding me? She is out numbered and out sized - out everything - except her bratty kids - that not even family and childrens services are willing to deal with. Hell, if the neighbors are good enough while she was in jail, why weren't they good enough when she left. Why aren't you bashing DFS? You know saying that she should have raised them better, may just come back to bite you in the ass. Your son, like mine, is 16 - we're not out of the woods yet.

I have taught my son right from wrong from day one. I have taught him respect from day one. But, it is crazy to believe, if for whatever reason, my son chose to start acting like this, that I could physically handle him. He is bigger and stronger. And I would guess it is the same with your son. So what are you gonna do if he suddenly goes bad in his teen years? - as some teens do, unexpectedly and with good parents.

So the kids are out of hand - and the courts won't help. Just what is getting some counseling, for herself gonna do for their bad behavior? And you said she should get them some help - who is gonna make them get in the car and go? She would have to have a court order, for anyone to "make" them, because I'm quite sure that the boys would not attend by themselves or because she asked them to attend. In fact, I wouldn't care to venture, that even with a court order, they still wouldn't go - they would be arrested first.

I can't believe the behavior those boys displayed - but to fault her and her parenting skills, is pretty sad. Had she been a non-caring mother, she wouldn't have left, she would have got rid of them. Had she been non-caring, she wouldn't have been feeding them and calling daily and going back to the abuse one night a week.

[Rotten Apple]

LadyValkyrie -
You can go on and on about what a horrible person this woman is. You can't convince me. From the facts that are available to me, I truly feel that she had done what she could and was at her wits end. She tried to deal with the problem in the only way she knew how. She had no luck. Obviously, her contact with the courts and police did not help her to become aware of the programs you say are readily available out there.

And I refuse to accept your argument that she would be reaping what she sowed if her children hurt her. She should just stick around because you think she deserved it? Screw that.

And seeing as she had daily contact with her children and knew they were physically healthy, I don't see how that can be seen as "running away." Go check out the front page. You will see the true meaning of neglect. Letting an infant starve to death while his skin is rotting from sitting in his own waste is neglect. Trying to teach some spoiled teens a lesson is not. She did not leave the state, she did not leave the city. She did not leave with no way for the teens to contact her. She knew what was going on at her home.

Prosecuting her is a complete waste of taxpayer money.

[thepooh5]

How in the hell does one - groan a comment?

[impqueen]

How in the hell does one - groan a comment?

Just push the little groan button on the bottom right. But not on mine, because I rule :)

I have the jail records linked on the front page article on Melissa Dean, and she is 43. She still looks exhausted to me.

I can't judge this mother. I can judge Tracy Hermann. I can judge Caren Kohberger. I can judge pretty much every mom that makes our front page that isn't in the comments. But this woman? Can't do it. She may not have been the most effective parent, but she did not kill her children or leave them wholly unattended. She spoke to them by phone daily. This mom, after seeing her kids, deserves an acquittal.

[thepooh5]

"Just push the little groan button on the bottom right. But not on mine, because I rule"

I see thanks, quote, quote +, and quik reply. I don't see a groan - maybe I'm blind - we already know I'm dumber than a box of rocks.

And yes you do rule - whoops, now I'll have to say something nice to Morbid and feed the ego.

[LadyValkyrie37]

"If any of her children hurt her it would be because she never taught them to respect her as an authority figure. Instead they would see her as an equal or even inferior. If her children hurt her, she would be reaping what she sowed. You will get out of your children what you put into them. The same goes for life... you get out of life what you put into it."

Are you kidding me? She is out numbered and out sized - out everything - except her bratty kids - that not even family and childrens services are willing to deal with. Hell, if the neighbors are good enough while she was in jail, why weren't they good enough when she left. Why aren't you bashing DFS? You know saying that she should have raised them better, may just come back to bite you in the ass. Your son, like mine, is 16 - we're not out of the woods yet.

I have taught my son right from wrong from day one. I have taught him respect from day one. But, it is crazy to believe, if for whatever reason, my son chose to start acting like this, that I could physically handle him. He is bigger and stronger. And I would guess it is the same with your son. So what are you gonna do if he suddenly goes bad in his teen years? - as some teens do, unexpectedly and with good parents.

So the kids are out of hand - and the courts won't help. Just what is getting some counseling, for herself gonna do for their bad behavior? And you said she should get them some help - who is gonna make them get in the car and go? She would have to have a court order, for anyone to "make" them, because I'm quite sure that the boys would not attend by themselves or because she asked them to attend. In fact, I wouldn't care to venture, that even with a court order, they still wouldn't go - they would be arrested first.

I can't believe the behavior those boys displayed - but to fault her and her parenting skills, is pretty sad. Had she been a non-caring mother, she wouldn't have left, she would have got rid of them. Had she been non-caring, she wouldn't have been feeding them and calling daily and going back to the abuse one night a week.

Do you believe I'm a "June Cleaver" kind of mother and my son as well as my other two children, ages 14 (girl) and 12 (boy) are like June Cleaver's children? LMAO! Oh boy I think maybe I've given the wrong impression here. I say what I say because I speak from EXPERIENCE. My oldest son is diagnosed with ADHD and Bipolar Disorder. My daughter is diagnosed with Mood Disorder NOS (Not Otherwise Specified). My youngest son is also diagnosed with Mood Disorder NOS (Not Otherwise Specified). I, myself am diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder, Bipolar Disorder and PMDD. We all take medications and seek weekly therapy and see a psychiatrist monthly. I've been married twice and divorced twice. I've abused drugs and alcohol and at one point in my life should have had my own children taken away from me because I was so strung out on drugs and alcohol. However, I got cleaned up because my kids needed me to. However, the damage to my children from years of seeing their bio father and step father abuse me and years of seeing me wallow in my own self loathing had already took it's toll. We all have been in therapy for years now. I now see the benefits of staying and fighting the demons within can have on my children. It's showing them they too can stand strong and fight their own inner demons, because I'll be right there with them.

Oh, and you know what? I do know from personal experience what it's like for my child to hit me. My oldest son has. He's bigger than me, stronger than me, and have anger and rage issues due to the mental illnesses he has. Growing up seeing his father beat me didn't do him any good either. But I stood my ground and got the proper authorities on my side. He now knows I will have him charged with assult the next time he lays a hand on me.

I do not just talk out of my ass. I speak from experience... the good, the bad, and the horribly ugly experiences I've had in life struggling to raise my children.

[LadyValkyrie37]

LadyValkyrie -
You can go on and on about what a horrible person this woman is. You can't convince me. From the facts that are available to me, I truly feel that she had done what she could and was at her wits end. She tried to deal with the problem in the only way she knew how. She had no luck. Obviously, her contact with the courts and police did not help her to become aware of the programs you say are readily available out there.

