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Forensicwx

Final Roll Call 4153. STLCO 10-42 10/13 @ 1519
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"A 15-year-old boy who was being held at a juvenile correctional center was sexually abused by a female security chief twice his age.

The boy’s mother spoke about the trauma she and her son have gone through as a result of the sexual abuse.

She started by saying she was sad, yet relieved when her son was admitted to Idaho’s state correctional center in 2012, where she thought he would be ‘safe.’

‘[The] night he went in, I felt bad, but I could sleep because he was safe,’ she told the Wall Street Journal.

Months later, it was revealed that her son was engaged in a relationship with 29-year-old head of security, Julie McCormick."
 
I say BS on the trauma to the boy. At that age, I would have shot someone for a 29 yr old fuck buddy.
 
That is sexual abuse of a minor and should be treated as such. Boy was probably feeling vulnerable and I expect she played on that by offering protection and security in return for sexual favours. Grown adults who use their positions of authority to sexually exploit 15 year old children need to have the full force of the law thrown at them.

She was the head of security, FFS! Boy might not have felt able to say "no"!
 
I say BS on the trauma to the boy. At that age, I would have shot someone for a 29 yr old fuck buddy.

Unless you actually know this boy personally, you have no facts whatsoever to back up your assertion that his claims of suffering trauma are BS.

If I were only 15 and in some place around lots of mean ass peers, with the head of security - who is nearly twice my age and has total power over me - coming on strong, I'd probably have felt enmotionally coerced and traumatised by it in some measure, as would many.

We've got to stop giving female child abusers a get out of jail free card on the basis of little more than our own recollections of juvenile fantasies.
 
We've got to stop giving female child abusers a get out of jail free card on the basis of little more than our own recollections of juvenile fantasies.

First, female predators don't get a get-out-of-jail-free card. Let's just get that established right now.

Courts have to prove distress. And the FACT of the matter is that, in court, a distressed child will express distress nine times out of ten. When there's authority, drugs or threat that can be independently proven, great. They get a deserved sentence. But when a teen feels their behavior is consensual (minors cannot consent legally, but they can in practice), the court is simply unable to secure a harsh sentence. It's called having a "hostile witness". This is true for both male and female offenders. I can find you case after case of male offenders handed probation, or minimal incarceration, because they didn't drug, beat, threaten or groom their victim. The minor female just wanted to sleep with the guy.

The reason for this is more common in female perp/male victim situations is as Totes expressed... teenage boys are more sexual creatures (a phrase I feel uncomfortable even typing at my age, but I was a teenage girl once, and I had LOTS of male friends). The stereotypical teenage boy's room is plastered with pictures of scantily clad women. The same is simply not true of teenage girls. My father described young men to me as "desperate little animals". Ne're a female soul on this earth has been described to a young son as such. Nay, young females are something to be sought after and championed over.

As an egalitarian, I am all for absolute equality among the sexes. But the reality of the situation is that "equal" does not mean "same". The differences between genders cannot be denied, and to guarantee accurate justice, the crime must be judged by its merit, and not "equalized" due to the genders involved.

Yes, Totes *could* be wrong about this boy. I imagine this offender will receive a just sentence if only because of her position of authority. But if the witness feels he consented and is hostile as a result, it is a matter of hostile witness vs. D.A., not male victim vs. female perpetrator. I will point out that it's not necessarily the boy claiming trauma. It's his mother.

*I will point out at my husband's urging that I've been hit on by 12-year-old boys. How many adult males can say that about a 12-year-old girl? Furthermore, while young ladies enjoy the thrill of the hunt to an equal degree, what we want to do with our prize differs substantially. For those of you who dated in high school, you will recall that it mostly involved hand-holding and being seen together. It's not the girl recommending we go somewhere to make out in *most cases.
 
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@HagarTheHorrible
Your first sentence was very true. Unless we know the boy personally, we can't say he wasn't traumatized. On the flip side of that coin, u r assuming he was. Unless you know him, you're basing what u wrote on the "fact" that he was.
Just sayin'....
 
