Is execution moral?

[The Diabolical Mr. Lieman]

Certainly, men who rape children, women who rape children, should die, and theres no question it's morally justified.

But what about some of the others? What about human beings that just exist to do stupid things, to punish the world with their stupidity? I'm being serious here. I know in the past, and still in the present, there are those who believe retarded children should be put to death upon birth. I don't support that, but hell, many women today have abortions when they find out that their child may be saddled with autism, or some other form of mental retardation...that's execution...so why not just...execute men like this?

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/02/15/BATLV38B8.DTL


THink of the harm he caused, and worse, COULD'VE caused? He's absolutely mad...27 THOUSAND TIMES?

In a perfect world, this man would simply be taken out into an ally, and shot in the neck. I mean, Jesus, these fuckers pollute the world. And should rightly die, IMO. ANd I'm not upset by this, dont get my wrong. Just...confounded....perplexed....as to why these people exist the way they do. I'm not being silly here. I believe people like this should die, because it serves the betterment of humanity.

[taintfutcha]

aye-i won't bandy morality but i will agree with public executions for many a threat to society. life sentences? fuck that. insane? so what-doesnt change the risk factor.
sterilization and castration are on my list as well (to do list). barbaric you say? weed out the dead wood i say. 3 strikes? 1 strike. i think the pussification of justice is piss poor. no-im not being flip.

[KillBill20]

I like the guys answer as to why he did it "because its free"

What a dumb-shit, I wouldn't be apposed to anyone shooting him.

~Kyle

[Harley_Tech]

How about taking a sampling of lets say 1000 of his calls to find the average time of call. The figure the salary of the people answering the calls, plus any equipment response costs and divide it out to get a per minute rate for his "free calls". Then figure the cost of investigation to find his dumb ass, and send him the bill...uuuhhhh, no...it cost YOU this much to make all those calls.

That should get his attention.

That or have someone kick him in the balls 27K times....cuz its free....

R

[swivel]

This is an issue I've changed my mind on in the past 5 years or so, and could easily see changing it back.

Right now, I feel like our execution system is so flawed, that we should stop doing it. I've read before that it is actually more expensive than keeping them in jail for life, because the process takes up so much court time, and the infrastructure is not cheap for the number of people they use it for.

I just hate the idea of rapists and murderers watching cable on my dollar, so I think we should change how certain people spend their time in prison. I think the "lifers" should be put on display in the prisons. Keep them in plexiglass cells in the middle of the commons. Feed and supply them from a trapdoor in the floor. Let them have some books and a nice bed, and that is it. Let them go craz(ier) if they want, and let the rest of the criminals see what they will be doing if they get out and keep fucking up their lives.

We pretend that the death penalty serves as a deterrent, but we hide the process from those that we mean to fear. I think right now the system is just for vengeance, which is troubling.

[gprime]

I essentially agree with Swivel here. In theory, I see nothing wrong with the death penalty. But as it is currently executed (pun intended), the problems far outweigh the positives. The first, and in my mind biggest factor, is the cost. Simply put, security is the primary legitimate function of government. And that includes domestic protection. The more it costs, the more government takes from the people through taxation. Since I want as little of that as possible, the choice is clear based on that alone.

The second problem is that our method of execution is so mild. Between a quick and likely painless (under review) execution or decades in prison, which sound worse? Unless we use a barbaric method, like weeks of torture followed by crucifixion, then death is the easy way out. It becomes to mild a penalty.

Finally, there is the chance for error. Unless we impose exceptionally rigorous standards, such as DNA evidence plus at least two other forms of non-circumstantial evidence, then the risk is too high. You can free somebody who has been wrongfully jailed, but you cannot revive the dead.

And, as Swivel said, if we are to keep them in jail, major penal system reforms are needed. They are there for punishment, nothing else. We need to end all financial support for prisoner education, prison libraries, recreational facilities, cable television, and anything else non-essential. We need to house and feed them. Beyond that, most other expenditures are wasteful, and thus an unfair imposition on the tax payers.

[swivel]

And, as Swivel said, if we are to keep them in jail, major penal system reforms are needed. They are there for punishment, nothing else. We need to end all financial support for prisoner education, prison libraries, recreational facilities, cable television, and anything else non-essential. We need to house and feed them. Beyond that, most other expenditures are wasteful, and thus an unfair imposition on the tax payers.