And I refuse to accept your argument that she would be reaping what she sowed if her children hurt her. She should just stick around because you think she deserved it? Screw that.

And seeing as she had daily contact with her children and knew they were physically healthy, I don't see how that can be seen as "running away." Go check out the front page. You will see the true meaning of neglect. Letting an infant starve to death while his skin is rotting from sitting in his own waste is neglect. Trying to teach some spoiled teens a lesson is not. She did not leave the state, she did not leave the city. She did not leave with no way for the teens to contact her. She knew what was going on at her home.

Prosecuting her is a complete waste of taxpayer money.


I do NOT have to check out any front page or any other website for that matter to know what abuse and neglect is. Please do NOT assume I do not know what abuse and neglect is. I'm a survivor or incest, rape, child abuse in the form of both physical and emotional, spousal abuse in the form of both physical and emotional, and spousal rape. And you will NOT change MY mind on this subject. That mother was doing nothing but running away from her problems. She wasn't teaching anyone anything. She was simply running away when the times got rough.

[Rotten Apple]

I do NOT have to check out any front page or any other website for that matter to know what abuse and neglect is. Please do NOT assume I do not know what abuse and neglect is. I'm a survivor or incest, rape, child abuse in the form of both physical and emotional, spousal abuse in the form of both physical and emotional, and spousal rape. And you will NOT change MY mind on this subject. That mother was doing nothing but running away from her problems. She wasn't teaching anyone anything. She was simply running away when the times got rough.

You need to understand something. Just because we don't choose to make it public knowledge doesn't mean that some of us haven't suffered from the same experiences you have. As a matter of fact, I find that it is what seems to draw some of these people to this site.

Because of this, I am even MORE convinced that this woman does not need to be prosecuted. These children have not suffered anywhere near what some of us have suffered, if they suffered at all.

I don't think this lady was trying to teach her children ANYTHING. I think she was just trying to get a break.

From what you have posted, it seems that you have at times been a far worse parent than this lady has. Yet you want her to be prosecuted. heh.

[impqueen]

I do NOT have to check out any front page or any other website for that matter to know what abuse and neglect is. Please do NOT assume I do not know what abuse and neglect is. I'm a survivor or incest, rape, child abuse in the form of both physical and emotional, spousal abuse in the form of both physical and emotional, and spousal rape. And you will NOT change MY mind on this subject. That mother was doing nothing but running away from her problems. She wasn't teaching anyone anything. She was simply running away when the times got rough.

I think you'll find that you are certainly not alone in your survivorship in this forum. Most true crime aficionados are such due to factors in their lives that make this kind of thing particularly interesting or personal to them. So please don't assume that the people you're posting to aren't also survivors with triggers and feelings.

Kathy suggested you read the article I posted on the front page: http://www.dreamindemon.com/2008/02/21/melissa-dean-went-on-strike/

She suggested that not to be mean, but to give you a bigger picture of what occurred and what the state alleges happened versus this woman's story. We are not in the habit of defending child abusers here. If you have seen the video of these boys threatening adults, you will see that this lady may have had a real fear for her life. She clearly states that she called the police twelve times between September and January and got no help in finding resources to assist her with her sons. Two of her sons are old enough to be legally emancipated and should be. Her two younger sons might do just fine once the older boys are out of the home.

I understand that you feel very strongly about this situation. I also understand that sometimes people don't express themselves very well in print. If you have seen the video and read the article linked, and you still feel the way you do, you are of course entitled to your opinion - it just won't be one that the majority here share. That's also totally fine, as we welcome differing thoughts - but there's no need to be rude about it.

Plus, Kathy can choke a bitch like nothing you've ever seen. She has magic corset laces. I love her.

[LadyValkyrie37]

You need to understand something. Just because we don't choose to make it public knowledge doesn't mean that some of us haven't suffered from the same experiences you have. As a matter of fact, I find that it is what seems to draw some of these people to this site.

Because of this, I am even MORE convinced that this woman does not need to be prosecuted. These children have not suffered anywhere near what some of us have suffered, if they suffered at all.

I don't think this lady was trying to teach her children ANYTHING. I think she was just trying to get a break.

From what you have posted, it seems that you have at times been a far worse parent than this lady has. Yet you want her to be prosecuted. heh.


Tricky, tricky, tricky lil devil you think you are don't you? Didn't I say that I should have had my children taken from me because of my past actions? If I would have had them taken away from me back then I very well deserved it. You want to talk about my opinion on her "persecition? I do believe that Melissa Dean also deserves to be given the minimum sentence allowed for child neglect in that state, with time served, the courts make it mandatory for the whole family be in individual and family counseling, Melissa take parenting classes, and the children be slowly released back into her custody, after she finishes the parenting classes. I'm not about the children being taken away from her permenantly. I'm for the whole family get the help that they all need so that the healing can begin.

[LadyValkyrie37]

I think you'll find that you are certainly not alone in your survivorship in this forum. Most true crime aficionados are such due to factors in their lives that make this kind of thing particularly interesting or personal to them. So please don't assume that the people you're posting to aren't also survivors with triggers and feelings.

Kathy suggested you read the article I posted on the front page: http://www.dreamindemon.com/2008/02/21/melissa-dean-went-on-strike/

She suggested that not to be mean, but to give you a bigger picture of what occurred and what the state alleges happened versus this woman's story. We are not in the habit of defending child abusers here. If you have seen the video of these boys threatening adults, you will see that this lady may have had a real fear for her life. She clearly states that she called the police twelve times between September and January and got no help in finding resources to assist her with her sons. Two of her sons are old enough to be legally emancipated and should be. Her two younger sons might do just fine once the older boys are out of the home.

I understand that you feel very strongly about this situation. I also understand that sometimes people don't express themselves very well in print. If you have seen the video and read the article linked, and you still feel the way you do, you are of course entitled to your opinion - it just won't be one that the majority here share. That's also totally fine, as we welcome differing thoughts - but there's no need to be rude about it.

Plus, Kathy can choke a bitch like nothing you've ever seen. She has magic corset laces. I love her.

I have googled Michelle's name and read everything that's written about her and her children and watched everything as well. My opinion stands as is.

[Rotten Apple]

Tricky, tricky, tricky lil devil you think you are don't you? Didn't I say that I should have had my children taken from me because of my past actions? If I would have had them taken away from me back then I very well deserved it. You want to talk about my opinion on her "persecition? I do believe that Melissa Dean also deserves to be given the minimum sentence allowed for child neglect in that state, with time served, the courts make it mandatory for the whole family be in individual and family counseling, Melissa take parenting classes, and the children be slowly released back into her custody, after she finishes the parenting classes. I'm not about the children being taken away from her permenantly. I'm for the whole family get the help that they all need so that the healing can begin.