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@HagarTheHorrible
Your first sentence was very true. Unless we know the boy personally, we can't say he wasn't traumatized. On the flip side of that coin, u r assuming he was. Unless you know him, you're basing what u wrote on the "fact" that he was.
Just sayin'....
Not quite.....I was basing my opinion on the fact that the boy and his mother themselves claimed he was traumatised. I was just adding that this was natural and explaining why.
 
Not quite.....I was basing my opinion on the fact that the boy and his mother themselves claimed he was traumatised. I was just adding that this was natural and explaining why.
I don't believe the boy has said anything. His mother is the one claiming this trauma.
 
@Athena. Thanks for that response.

I do understand that 15 year olds can and do sometimes consent to sexual activity with adults, and that in cases where the genders have been reversed, I can certainly think of instances where the adult guy has gotten off very lightly too in my own country. So that is a fair point to a large extent.

And yes, whether there were threats or coercian involved matters.

But in this case it isn't just a case of the woman next door, or even the kid's teacher. This was the head of security in an institution where the kid was being held. The power dynamics were totally different, all very much in her hands and very little in his. Indeed, in such a situation it is the very fact that this is so which might lead to a boy feeling he has to go along with it even if there is no overt coercian. Effectively she was a woman in a position of power in an institution where the boy was being held legally in captivity. That is what makes the crime potentially worse.

And males who do this kind of stuff, though they might not always get stiff sentences, they do tend to more often than women - at least in Britain. And there is a definite attitude that exists which assumes that a 29 year old man having sex with a 15 year old girl makes her a sex abuse victim, whilst a 29 year old woman having sex with a 15 year old boy makes him a lucky bastard. There IS a definite attitudinal double standard in play which often results in more "understanding" attitudes to female sex abusers.

But yes, we do have to see exactly what comes out in court before we understand the full severity of this. Which is why I have thus far not pontificated about what sentence I'd like to see or any shit like that.
 
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@Athena. There IS a definite attitudinal double standard in play which often results in more "understanding" attitudes to female sex abusers.

I get that's the perception. What I'm saying is, the more "understanding" attitude is not necessarily unwarranted.

Men tend to get more time because young women are more difficult to bed, quite frankly. Due to the increased difficulty, some level of manipulation is typically present. 29-year-old males don't generally find 15-year-olds desperate to sleep with them (unless you're my husband at 29, but I'll still cut a bitch, lol). 29-year-old females often do find teenage boys desperate to sleep with them. It's why "MILF" is a widely known term and "DILF" is not. Boys and girls are simply different in that regard. Males tend to be substantially less discriminating.

So, you see, it's not that women are getting less time because they're women. They're getting less time because they don't have to employ nearly as much manipulation. That's why it's not exactly a double standard. We're not comparing two exact same situations. In one situation, the victim is often much more willing. Less manipulation/coercion/force = less time. Attractive males tend to get off light as well.

And, as I said in that last post (which was made after a bottle of wine; not really sure that first sentence of the third paragraph is structured properly), I expect this woman will get some serious time, because she WAS in a position of authority. That tends to be a formally established sentencing enhancement or separate charge in and of itself around hurr. That counts as independently-verifiable, assumed coercion, even if the boy tries to say otherwise (but he won't try to say otherwise; the very fact that mom is talking to the press means she's thinking lawsuit).
 
Is there a trend of sexual abuse here? Have they found any other victims? Or is this an isolated incident?
I would think this would also affect sentencing.
Wouldn't it, @Athena?
 
I thought I would bring some statistics to this discussion, so will see what I can find.

The first thing I have encountered is a study of sentencing disparities between male and female child sex offenders in Colorado. But unless this state is unique in some as yet unexplained way, it is likely to reflect to varying degrees more general trends over much wider areas......

http://www.denverpost.com/ci_18726100

This clearly demonstrates that women accused of the same types of sex crimes against children there as men tend to recieve shorter sentences and are substantially less likely to be imprisoned than the men. But it also reveals a number of other things. Far fewer women are charged with such offences than men, and male victims far less likely to report such things. How much of the former is due to the latter, and how much is simply due to more males committing such crimes in the first place was not made clear. The reporting of such crimes is markedly different for male and female perpetrators, with the former generally depicted as monsters and the latter viewed far more sympathetically. The rate of recidivism of female offenders guilty of such crimes appears to be far lower than that of male offenders, which might provide a logical explanation for the sentencing disparity, although this too might also partly be due to the fact that far fewer male victims report such things.