My idea is to rely on private donations and charities for prison luxuries. If someone wants to raise the funds to provide a basketball court for a prison, have at it. But not my money.

I wonder what the ratio is of basketball courts in prisons that I've paid for vs. basketball courts in American communities that I've paid for. Nah, fuck that, I probably don't want to know.

[taintfutcha]

to the death means removing them from society as much if not more than "punishment". there's no punishment that can replace a life. in my opinion there's no rehabilitating a child molester, no punishment suitable.

prison is for cases that can not be proved beyond a shadow of a doubt and non violent crimes.

[swivel]

to the death means removing them from society as much if not more than "punishment". there's no punishment that can replace a life. in my opinion there's no rehabilitating a child molester, no punishment suitable.

prison is for cases that can not be proved beyond a shadow of a doubt and non violent crimes.

Agree. Now, if it is more expensive to "remove them from society" via death, than it is to keep them in prison for life... why would we choose the more expensive, and the morally questionable route?

I'm not sure I see the advantages. Especially when we are just talking about 40-50 people a year.

[The Diabolical Mr. Lieman]

Good points all around, actually. My only gripe with the death penalty is the cost and methods. Honestly, Im for death penalty reform, but it'll never happen the way I would like it to. Truthfully, we will never be too barbaric, but I really think firing squads are the easiest and cheapest way. Also, I think that once someone is sentenced to death, they should be killed immediately. It should be tougher to grant the penalty of death, because it should be an unappealable sentence.

Emotion? Check this link, which poorly describes what happened. If you check around, you will read about how the older brother, I think it was, walked out with blood squirting out of his head, and was trying to tell the kids to run. But they were too scared.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_E._Duncan_III

Or one could google Jessica Lunsford, another popular case, where it was heard that she cried when her captor wrapped her in two plastic trash bags, gave her her teddy bear, apologized to her, and buried her alive. They found plastic from the trash bag in her finger nails from where she tried to claw her way out. All after she was drugged and raped while her father, next door, looked for her.

I guess here's what Im saying. I've been to prison, and it sucks, no doubt. But it's not TERRIBLE. You get food, there are games being played, you have libraries, guards who will bullshit with you, friends, and basically, a way of life is established. There isnt freedom, dont get me wrong, and its an oppressive way of life. But it's life, and believe it or not, there are people in there who dont WANT to live outside, because they have it good there.

People like Duncan, and Lunsford's killer, deserve to die, simple. And they dont deserve to be able to live in prison, and ever get comfortable, to play card games, monopoly, to laugh with friends, to brag about what they did, to sleep and wake up and eat a decent breakfast. Furthermore....victims like Lunsford's father, and Shasta herself, deserve whatever....whatEVER solace they can get. They need to know that these men are dead, and gone from the Earth. They need some sort of comfort. It goes so much deeper than revenge, IMO, but I dont see anything wrong with revenge either.

I know the death penalty is far, FAR from perfect....but by all means, Im absolutely, positively for it.

A little more about this:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/07/02/idaho.children/

A few excerpts:

In his 1980 conviction in Washington, Duncan pleaded guilty to abducting and raping a 14-year-old boy at gunpoint, burning the victim with a cigarette and firing the gun -- on empty chambers -- causing him to believe he would be killed, according to a description from the North Dakota sex offender registry.

The registry did NOT prevent the crime from happening to Shasta Groene. But its important to know when people like THIS live in your neighborhood regardless....

More: "One of his outstanding warrants is failure to register as a sex offender in Washington," Wolfinger said. "The other is an unlawful flight to avoid prosecution out of Minnesota for second-degree sexual offense."

If this can help those who fail to register go BACK to jail, it's productive.

And again, to hammer this home, according to some of you, THIS GUY WAS BEING OPPRESSED. :o I still can't get over that shit. As you can see, by me beating the dead horse. :D


This sounds like an emotional plea for the death sentence, and Im sure some will say it is. Maybe emotion has a lot do to with it. Eh, it does. But its not JUST that. Whenever someone deserves to be put to death by the government, emotions are bound to be attached somehow.