LOL! I don't think I'm being tricky at all. I don't play games. I say what I mean. I know you said your children should have been taken from you. I just find it ironic that you think this woman has committed such a horrible crime when you yourself have done far worse.

And really, I think she would be RELIEVED if they took her children. She may even pack their bags for them.

I think you are making the situation out to be more complicated than it is. Healing? Parenting classes? Its seems to me that it is the boys that need lessons in behavior modification, not her.

Jesus, all this babying and coddling of brats is exactly what is ruining this world. Children aren't learning personal responsibility. Some guy with a PhD will come along and talk about their feelings with them and absolve them of all responsibility for their behaviors. It makes me want to puke.

[LadyValkyrie37]

LOL! I don't think I'm being tricky at all. I don't play games. I say what I mean. I know you said your children should have been taken from you. I just find it ironic that you think this woman has committed such a horrible crime when you yourself have done far worse.

And really, I think she would be RELIEVED if they took her children. She may even pack their bags for them.

I think you are making the situation out to be more complicated than it is. Healing? Parenting classes? Its seems to me that it is the boys that need lessons in behavior modification, not her.

Jesus, all this babying and coddling of brats is exactly what is ruining this world. Children aren't learning personal responsibility. Some guy with a PhD will come along and talk about their feelings with them and absolve them of all responsibility for their behaviors. It makes me want to puke.

Go ahead and puke but you are misguided in your feelings about therapy. Therapy is NOT about absolving anyone of any responsibility. Quite the opposite really. Therapy helps the patient understand why they act and react the way they do, (is it physical such as a chemical imbalance or is it more of a learned behavior through one's environment or a combination of the two) but in the end the patient has to learn certain behavior modifications and coping skills so that they do not repeat their mistakes. "Psychotherapy is most successful when the individual enters therapy on their own and has a strong desire to change. If you don’t want to change, change will be slow in coming. Change means altering those aspects of your life that aren’t working for you any longer, or are contributing to your problems or ongoing issues." from psychcentral.com

[impqueen]

Go ahead and puke but you are misguided in your feelings about therapy. Therapy is NOT about absolving anyone of any responsibility. Quite the opposite really. Therapy helps the patient understand why they act and react the way they do, (is it physical such as a chemical imbalance or is it more of a learned behavior through one's environment or a combination of the two) but in the end the patient has to learn certain behavior modifications and coping skills so that they do not repeat their mistakes. "Psychotherapy is most successful when the individual enters therapy on their own and has a strong desire to change. If you don’t want to change, change will be slow in coming. Change means altering those aspects of your life that aren’t working for you any longer, or are contributing to your problems or ongoing issues." from psychcentral.com

I know you're new here, but your BPD is showing. And a little BPD goes a long way toward therapy acceptance, I know, especially if your therapist returns your calls. A fair number of us here have been through therapy. At least one or two of us have psych degrees. We also have a lot of psych nurses. You really are not giving us information we don't know. Several of us just disagree with you on this particular case, and pontificating at us isn't going to change our minds.

After you've read the front page or other threads here for awhile, you'll understand better why we feel the way we do on some subjects. For example, I spent part of yesterday writing an article on a dead baby that was left in a carseat by his parents for over a week. That's neglect.

I actually think that you might want to stick around and get to know us a little bit better before you preach. You seem like a reasonably intelligent person, but coming in here, baring your entire psych history and throwing fits your first few days really isn't conducive to a long term posting relationship, because we have some people here who will argue you into an emergency therapy session and a no-harm contract. Nobody wants that, so just chill out and enjoy it. We can be a lot of fun when we're not being accosted by newbies who want to school us in trauma. Maybe you should take a pill and cool out.

By the by, i wasn't calling you a bitch earlier. That "choke a bitch" thing is a running joke. I just realized you probably didn't know that.

[impqueen]

"Just push the little groan button on the bottom right. But not on mine, because I rule"

I see thanks, quote, quote +, and quik reply. I don't see a groan - maybe I'm blind - we already know I'm dumber than a box of rocks.

And yes you do rule - whoops, now I'll have to say something nice to Morbid and feed the ego.

Pooh, maybe you got booted. If you're not signed in you won't see the thumbs up and thumbs down at the bottom of each post on the right, they should be right next to the quote buttons. If you're signed in and they're still not there I'll see if I can find out what's up, there may be a glitch.

Yeah, you should totally hit Morbid with some panties because he's been overworked and underpantied lately. And Kathy stole his scooter. :D

[TalkingJesus]

I have googled Michelle's name and read everything that's written about her and her children and watched everything as well. My opinion stands as is.

Obviously you haven't read everything written about Melissa since you haven't read the front page and didn't even get her name correct.

[TalkingJesus]

Tricky, tricky, tricky lil devil you think you are don't you? Didn't I say that I should have had my children taken from me because of my past actions? If I would have had them taken away from me back then I very well deserved it. You want to talk about my opinion on her "persecition? I do believe that Melissa Dean also deserves to be given the minimum sentence allowed for child neglect in that state, with time served, the courts make it mandatory for the whole family be in individual and family counseling, Melissa take parenting classes, and the children be slowly released back into her custody, after she finishes the parenting classes. I'm not about the children being taken away from her permenantly. I'm for the whole family get the help that they all need so that the healing can begin.

Sounds to me like someone's meds are out of whack. You might want to get your lithium levels adjusted.

[LadyValkyrie37]

I know you're new here, but your BPD is showing. And a little BPD goes a long way toward therapy acceptance, I know, especially if your therapist returns your calls. A fair number of us here have been through therapy. At least one or two of us have psych degrees. We also have a lot of psych nurses. You really are not giving us information we don't know. Several of us just disagree with you on this particular case, and pontificating at us isn't going to change our minds.

After you've read the front page or other threads here for awhile, you'll understand better why we feel the way we do on some subjects. For example, I spent part of yesterday writing an article on a dead baby that was left in a carseat by his parents for over a week. That's neglect.

I actually think that you might want to stick around and get to know us a little bit better before you preach. You seem like a reasonably intelligent person, but coming in here, baring your entire psych history and throwing fits your first few days really isn't conducive to a long term posting relationship, because we have some people here who will argue you into an emergency therapy session and a no-harm contract. Nobody wants that, so just chill out and enjoy it. We can be a lot of fun when we're not being accosted by newbies who want to school us in trauma. Maybe you should take a pill and cool out.