The psychological experts involved made clear that the common perception of male teenage victims just being lucky bastatrds and not really victims at all is a false one. Even those who seem very happy and pleased with themselves at the time often suffer ill effects later. Some have gone on to commit suicide - and about 80% of teenage boys sexually exploited in this way grow up to be sex offenders of some kind themselves! So this is not just a case of some teenage kid being a lucky bastard. The psychological damage - even if he is willing at the time - is often substantial.

Here are the results of a study of the prevalence of female child sex offenders in the UK.....

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2009/oct/04/uk-female-child-sex-offenders

It is becoming clearer that female paedophile offending is much more widespread that previously believed, wuth females thought to make up between 5 and 20% of the total of active child sex offenders in the UK. Though only 2% of those on the sex offenders' register are women, and it has become clear that female sex offences are seriously under-reported, with male victims of female sex offending much less likely to come forward. But that it is so widespread is becoming clear due to the number of men now coming forward for counselling and therapy due to their experiences of being childhood victims of sexually abusive women. And it is being recognised by bitter experience that women are capable of child sex offences every bit as horrific as those of men.

And when it comes to attitudinal differences towards male and female offenders extending into the legal system itself, this particular case illustrates the phenomenon very well.....

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-eight-year-old-boy-50-times-starting-16.html

Here a young woman frequently had sex with a boy when he was aged between 8 and 10, yet recieved only a two year sentence - to serve only one year - because she "realised it was wrong". Surely she realised that before she did it! But did it anyway! The judge also showed sympathy with the embarassment that she and her family had suffered as a result of her behaviour. Can't see much evidence of shame or embarassment in that pic of her, though.

Now anyone feel free to dispute this if you will, but surely we just know that had it been a young man having sex with an 8 year old girl, no one would have given a shit how embarassed he felt. And the fact that he belatedly realised it was wrong would have counted for very little. We'd all be condemning him as a monster and the judge would be throwing the book at him - and rightly so.

Already, male victims are much less likely to come forward. The tendency, both in terms of attitudes and sentencing, to comparatively diminish the seriousness of such crimes, sends out entirely the wrong message when it comes to encouraging these victims to speak up with any expectation of being taken seriously.
 
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Where does it say she wasn't pounding him in the ass with a giant strap on?

Fact is, we don't know sufficient details to make firm judgements about the severity here yet. We don't know the nature of the sexual activities, we don't know how coerced he felt on the one hand, or how willing on the other. We don't know if any tacit or overt threats were made. And the nature of the place the boy was in is such that we cannot know how vulnerable he felt, nor how desperate his desire for some measure of protection, which this woman could have exploited by offering.

But what some of the articles I have linked to clearly indicate, however cool the boy might have been with what was happening at the time, is that there is a strong likelihood of lasting psychological damage.

It is just not normal for 29 year old women to screw 15 year old boys! And 15 year old boys are not really psychologically equipped to deal with that, however great some might concievably imagine it to be at the time.
 
Wow, @HagarTheHorrible u r quoting one state and showing that's an accurate representation, of what, the whole nation? Do me a favor.
Google how murder sentences vary from state to state.
Or try 3 strikes law vs offenders with 48 convictions.

Charges, convictions and sentences vary WILDLY in this country from one jurisdiction to another. The fact that u can locate one state out of 50 where male offenders were more prominent in these offenses tells me nothing.
 
Some have gone on to commit suicide - and about 80% of teenage boys sexually exploited in this way grow up to be sex offenders of some kind themselves! So this is not just a case of some teenage kid being a lucky bastard. The psychological damage - even if he is willing at the time - is often substantial.

Be careful not to get your statistics mixed up, dear. I actually read this shit, each and every time. ;)

Several studies show that males molested by female caregivers run a huge risk of becoming sex offenders in adulthood. Also, 80 percent of male victims of female sexual abuse have been divorced, according to a study done by Stephanie Reidlinger, a law student at Regent University School of Law in Virginia Beach, Va.