But in all....the registry is flawed. But necessary. The death penalty is flawed. But necessary.

There is ALSO the extreme rare instance, where prison overpopulation causes extremely dangerous criminals to be released. But thats so rare, it probably doesnt ever really belong here, just saying.

[swivel]

People like Duncan, and Lunsford's killer, deserve to die, simple. And they dont deserve to be able to live in prison, and ever get comfortable, to play card games, monopoly, to laugh with friends, to brag about what they did, to sleep and wake up and eat a decent breakfast. Furthermore....victims like Lunsford's father, and Shasta herself, deserve whatever....whatEVER solace they can get. They need to know that these men are dead, and gone from the Earth. They need some sort of comfort. It goes so much deeper than revenge, IMO, but I dont see anything wrong with revenge either.

I really enjoyed this paragraph. It puts into focus the failure we have to rehabilitate/punish/prevent.

I am always on guard, though, for the things that we do today, that will seem barbaric to future generations. Capital punishment might be one of these things. I haven't quite decided yet.

I like your idea of a more difficult judicial process needed to declare the death penalty. Perhaps if the process failed to declare death, life in prison would be automatic. It would be an either/or situation. There are thousands of murder and rape cases where guilt is not at issue, and it is just a question of sentencing. Perhaps if we were killing thousands of these criminals every year the deterrent effect would begin to work. I know the cost advantages would finally lean the way of capital punishment, over life in prison, if we were killing more people (benefits of scale). Imagine what the word on the street would be if every low-life knew someone that knew someone that was put to death for murder or rape. Automatic with adequate proof. No time in prison for appeals. I think it would begin to resonate with the general public that these actions are no longer tolerated.

It is not an easy subject to feel 100% about in either direction.

[ells9824]

It is not an easy subject to feel 100% about in either direction.

It's really not, especially when technology has proven that time and time again. With that being said, I think the death penalty should mean death if there is dna evidence. No ineffective counsel suits, or cruel and unusual suits. Their victims were not killed humanely.

Now...thats where it will come down to mitigators. Anything you do to yourself should NOT be a mitigating circumstance. If you abuse drugs or alcohol, screw you. Born " No Name Smith" and passed around from orphanage to orphanage and went crazy...maybe.

Underage? bah...you killed someone.

Spoiled rich kid who didn't get their way ... absolutely not. Abused child who goes along with rich kid's fun? Maybe.

There is a case of that example that really made me question my thoughts on the DP, and pretty much dragged me into true-crime and made me understand the term Mitigating circumstance.

[The Diabolical Mr. Lieman]

I really enjoyed this paragraph. It puts into focus the failure we have to rehabilitate/punish/prevent.

I am always on guard, though, for the things that we do today, that will seem barbaric to future generations. Capital punishment might be one of these things. I haven't quite decided yet.

I like your idea of a more difficult judicial process needed to declare the death penalty. Perhaps if the process failed to declare death, life in prison would be automatic. It would be an either/or situation. There are thousands of murder and rape cases where guilt is not at issue, and it is just a question of sentencing. Perhaps if we were killing thousands of these criminals every year the deterrent effect would begin to work. I know the cost advantages would finally lean the way of capital punishment, over life in prison, if we were killing more people (benefits of scale). Imagine what the word on the street would be if every low-life knew someone that knew someone that was put to death for murder or rape. Automatic with adequate proof. No time in prison for appeals. I think it would begin to resonate with the general public that these actions are no longer tolerated.

It is not an easy subject to feel 100% about in either direction.


Absolutely.

And the bold gave me chills. Yeah, it would. ANd this comes from me, a person who deserved to die a few times for some of the shit I did. I tell ya...we would laugh at some of the punishments handed out. We laughed at cops. We laughed at the courts. When I went to prison and got out, I bragged about how easy my time was.

I dubbed it Kiddie Camp. If you can fight, if you can garner any kind of respect, or if you leave well enough alone, you're ok there.

Its overall, a myth that kiddie rapists and such get punished inside, like being raped, tortured and all that. Theyre frowned upon, yes, and some ARE beaten, but for the most part, everyone wants to do their time, and get the fuck out, or if theyre in for life, get all the perks they can enjoy. Its certainly been my experience, and the experiences of many I know who have served long sentences, that the worst part of being in prison is the bore factor.