By the by, i wasn't calling you a bitch earlier. That "choke a bitch" thing is a running joke. I just realized you probably didn't know that.

Me accepting therapy has nothing to do with my diagnosis and has everything to do with me wanting and needing to break the cycle of abuse and neglect that plagues both sides of my family and both sides of my children's bio father's family. I would really appreciate it if you would quit talking as though you have known me personally for years. You seriously know nothing about me or how my mind works. So quit acting like you do, ok?

Now I want to get something straight right now. Stop acting like I'm completely oblivious as to what this website is about and what it consists of. Stop acting like your the wise one of the website just trying to educate this newbie. It's really unbecoming to treat newbies in such a way. Newbies aren't stupid. So seriously quit the act will ya?

Also quit assuming that I don't know or understand what goes on in this world when it comes to abuse and neglect. I may not write cover stories for this website but I do read the same news reports you do on the internet, newspapers, magazines, ect, I watch the same news reports you do on tv, internet, ect. I do not live on a different planet or under a rock. So please STOP this nonsense will ya?

Do you treat everyone who has a differing opinion than you like this or is it just the newbies? Either way it's silly. Threatening newbies is really childish. No one will be able to argue me into a "emergency therapy session and a no-harm contract" because you know what? There is an "off" button on the computer. No one on this website or anyone else on the internet is worth losing sleep over. But go ahead and continue to think you or others on here have that much power over others... but I think it's silly and childish.

Finally, neglect is neglect. Some forms of neglect are extreme and severe others not so much. But still neglect is neglect. You know a child can have a roof over their head, food in their stomach, and clean clothes on their back as they're was growing up. They can have a mother who stays at home and a father who has a job that allows him to be home every evening and every weekend... YET... their parents can neglect their child by not being there emotionally. A child can cry out in so many ways for their parents to just give them the love and attention that they are starving for... that they need to grow up into a healthy adult. They may end up doing so many self destructive things all because their praents neglected to love them emotionally and only cared for their physical needs. As I said waaaay earlier. There is more to being a parent than providing physical needs.

[LadyValkyrie37]

Sounds to me like someone's meds are out of whack. You might want to get your lithium levels adjusted.

Oh you are so creative! Like I haven't heard that line before. It usually comes from people who have nothing more constructive to add to the conversation other than try and land low blows on the one they disagree with or dislike.

[Rotten Apple]

Me accepting therapy has nothing to do with my diagnosis and has everything to do with me wanting and needing to break the cycle of abuse and neglect that plagues both sides of my family and both sides of my children's bio father's family. I would really appreciate it if you would quit talking as though you have known me personally for years. You seriously know nothing about me or how my mind works. So quit acting like you do, ok?

Now I want to get something straight right now. Stop acting like I'm completely oblivious as to what this website is about and what it consists of. Stop acting like your the wise one of the website just trying to educate this newbie. It's really unbecoming to treat newbies in such a way. Newbies aren't stupid. So seriously quit the act will ya?

Also quit assuming that I don't know or understand what goes on in this world when it comes to abuse and neglect. I may not write cover stories for this website but I do read the same news reports you do on the internet, newspapers, magazines, ect, I watch the same news reports you do on tv, internet, ect. I do not live on a different planet or under a rock. So please STOP this nonsense will ya?

Do you treat everyone who has a differing opinion than you like this or is it just the newbies? Either way it's silly. Threatening newbies is really childish. No one will be able to argue me into a "emergency therapy session and a no-harm contract" because you know what? There is an "off" button on the computer. No one on this website or anyone else on the internet is worth losing sleep over. But go ahead and continue to think you or others on here have that much power over others... but I think it's silly and childish.

Finally, neglect is neglect. Some forms of neglect are extreme and severe others not so much. But still neglect is neglect. You know a child can have a roof over their head, food in their stomach, and clean clothes on their back as they're was growing up. They can have a mother who stays at home and a father who has a job that allows him to be home every evening and every weekend... YET... their parents can neglect their child by not being there emotionally. A child can cry out in so many ways for their parents to just give them the love and attention that they are starving for... that they need to grow up into a healthy adult. They may end up doing so many self destructive things all because their praents neglected to love them emotionally and only cared for their physical needs. As I said waaaay earlier. There is more to being a parent than providing physical needs.

Imp was just trying to be funny and nice while telling you to chill the fuck out. Seriously. You seem a little overworked and are applying this case to your own personal life AND taking it pretty personally.

I'm not against therapy. I've been there done that. I just think that not all behavior problems require a PhD and co-pay. Some of them just need a little discipline. What does therapy do for discipline? Mental illness diagnosis are handed out way to easily these days as are the meds.

Severe physical and emotional neglect are two things that do not even come into play in this case. This mother moved out for a MONTH out of the entire 17, 16, 14 and 13 years of these children's life.

So, again, this case is not as extreme as you want to make it out to be. This lady made a mistake. A mistake I can not fault her for. I am not going to put her in the same basket as someone who killed their child.
'
Now as far as how newbies are treated. We love differing opinions here. We thrive on it. People here LOVE TO ARGUE, but it stops being fun when it gets personal. That's all she was telling you.

So seriously, chill.

[ells9824]

Last time I take a nap... I miss all the fun.:rolleyes:

[impqueen]

Now I want to get something straight right now. Stop acting like I'm completely oblivious as to what this website is about and what it consists of. Stop acting like your the wise one of the website just trying to educate this newbie. It's really unbecoming to treat newbies in such a way. Newbies aren't stupid. So seriously quit the act will ya?

Also quit assuming that I don't know or understand what goes on in this world when it comes to abuse and neglect. I may not write cover stories for this website but I do read the same news reports you do on the internet, newspapers, magazines, ect, I watch the same news reports you do on tv, internet, ect. I do not live on a different planet or under a rock. So please STOP this nonsense will ya?

Do you treat everyone who has a differing opinion than you like this or is it just the newbies? Either way it's silly. Threatening newbies is really childish. No one will be able to argue me into a "emergency therapy session and a no-harm contract" because you know what? There is an "off" button on the computer. No one on this website or anyone else on the internet is worth losing sleep over. But go ahead and continue to think you or others on here have that much power over others... but I think it's silly and childish.



Sigh. And here i was trying to be nice and helpful and possibly keep you from triggering others with, oh, I dunno, your avatar, or perhaps your attitude. If you can't distinguish helpful advice from threats, then your perception is flawed. I don't threaten people, but I do call 'em like I see 'em.