[The Diabolical Mr. Lieman]

It's really not, especially when technology has proven that time and time again. With that being said, I think the death penalty should mean death if there is dna evidence. No ineffective counsel suits, or cruel and unusual suits. Their victims were not killed humanely.

Now...thats where it will come down to mitigators. Anything you do to yourself should NOT be a mitigating circumstance. If you abuse drugs or alcohol, screw you. Born " No Name Smith" and passed around from orphanage to orphanage and went crazy...maybe.

Underage? bah...you killed someone.

Spoiled rich kid who didn't get their way ... absolutely not. Abused child who goes along with rich kid's fun? Maybe.

There is a case of that example that really made me question my thoughts on the DP, and pretty much dragged me into true-crime and made me understand the term Mitigating circumstance.


Mitigating circumstances? Absolutely. I've misunderstood it in the past, too. And yes, with the reform, would have to come absolute proof. Beyond a concrete doubt.

So what was the case, jut out of curiosity?

[swivel]

Its certainly been my experience, and the experiences of many I know who have served long sentences, that the worse part of being in prison is the boring factor.

Wow. Not often you get the perspective of someone who has been there, and actually admits what will and won't work. I really appreciate your input on this.

If you ever feel like detailing some of your past, and protecting your anonymity at the same time, we may soon be putting in a system that allows members to "digg" forum posts that could help us generate traffic. Some of the stuff you are writing could definitely become popular.

[The Diabolical Mr. Lieman]

Wow. Not often you get the perspective of someone who has been there, and actually admits what will and won't work. I really appreciate your input on this.

If you ever feel like detailing some of your past, and protecting your anonymity at the same time, we may soon be putting in a system that allows members to "digg" forum posts that could help us generate traffic. Some of the stuff you are writing could definitely become popular.

I'm only disappointed you quoted that paragraph before I could edit "the WORSE part of it" and the "BORING factor". WOrst and bore, of course, are the words that should be there.

And sure, anytime.

Its nothing special. I just grabbed a 7 year old boy, fucked him in the ass after I stabbed his father in the ear with a screwdriver. Nothing big. And Im still a proponent of registries. :D :D

[ells9824]

Mitigating circumstances? Absolutely. I've misunderstood it in the past, too. And yes, with the reform, would have to come absolute proof. Beyond a concrete doubt.

So what was the case, jut out of curiosity?
It is not one that is well known,or even talked about much.

Joshua David Nelson- FL death row inmate # 989102
http://tinyurl.com/2zyvsb

He is one of 2 kids who killed a kid in Florida. Joshua was 17,Keith Brennan was days from 17. http://tinyurl.com/2hd2n2

Joshua had been physically and sexually abused, shuffled around from relative to relative,and kicked out of his house that day. Keith Brennan had a very privileged upbringing.

The way it went down by both boys accounts, is they had a friend with a car, something neither of them had. His name was Tommy, last name escapes me right now but I used to know it quite well.

Joshua got kicked out of his house by his step-father after getting the crap beat out of him-again. His plan was to somehow get a car and get to family in NJ. Bus or train wasn't an option because he had no money. The only way to get away was theft. Keith Brennan,16, a kid with every break you could ask for and thensome, suggested they steal Tommy's car and go. He was grounded for something or another so he wanted to run away.

The deal was to take the baseball bat Tommy kept in the car and steal the car and drive off into the sunset.
Tommy offered them the car and money, Brennan decided to slit his throat with a boxcutter anyway, even though BOTH the victim and Joshua said they didn't want that.

Kids made it to NJ with their girlfriends and were picked up. Joshua confessed, Brennan hedged and ended up corroborating what Joshua said. Both received the death penalty, and at that point, I'm still not too upset. The killing was Brennan's idea and act, but Nelson was in the thick of it.

Brennan's Dp was overturned because he was not quite 17 when the killing took place,and thats when I got offended. He changed the plan from robbery to murder,he committed the act of murder, he chose to run away from a grounding. It just didn't seem right to me that the kid with out a chance in hell of ever turning into anything but a convict no matter how hard he tried should be put to death for the act of a thrill killer.