But clearly you're going to school me in how to behave on this website, so I'll just let you enjoy your moment. Might I suggest you check out the Three Things section of the forum? I think your articulate posting skill would fit in very well, particularly in the political arena. Do have fun. :)

[Dark Star]

Sigh. And here i was trying to be nice and helpful and possibly keep you from triggering others with, oh, I dunno, your avatar, or perhaps your attitude.

Her avatar to me is just fine, it's the nasty ass attitude.
Hell lady you just arrived and you're already trying to make enemies it seems. Letting us all know about your life and mental health is cool if you need to express yourself that way. Honey, I think I've helped write books on mental illness. So stop with all "this is wrong with me", and "that is wrong with me", shit "and I still survived". So have the majority of us, sister, do you think you are different? You think that any of us don't know the things you've dealt with, maybe more? Fuck. Why you want to come in here all bent out of shape. Everyone has a right to their own opinion and you made yours quite clear. Others here have a different opinion, and all your mouth flapping isn't going to change a fucking thing.
To me, this lady Melissa Dean, is a fucking saint. Goddammit, she did not neglect her kids, she let them live, the crazy little bastards. When a parent beats the shit out of their kids, or kills their damn kids, then come tell me and everyone else how neglectful they were. This shit....far from neglectful in my book.
Now, I'll take my meds and chill out, I really suggest you doing the same.;)
Peace.

[TalkingJesus]

Oh you are so creative! Like I haven't heard that line before. It usually comes from people who have nothing more constructive to add to the conversation other than try and land low blows on the one they disagree with or dislike.

Oh, now, my line was funny and you know it. Probably a bit tasteless, but you didn't exactly come in here and try to be friendly yourself. So I'll be a gentleman and apologize, and we can both pretend that you didn't leave me the perfect opening to say that yeah, you probably do hear that line a lot. Okay?

[TalkingJesus]

Last time I take a nap... I miss all the fun.:rolleyes:

Good morning sunshine! :D

[LadyValkyrie37]

Obviously you haven't read everything written about Melissa since you haven't read the front page and didn't even get her name correct.

Oh wow I made a typo. Good for you, you pointed it out! Here's a cookie!

[impqueen]

Oh wow I made a typo. Good for you, you pointed it out! Here's a cookie!

a typo is like... a letter. Or a misspelling.

Your not getting the woman's name right in this case is another instance of your unteachable personality. You believe you know everything there is to know about this case, you will hold forth on it at great length, and then when you're caught in a basic error, you're a bitch about it.

Really, I think you could be a valuable asset to this forum, but you kind of need to calm down. Everyone here gets their ass handed to them sometimes. If you can laugh about it, you'll be a lot happier here. I would fully expect someone to call me out if I was arguing an issue and jacked up the perp's name. Head-patting doesn't happen here very often.

That said, we have a great comments section on the front page, and i really do welcome your opinions there as well as here. I think you could stir a little debate and interest in the case, and a lot of our readers don't hold forum membership. So I do want to encourage you to read and comment at www.dreamindemon.com (http://www.dreamindemon.com) , because I think your opinions could be useful there.

[swivel]

What the hell is going on in this thread? Isn't someone supposed to alert me when entertaining threads break loose? Who's "on call" this week?

LadyValkyrie37, welcome to the site. I understand that you have had more than the usual amount of trauma in your life. That's what this website is all about, and you would probably, if you give everyone the chance, find that you are in similar company.

If you are active in other social networks, you probably found that you were different. More "scarred" than other people. More in-tune with your imbalances. More schooled in therapy. You developed social mechanisms that allowed you to exist with people that had little in common with you. Now, you are going to need to learn how to co-exist with people that have a LOT in common with you.

The initial reaction when you put people together that have too much in common is a battle of egos. A person might be used to being the "smartest" person in every clique. They attach a lot of their egotistical significance to this single trait. When they encounter people who also distinguish themselves for the same ability, there is a clash. This news isn't revolutionary or new to anyone here, but it is hard to keep this in mind when it is actually taking place.

I hope you can learn to accept that you might not be as unique here as you are in other social groups. Because, once you realize that you are in familiar company, you will find that an ego-less bond between people with similar experiences can be a much more rewarding and powerful bond. It will not satisfy the ego-driven need to be unique, but I think we all get enough of that in the rest of our daily exchanges.

Another thing to keep in mind, for all of you, there is a place on this forum for name-calling and heated debates. The rest of the forum doesn't need to be boring, but please remember that most of our members have had some serious trauma. Joking about "taking meds" isn't funny when everyone involved really is on meds. We should be able to disagree with front-page news without any of us BECOMING front-page news.

[impqueen]

What the hell is going on in this thread? Isn't someone supposed to alert me when entertaining threads break loose? Who's "on call" this week?

Um... that was Morbid. Yeah. Because it wasn't me. Or...

crap. it was me. my bad.


Another thing to keep in mind, for all of you, there is a place on this forum for name-calling and heated debates. The rest of the forum doesn't need to be boring, but please remember that most of our members have had some serious trauma. Joking about "taking meds" isn't funny when everyone involved really is on meds. We should be able to disagree with front-page news without any of us BECOMING front-page news.I'm not on psych meds. I mean, to the extent that bourbon doesn't qualify as meds. The heart meds, well... fuck 'em. Who needs cardiac function anyway? All I need is more cowbell. Yeah.

I love when you throw a Magical Swiv Curve Ball and get all nice. It's like using inconsistent reward on a forum full of hamsters. Which did not come out at all the way it sounded in my head.

Okay. I'll be nice and take my smackdown like a good girl. /bitch out

[Dark Star]

Joking about "taking meds" isn't funny when everyone involved really is on meds. We should be able to disagree with front-page news without any of us BECOMING front-page news.

Ummm Dad, I mean Swiv. I wasn't trying to be funny about the medication thing. I'm fucked up, yes like many of us, and I take meds. I am not ashamed to admit when I need them either, and as a nurse, I was merely trying to remind Ms. Val that she might need hers as well. I'm nice like that. Concerned about other people's health. Ms. Val just joined the Demon, I want her to stick around for awhile. :)

[swivel]

I wasn't trying to call anyone out. You know I love and respect you ladies. I just wanted Valkyrie to understand that the dynamic here is different than one you will find any other place on the Internet. That is the reason this website is taking off, we have never sacraficed quality for quantity.

I think Valkyrie could be happy here, and a brilliant addition to the site, she just needs to realize that her usual prejudices don't apply here.


My opinion on this story: The neglect here isn't as bad as leaving a kid in a hot car to die, but it still reads like neglect to me. I guess I am torn on this one. I just have an extreme view on the responsibility of parenthood. Stop having sex if you aren't willing to make the sacrifices it takes to raise a child. Don't pretend to be the victim. And every woman should be prepared to raise their children on their own. To ignore the statistics, and the natural tendencies of male mammals to not give a fuck about their own offspring is a recipe for disaster.