[swivel]

Its nothing special. I just grabbed a 7 year old boy, fucked him in the ass after I stabbed his father in the ear with a screwdriver. Nothing big. And Im still a proponent of registries. :D :D

WHA?

C'mon. Don't fuck with me like that.

[The Diabolical Mr. Lieman]

It just didn't seem right to me that the kid with out a chance in hell of ever turning into anything but a convict no matter how hard he tried should be put to death for the act of a thrill killer.

Waiteaminute.

Because Im a complete idiot, please clarify that last sentence for me. What, exactly are you saying again?

This isnt a trap question, either, Im truly wanting clarification...

Thanks.

[The Diabolical Mr. Lieman]

WHA?

C'mon. Don't fuck with me like that.

Heh heh.

No, I never fucked a kid in the ass....:o

It was other shit...

[swivel]

Heh heh.

No, I never fucked a kid in the ass....:o

It was other shit...

Tease.

[ells9824]

Waiteaminute.

Because Im a complete idiot, please clarify that last sentence for me. What, exactly are you saying again?

This isnt a trap question, either, Im truly wanting clarification...

Thanks.

I though about going back and changing that statement a few times and then I forgot to. I really should have phrased it -end up dead or in prison instead of end up a con.

And even by changing it,its still pure opinion and person bias from things that happened in my personal life,or people I have come in contact with. If you want the history I would be happy to write it all out.

[The Diabolical Mr. Lieman]

Ya know what? Yeah. I'm curious.

[swivel]

Ya know what? Yeah. I'm curious.

Me too. Can you start a new thread and share?

[CPL CHUD]

Either let it deter by making it public or dump it all together.

[swivel]

Either let it deter by making it public or dump it all together.

Do you think the American public would watch and not be horrified to the point of demanding it to stop? Because even proponents have admitted to being horrified by the sight of it.

Hey, this just came to me... what if the only people who watched were the other inmates? We could broadcast it to every prison, and do it live for the people in the same joint! That would maximize us getting the right audience for the lesson.

[The Diabolical Mr. Lieman]

Lol.....that would be great.

Did you know you could make a bow and arrow with a book and a dirty pair of underwear in prison? :o

[swivel]

Lol.....that would be great.

Did you know you could make a bow and arrow with a book and a dirty pair of underwear in prison? :o

What prevents me from doing that at home?

:p

[The Diabolical Mr. Lieman]

What prevents me from doing that at home?

:p

Lmao. Nothing.




Come to think of it......(walks to the drawer and bookshelf).

My ex is coming over tonight.....

[Harley_Tech]

Given the title of this thread...I'll say I've seen the death penalty from both sides of the fence. After the readers view this link, I'll voice my opinion. http://www.tdcj.state.tx.us/stat/executedoffenders.htm

Have a look at line #68 and the offender information. That worthless turd was/is my ex wife's uncle. An interesting tidbit is that the night he was executed, I picked his body up at Ellis 1 and drove it to west Texas for burial in my 1989 Chevy Astrovan. I got pulled over for speeding and the trooper about shit himself when I told him I had a dead body in the van with me. He was VERY interested in a very quick explanation of my statement. :)

R

[swivel]

Harley, is it Ruben Cantu?

Great story, btw.

[Harley_Tech]

No, Johnny James

[Harley_Tech]

Johnny got drunk one night at a bar he once bar tended at and after closing he abducted the bartender. He drove her around for a while before stopping at a store where took the clerk there too. He raped both, and shot both killing one and leaving the other for dead. The one left for dead survived and testified against him at trial.

He lived on death row for 7 years until he decided to not continue with appeals. His punishment was living on death row, not his execution. He finally said (to me and others) "I can't go on living like this, let them kill me so my suffering will be over."

His being on death row was actually harder on his family than it was him, at least up until the last couple of years.

His family did not commit a crime, yet they suffered just as much if not more than he did.

I am a firm believer in the death penalty, only not as it is carried out today.

I believe that if you are convicted of a capitol crime, execution should take place within 30 days of your conviction. I believe the old west had it right...walk them out to the gallows after the trial is over.