[Rotten Apple]

SWIVEL? The voice of reason?:eek:

Am I in Bizarro world?

[sassymom08]

I have to say I can see how this mom is frustrated, being a single mom to a male child is difficult when they hit their teens (mine is now 18). My daughter seems so much easier for me to understand (she is 16). My kids have grown up dealing with my having chosen to live my life as a single parent after a bad marriage that left them very angry. My son is almost a foot taller than I am and has almost 100 lbs on me as well. That said, there is no way in hell he would ever even THINK about striking me. Yes he has issues and he can get pretty pissed off at the world at times, but we are the 3 musketeers, us against the world. Choosing to walk away when times got tough was never an option for me. They are who they are because of the way I raised them.
I don't think this mother should be facing jail time, but at the same time I also don't think she should be able to walk away scott free either. She made horrible choices in the way that she raised those boys. Rather than showing them as they grew up that they could talk to her and that she would always be there for them it is obvious that she was focused more on her needs as they grew. She chose, by her actions, to raise them as self centered brats. Now she is living with the consequences of that choice. You cannot spend a child's whole life letting them act however they want and then wake up one day and say "I can't deal with how you act and what you are now".
My NSHO is that she needs to be on probation that includes parenting classes as well as some serious therapy that will show her that she failed to parent appropriately.

[impqueen]

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/Home/Detail?contentId=5858414&version=2&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=1.1.1

Okay. So Harold Dean, Melissa's ex, has a history of violence toward her and has taken off. Clearly he had not seen or checked on the boys in the month that they were in the house - he wasn't baking them food or calling them daily or spending one night a week in the home with them, obviously.

And Melissa's the neglectful parent here. Yeah, that makes sense. Not.

[Rotten Apple]

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/Home/Detail?contentId=5858414&version=2&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=1.1.1

Okay. So Harold Dean, Melissa's ex, has a history of violence toward her and has taken off. Clearly he had not seen or checked on the boys in the month that they were in the house - he wasn't baking them food or calling them daily or spending one night a week in the home with them, obviously.

And Melissa's the neglectful parent here. Yeah, that makes sense. Not.

Everyone knows, if you leave FIRST you are the winner!

And if he was abusive, I guess we know what the boys learned while growing up. But I'm sure they will still say it was her fault for sitting there and being abused in front of her kids. :rolleyes:

[sassymom08]

He obviously needs to be nailed for abuse and abandonment, no question there. I think these guys should be forced to chain gang to provide the money for the therapy their kids need because of their actions along with the cost for raising them. The legal system doesn't do anything to these dirt bags that do this to kids. I'm not even close to saying she needs jail, she needs some serious mental help though and if it's under a probationary rule, then she can financially get help to complete it. I don't use the abuse I suffered as an excuse to not parent, because of that abuse my kids need me even more. My choices put them in that situation and my strength to get help and leave got them out of it. Being a mom is my main job, more important than anything else I will ever do in my life. I have done it all myself, no help from the ex in any way. I found the help I needed and didn't make any excuses. I'm sorry our opinions differ, I respect other members rights to voice theirs even if I don't agree. I think she was wrong in her actions.

[impqueen]

He obviously needs to be nailed for abuse and abandonment, no question there.

I respect your opinion and I don't necessarily entirely disagree, but how do you suggest he be nailed? (I mean, aside from with a nail gun.:)

Parents leave their kids all the time. As long as they leave them WITH someone, they never have to contact the kids again and nobody says jack unless there's a child support order and often not even then. Many, many parents abandon and neglect their children by leaving them with the other parent, and I can't think offhand of a single case in which a parent who left the home was charged with abandonment as long as they left their kids with the other parent, no matter the situation. As far as the abuse goes, it looks like Melissa Dean tried to nail him on it and failed - she ended up with a divorce and a restraining order and that's it. '

To me, he abandoned those boys much more than their mother did, but Kathy's right - you leave first, you win. He can't be charged. So this mother, who probably did make the wrong decision (but made it under extreme duress and after she repeatedly sought help from the police and Family Services and was refused) is being penalized for actions much less heinous than her husband's.

If the boys were aged 9-13, yes, she deserved jail. But all of those boys were teenagers, two of them old enough to be emancipated in one court hearing. Sounds like that's what she should have done - emancipated two of the boys and kicked 'em out if they wouldn't follow her rules. She still would be vilified as a bad mother, but at least she wouldn't be going to jail. I think she was trying to keep her kids safe by leaving them in the home, bringing them meals, calling them, and staying there on occasion in order to see that the boys were fed, clothed, and warm. That's less neglectful than many parents who don't get charged with anything, ever.

I appreciate your viewpoint, though, and I appreciate that you expressed it in such a nice way.

[LadyValkyrie37]

a typo is like... a letter. Or a misspelling.

Your not getting the woman's name right in this case is another instance of your unteachable personality. You believe you know everything there is to know about this case, you will hold forth on it at great length, and then when you're caught in a basic error, you're a bitch about it.

Really, I think you could be a valuable asset to this forum, but you kind of need to calm down. Everyone here gets their ass handed to them sometimes. If you can laugh about it, you'll be a lot happier here. I would fully expect someone to call me out if I was arguing an issue and jacked up the perp's name. Head-patting doesn't happen here very often.

That said, we have a great comments section on the front page, and i really do welcome your opinions there as well as here. I think you could stir a little debate and interest in the case, and a lot of our readers don't hold forum membership. So I do want to encourage you to read and comment at www.dreamindemon.com (http://www.dreamindemon.com) , because I think your opinions could be useful there.


I got as far as you saying that I have an unteachable personality and I started LMAO. Are you a psychic? Cause if you are your perception of me is waaaaaaaaaay off. You do not know anything of me personally to make such a judgement call.

I also find it hilarious that you perceive that I've had my "ass handed to" me. Exactly how have I had my ass handed to me? Did I have my ass handed to me when I don't cave to the masses of the board when they don't agree with my opinions? Did I have my ass handed to me when the masses in turn started personally attacking me and my character as though they know anything about me? Yeah sure, if you wish to believe in your own mind that my ass was handed to me go for it. Whatever makes you happy in your own little online world. LOL :rolleyes:

[swivel]

LadyValkyrie, you are very welcome to the site, but this is not the place for a flame-war, no matter who started it. Personal attacks (which you have been the victim of, I agree), belong in the PM's and in the "Three Things" section of the forum. We are a very lax site, and you will see inappropriate humor and cussing all over the place (especially on the front page!), but the site rules are explicit on attacks between members.