I also believe that execution should be shown on prime time TV, for free. If it is not something you want to see, I believe that EVERY TV made EVER has an on/off switch. If by some chance, your's does not have a switch, it can be unplugged or you can simply walk away from it during the execution.

I further believe that the death penalty is not about deterrence, it is about making sure the scumbag can't ever do it again. I do however believe it could become a deterrent if done as I suggest above...on TV and withing 30 days of conviction.

Two things I know for sure. Johnny won't ever kill again, and he was/is guilty by his own admission to me.

R

[The Diabolical Mr. Lieman]

Wow. Thanks for the story and link.

I had a friend, his name was Eric, this guy who worked for me a while back. He's in prison now, and will spend many many years there for a crime in Florida, that authorities called a "violent rape" to me when I inquired when he'd be let out of jail in NC....but he was extradited to FLorida because of the rape.

The reason I liked Eric, was because he reminded me of me. (not the rape)

He was a guy trying to live straight, with a family, a new life---but who had very very violent tendencies, and fought to control them. I struggle with it, and he did, and because of this, we became close. I feel awful, because we engaged in some crazy shit together, involving a ruthless beating of two wanna be pimps. The taste of blood was back for the both of us, only I could control it. He coulnt. In the weeks following, he was hitting people left and right, stealing cars and shit, which I fucking HAAAATE (I have no respect for thieves and shit) and getting into serious trouble. He got caught with a stolen vehicle, and later I found out he beat up a young couple and took them out of the car...and later found out also, that he beat his wife, not to mention the violent rape. I found out the guy had a rap sheet a mile long...and realized he was nothing like me. He was far worse.

When he was drunk, he would talk in voices, and we'd laugh and butt heads and shit....but one time he told me he was planning a home invasion. I didnt believe him at the time......but now I wonder.

ANYWAY.....the moral to all this shit is this....I loved Eric dearly when I knew him. He was fiercely loyal to me. But I found out a lot of shit I didnt know about him, and one is that the guy cannot be rehabilitated. I know this for a fact. I knew the guy when I thought he was a lesser version of what he truly was. Do I think he should die? No.

But as long as he's out, he'll be trouble for people. Stealing trucks, viciously assaulting innocent people....and there are people far worse than him out there, that...well, just deserve to die, because as long as our pussy ass prisons let them out, they'll continue to get worse, and commit more crimes, worse crimes.

Im not sure if I made much sense here....:confused:

[taintfutcha]

I am a firm believer in the death penalty, only not as it is carried out today.

I believe that if you are convicted of a capitol crime, execution should take place within 30 days of your conviction. I believe the old west had it right...walk them out to the gallows after the trial is over.

I also believe that execution should be shown on prime time TV, for free. If it is not something you want to see, I believe that EVERY TV made EVER has an on/off switch. If by some chance, your's does not have a switch, it can be unplugged or you can simply walk away from it during the execution.

I further believe that the death penalty is not about deterrence, it is about making sure the scumbag can't ever do it again. I do however believe it could become a deterrent if done as I suggest above...on TV and withing 30 days of conviction.

R

i concur wholeheartedly-cheers

shot 3 times in the head and live to finger the perp-good on her

[swivel]

I also believe that execution should be shown on prime time TV, for free. If it is not something you want to see, I believe that EVERY TV made EVER has an on/off switch. If by some chance, your's does not have a switch, it can be unplugged or you can simply walk away from it during the execution.

Excellent post! I agree with everything but the bit I quoted.

You see, Morbid's TV can't be turned off. If he turns it off, when he turns it back on, it blows a fuse. True story. Seriously.

And Morbid has 8 children (the number may be larger, I don't want to say), who would be forced to watch. Or play XBox. One of the two.

[Harley_Tech]

Excellent post! I agree with everything but the bit I quoted.

You see, Morbid's TV can't be turned off. If he turns it off, when he turns it back on, it blows a fuse. True story. Seriously.



Morbid runs this site, probably from behind a very expensive confuser....DUDE, fix the fuggin TV for that "herd" of kids man! :) :p

[So Jaded]

Absolutely.

Its overall, a myth that kiddie rapists and such get punished inside, like being raped, tortured and all that. Theyre frowned upon, yes, and some ARE beaten, but for the most part, everyone wants to do their time, and get the fuck out, or if theyre in for life, get all the perks they can enjoy. Its certainly been my experience, and the experiences of many I know who have served long sentences, that the worst part of being in prison is the bore factor.


It is a myth...most baby rapers are kept in isolation so that others CAN'T get at them. Now..if they were put in GP with lifers who just don't give a shit anymore, that might be a different story. Baby rapers have more rights than the children they have abused.

Lately, it seems to me that they are really just getting a slap on the wrist. They are allowed back out into society to manipulate and rape all over again. I did a search of sex offenders in my neighborhood recently. I wasn't looking for rapists so much as I was for pedophiles. There are 5 registered sex offenders within 3 miles of my home. One of these pervs (a level 3 sex offender) lives about 4 blocks away from the elementary school. One of these 'upstanding citizens' has been convicted of 74 counts of sexual abuse on a child under the age of 12. 74!!! I'm sorry....but, why the hell is this dude still walking upright?!? He should be 6 feet under IMO. Isn't 1 conviction enough??

K...I rambled a bit. I guess what I'm trying to say is this: When you have DNA...a helpless, emotionally ruined, possibly dead victim...proof beyond reasonable doubt...etc. GET HIM OUT OF SOCIETY!!! PERIOD!! Don't think that because he is behind bars that some defense lawyer can't find a loop hole that will allow him to roam free again. Don't think that because he has to 'register' as a sex offender that it will humiliate him so bad that he won't do it again. BS...you can't fix these pervs. Well, you can....with a well placed bullet. :mad:

[swivel]

Welcome to the site, So Jaded. I enjoyed your post.

[So Jaded]

Thank you!
Glad to have found this site. I don't know how I've survived so long without it. ;)

[swivel]

Thank you!
Glad to have found this site. I don't know how I've survived so long without it. ;)

Pretty soon you will wonder how you survived US! ;)

[So Jaded]

Psshhh....you don't scare me. I have teenagers....4 of em. And 3 are girls! :p

[swivel]

Psshhh....you don't scare me. I have teenagers....4 of em. And 3 are girls! :p

No wonder you are So Jaded! :eek:

[Red24256]

Hi there, this is my first post... I was curious as to how you know so much on the Nelson case. I knew Joshua for several years, and I must tell you that I also believed that Brennan held the majority of the responsibility for that killing - it was HIS girlfriend that was the cause of the whole ordeal. As for Josh, nothing can excuse his crime, but Joshua suffered for SO many years at the hands of his family that he will never, ever, move past that abandonment and hurt.

I have also thought it unfair that Josh is left on Death Row while Brennan gained a reprieve - if only for being under the age of 18. Just one correction - Josh was 18 at the time of the crime, not 17. His birthday was in January, and the crime occurred in March. Not enough to make you a responsible adult, but enough to make you Death Penalty eligible.

All my best, and I look forward to more conversation!

Red

[Ashes]

Hi there, this is my first post... I was curious as to how you know so much on the Nelson case. I knew Joshua for several years, and I must tell you that I also believed that Brennan held the majority of the responsibility for that killing - it was HIS girlfriend that was the cause of the whole ordeal. As for Josh, nothing can excuse his crime, but I have also thought it unfair that Josh is left on Death Row while Brennan gained a reprieve - if only for being under the age of 18. Just one correction - Josh was 18 at the time of the crime, not 17. His birthday was in January, and the crime occurred in March. Not enough to make you a responsible adult, but enough to make you Death Penalty eligible.

All my best, and I look forward to more conversation!

Red




Red-
I find it quite interesting that you are such an expert on Joshua Nelson since you have not spoken with him in years and if my memory serves me correctly, he has requested that you move on with your life and leave his name out of your mouth. I see that is not the case since you feel the need to comment on his previous emotional state.. "Joshua suffered for SO many years at the hands of his family that he will never, ever, move past that abandonment and hurt." Now, I would like to take a moment to put your mind at ease. Joshua Nelson no longer suffers from such issues since I have been introduced into his life, consider it a blessing for us both.

If anyone has any questions regarding Joshua Nelson, I am his fiancee and I will be glad to answer them... accurately.

~Ashes

[Lizard]

I haven't read this full thread, so I'm not going to comment, other than to say welcome, Ashes.