That is why I rushed to your defense in this thread, and it is why I am now asking you to move this nonsense elsewhere. I think Morbid is a really cool guy to give us a place to yell at each other. It keeps the rest of the site attractive to our readers and our new members.

Now, let's get back to arguing the issues and sending each other hate-mail. Please?

[LadyValkyrie37]

What the hell is going on in this thread? Isn't someone supposed to alert me when entertaining threads break loose? Who's "on call" this week?

LadyValkyrie37, welcome to the site. I understand that you have had more than the usual amount of trauma in your life. That's what this website is all about, and you would probably, if you give everyone the chance, find that you are in similar company.

If you are active in other social networks, you probably found that you were different. More "scarred" than other people. More in-tune with your imbalances. More schooled in therapy. You developed social mechanisms that allowed you to exist with people that had little in common with you. Now, you are going to need to learn how to co-exist with people that have a LOT in common with you.

The initial reaction when you put people together that have too much in common is a battle of egos. A person might be used to being the "smartest" person in every clique. They attach a lot of their egotistical significance to this single trait. When they encounter people who also distinguish themselves for the same ability, there is a clash. This news isn't revolutionary or new to anyone here, but it is hard to keep this in mind when it is actually taking place.

I hope you can learn to accept that you might not be as unique here as you are in other social groups. Because, once you realize that you are in familiar company, you will find that an ego-less bond between people with similar experiences can be a much more rewarding and powerful bond. It will not satisfy the ego-driven need to be unique, but I think we all get enough of that in the rest of our daily exchanges.

Another thing to keep in mind, for all of you, there is a place on this forum for name-calling and heated debates. The rest of the forum doesn't need to be boring, but please remember that most of our members have had some serious trauma. Joking about "taking meds" isn't funny when everyone involved really is on meds. We should be able to disagree with front-page news without any of us BECOMING front-page news.

Thank you for your welcome. It is truely appreciated.

I find the following statement from you hilarious. "Now, you are going to need to learn how to co-exist with people that have a LOT in common with you." Again I ask are you a psychic? If so you are waaaaay off the mark on this one as well as impqueen was. I think some people around here need to stop acting like they know me, or any other newbie that comes here personally. You, swivel are making judgment calls on me as though you have known me for a very long time. You know nothing of me, other than what you I have posted in this website. I suggest you get to know me before you act like you know who I am or how I interact with people in general. Here's a clue... I don't like people in general... it doesn't make a difference whether they are "like me" or not. And quite frankly this whole issue in this thread is NOT about how I interact with others, it's about the masses of this message board getting their panties in a wad when a newbie comes along and expresses an opinion that is not like their own. Now I invite you and others here to get to know me... so long as you stop acting like you think you have me figured out already.

[LadyValkyrie37]

Ummm Dad, I mean Swiv. I wasn't trying to be funny about the medication thing. I'm fucked up, yes like many of us, and I take meds. I am not ashamed to admit when I need them either, and as a nurse, I was merely trying to remind Ms. Val that she might need hers as well. I'm nice like that. Concerned about other people's health. Ms. Val just joined the Demon, I want her to stick around for awhile. :)

And are you a psychiatric doctor? Are you a counselor/therapist? If not then who in the hell are you to suggest anyone take their meds? And even if you were a psychiatrist or therapist you do not know me personally to even make such a call. Like I said people who make such statements on the internet usually have nothing to offer in the conversation, they just want to have their turn at verbally attacking the one they disagree with or don't like.

[LadyValkyrie37]

LadyValkyrie, you are very welcome to the site, but this is not the place for a flame-war, no matter who started it. Personal attacks (which you have been the victim of, I agree), belong in the PM's and in the "Three Things" section of the forum. We are a very lax site, and you will see inappropriate humor and cussing all over the place (especially on the front page!), but the site rules are explicit on attacks between members.

That is why I rushed to your defense in this thread, and it is why I am now asking you to move this nonsense elsewhere. I think Morbid is a really cool guy to give us a place to yell at each other. It keeps the rest of the site attractive to our readers and our new members.

Now, let's get back to arguing the issues and sending each other hate-mail. Please?


So they have a right to make judgement calls on me and even personally attack when they don't even know me personally, all they get is a verbal slap on the wrist, and a few days later when I come back to this thread, I'm suddenly not allowed to reply to any of what they say... but instead I'm ordered to just take it to PM. Maybe they, who have been here a lot longer than this little ole newbie, should have known to begin with that such things are not allowed and should have taken it to PM themselves. Just some food for thought, but maybe you need to send the old members back to school concerning the rules of this website... and maybe cut the newbie some slack here.

[LadyValkyrie37]

I wasn't trying to call anyone out. You know I love and respect you ladies. I just wanted Valkyrie to understand that the dynamic here is different than one you will find any other place on the Internet. That is the reason this website is taking off, we have never sacraficed quality for quantity.

I think Valkyrie could be happy here, and a brilliant addition to the site, she just needs to realize that her usual prejudices don't apply here.


My opinion on this story: The neglect here isn't as bad as leaving a kid in a hot car to die, but it still reads like neglect to me. I guess I am torn on this one. I just have an extreme view on the responsibility of parenthood. Stop having sex if you aren't willing to make the sacrifices it takes to raise a child. Don't pretend to be the victim. And every woman should be prepared to raise their children on their own. To ignore the statistics, and the natural tendencies of male mammals to not give a fuck about their own offspring is a recipe for disaster.


My usual prejudices? Oh will you please stop acting like you know me personally?! How in the hell do you know what my prejudices are to begin with? You don't know me!

At least we have one thing we can agree on... that the mother is neglectful.

[LadyValkyrie37]

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/Home/Detail?contentId=5858414&version=2&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=1.1.1

Okay. So Harold Dean, Melissa's ex, has a history of violence toward her and has taken off. Clearly he had not seen or checked on the boys in the month that they were in the house - he wasn't baking them food or calling them daily or spending one night a week in the home with them, obviously.

And Melissa's the neglectful parent here. Yeah, that makes sense. Not.

The dad is a peice of crap obviously. But when he left wasn't the mother still in the home taking care of the kids? In the eyes of the law as long as one parent is in the home caring for the children they don't care what the absent parent is doing or not doing. Unless the mother is in the welfare system somehow then the welfare system automatically cares where the absent parent is because they want to get child support out of them.

[Rotten Apple]

LadyValkyrie-

Your original debate was with me. I never attacked you personally. Yet you came out of the gate just abrasive and offensive as hell. Maybe that is just the way you come across in words. Who knows? Who cares?

I don't know you personally, just like you don't know me personally and NEITHER one of us knows this woman or her situation personally. I only know of you what you convey to us. You continue to be defensive when really there is no need to be.

I do know one thing for sure.
This whole thread has turned to shit.

[impqueen]

I got as far as you saying that I have an unteachable personality and I started LMAO. Are you a psychic? Cause if you are your perception of me is waaaaaaaaaay off. You do not know anything of me personally to make such a judgement call.

I also find it hilarious that you perceive that I've had my "ass handed to" me. Exactly how have I had my ass handed to me? Did I have my ass handed to me when I don't cave to the masses of the board when they don't agree with my opinions? Did I have my ass handed to me when the masses in turn started personally attacking me and my character as though they know anything about me? Yeah sure, if you wish to believe in your own mind that my ass was handed to me go for it. Whatever makes you happy in your own little online world. LOL :rolleyes:

Actually, never once did I say you'd had you ass handed to you. Please read what I wrote. What I said was that everyone here has their asses handed to them at one time or another. I was trying to be nice and let you know that you weren't being flamed. In fact, I said that you'd be an asset to this forum and asked you to stick around and post. I'm really not understanding your continued attacks when I've been quite nice to you.

I think you and I are having a difference in perception in how you were welcomed to the forum. You are certainly more than welcome to stay and post, I think we just got off on the wrong foot. You didn't like what I had to say, and I didn't really like the way you presented yourself, either. I let it go and thought the issue had been resolved over the weekend, and here you are, guns a-blazin'. Feel free to blaze away if it makes you feel better, but it's not really going to be helpful. Why don't we just call it a mutually bad first impression and move on?

We had 220 people here on Saturday. Something like four of us disagreed with you. That doesn't really look like masses to me, but I'm sorry you perceived it that way.

[swivel]

Seriously, guys.... take this to the PM's, or start a new thread.

[Dark Star]

Seriously, guys.... take this to the PM's, or start a new thread.

Ok Daddy-O. I'm taking it to the PM's. ;)

[VisualKei]

These young teens were quite capable of taking care of themselves to a limited degree. I agree with Kathy, that she should not have been prosecuted for leaving, as she did check on them and make sure that they had necessities in order to live. Parents leave young adults unattended all the time, to go on business trips, vacation or attend to other matters, why is this any different? This woman was probably at her breaking point and rather become the next Andrea Yates, she chose to take a breather for a bit. From what I have read/observed, the children were clean and unabused, and not malnourished in any way. I think this is a clear case of community and social outrage over something that was clearly a family matter, we are not talking about infants here, the authorities clearly jumped the gun with this. If anything these young adults should have been taken to a juvenile detention center for their abuse towards others.

[Rotten Apple]

Charges were dropped.

http://www.ocala.com/article/20080313/NEWS/803130347/1001/NEWS01

[impqueen]

I'm not surprised, given the video evidence. Heh.

[Dark Star]

Charges were dropped.



Right On! I am glad to see this Mother was not convicted.
Of course with those four little fucking boogers, she has for sons, she might have appreciated a short vacation.:lol:

[Unamused Cat]

Charges were dropped.

http://www.ocala.com/article/20080313/NEWS/803130347/1001/NEWS01

I wonder if she has to go home to them. Poor lady.

[Angel]

I think we should award the woman a medal, and have a parade in her honor. Most of the POS we deal with here have beaten a baby to death for crying or wetting their pants. This woman had a legitimate reason in my opinion to knock the living shit out of (at the very least) the two oldest ones. But she didn't. Instead, she left, making sure they were fed and clothed,and sheltered, without having to be driven to the brink of insanity.

Saying that staying at a friend's house and just seeing to the needs of the children still constitutes neglect, is taking it a bit far in my opinion. If that were the case then every single parent who has had (for whatever reason) to take a second job at some point, and left children with their older siblings in order to do so, would be guilty of neglect. We'd have a bunch of moms and dads who were just trying to provide for their kids in jail. And still the real POS would be free and still beating hell out of their kids.

Give the woman a break, already! I read something once that just about sums it up, "Mothers of teenagers understand why some species eat their young." LOL.

[Athena]

I think that "it could have been worse" is a dangerous position to take. No, this woman does not deserve to be prosecuted. What she did does not constitute neglect, in my opinion, but it sure as shit doesn't qualify her for a pat on the back, either. My father used to warn me about comparing myself to those who were worse than me. Comparing yourself to those who are better is the only way you'll aspire to achieve more.

Having children is difficult, especially when you have so many. You don't get to do the bare minimum just because anything more than that is hard. You don't get to simply give up. These children deserve structure and discipline. Odds are, they turned into hellions because they weren't getting that. This woman should have taken a hard look at her failures as a parent and restructured her game plan. One of those kids is only 13, for christ's sake! What hope does he have if he is left to fend for himself with unruly older brothers as his only role model?

The feeling of entitlement is obviously not exclusive to gen-Xers. It seems we got it from somewhere. In this case, this woman obviously felt entitled to obedient children. But, the fact of the matter is, anything worth having requires effort...Effort that this woman was unwilling to put in.

It's easy to spot and punish evil, abusive parents. But the bigger threat is the parents who do just enough. We cannot sit here and justify their lack of effort and integrity simply because they *could* be beating or starving their kids. This woman absolutely deserves judgment...just not the legal kind.

[Lily]

I couldn't agree more. This woman being prosecuted is almost as bad as the Teresa Baker story, from WVA. :mad: I have never struck my child - I have spanked him - but honestly, if my son ever talked to me like that, I would sock him right in that big nasty mouth of his. I think these boys were probably physically abusing this woman and she is too ashamed to admitt it. :mad:

How do you 'spank' a child without striking him?

What on earth is 'spanking' if it is not hitting or beating?

Do tell.

[Dakota Valkyrie]

How do you 'spank' a child without striking him?

What on earth is 'spanking' if it is not hitting or beating?

Do tell.
@Lily (http://www.dreamindemon.com/forums/member.php?u=6570)
I doubt you will get an answer. That comment was made well over 3 years ago and thepooh5 hasn't logged in to the site in almost two years.

[Lily]

I really don't need a reply.

There is no defence for hitting a child. Whether you call it 'spanking' or whatever. I really don't get the 'spanking' thing at all. To me, it seems if you call it 'spanking' it isn't beating or hitting or flogging or thrashing or just plain violence. It is only spanking, even if some children die from it!

[Waiting4theEnd]

Charges were dropped.

http://www.ocala.com/article/20080313/NEWS/803130347/1001/NEWS01
Thank God!