A few problems with this. Are we talking about child molestation, or are we specifically addressing sex with post-pubescent but minor individuals? I suspect these studies include child molestation victims, which is a beast of a slightly different nature and well outside of the scope established by this discussion. As a result, these statistics don't apply very well to the conversation at hand.

Among child molesters? Yes, there is a pronounced and disgusting double standard. No child is "lucky" to experience sexual behavior at the hands of an adult, ever. Every last child molester should receive an exceptional sentence, and women often don't. It is a travesty.

But I didn't think we were talking pedophiles. Secondarily, they fail to quantify the "huge risk" of becoming a sex offender after victimization, probably because the risk isn't exactly "huge". The "cycle of abuse" is an unproven hypothesis.

There is a widespread belief among professionals working in the field that in boys there is a causal link between involvement in sexual activities with an older person and subsequently becoming an adult perpetrator of child sexual abuse. However, there is little empirical research evidence for this belief. Hence, it is of considerable social, clinical and theoretical importance to ascertain to what extent perpetrators of sexual abuse have themselves been victims; also, if there is a link, to explore the underlying psychodynamics.

Part of the problem is the lack of longitudinal studies on the subject. This study, and most like them, rely on self-reporting of abuse after the fact. And it is well-known that this data is unreliable, as individuals tend to lie about abuse in their history to stem the judgment. The best way to study this issue (the one we've been talking about, teenage males, adult perps) is to follow X-number of victims for 20 years and see what happens. But that's not happened yet, to my knowledge.

Lastly, the 80% getting divorced? Again, this likely includes child molestation victims. Furthermore, the study was conducted by a law student at some not particularly renowned law school. I'd like to see her methodology, but it's not available from what I can tell. And your numbers are only as good as your source.

At no point have I disputed that adult female, minor male victim situations can be intensely damaging. I've only argued that they tend to be less often, for the reasons I've described. This is as far as I'm buying into the scope-creep. We're not talking about molested 8 year olds. And, I'll point out that the one suicide victim the article referenced stated that he offed himself because he was "infatuated" with the woman who was in legal trouble over the relationship they had. For all we know, the kid was unstable and would have done that if a 16-year-old girlfriend broke up with him. He didn't kill himself because the pain was too much. So even mentioning it was a little disingenuous on the part of the journalist.
 
Wow, @HagarTheHorrible u r quoting one state and showing that's an accurate representation, of what, the whole nation? Do me a favor.
Google how murder sentences vary from state to state.
Or try 3 strikes law vs offenders with 48 convictions.

Charges, convictions and sentences vary WILDLY in this country from one jurisdiction to another. The fact that u can locate one state out of 50 where male offenders were more prominent in these offenses tells me nothing.

I was not trying to suggest that the situation in Colorado was exactly replicated everywhere else, merely that it was likely to reflect to varying degrees more general trends over much wider areas.

And the article referencing Colorado also said this......."Experts who have studied the issue say those statistics are mirrored nationwide."
 
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Hi @Athena.

My bad. You did indeed catch me out getting my statistics muddled up. I claimed that they included the supposed fact that 80% of male sex abuse victims went on to become sex offenders themselves. I should have realised that this figure was ludicrously high. What the statistics ACTUALLY said was that 80% of male victims ended up getting divorced in later life, which is a very different thing.

If we were to liken our little debate here to a boxing match, to be caught making such an error is tantamount to being on the ropes and getting a good pummelling and hoping that the bell rings in time....lol.

Anyway, yes. The information I linked to referenced male and female sex offences against children of all ages, and not specifically post-pubescent ones. You have acknowledged that such crimes against younger children are equally appalling whatever the gender of the abuser and that female ones are not always treated with the same harshness when they should be in those cases, which you call a "travesty". We have no disagreement there, really, which made my third link rather redundant. It does seem in fact that with pre-pubescent victims and their abusers, you and I actually have no significant disagreement at all. It is only around the area of post-pubescent alleged victims that our debate really should revolve.

And yes, the suicide of the teen described in my first link was just one suicide, and we all know that a single example is not statistically significant enough to even begin to prove anything.

I also fully appreciate that not all adult therapeutic claims of abuse victimhood during childhood are acccurate or fully truthful, though there is no reason to suppose that males claiming abuse at the hands of females are likely to be being markedly less truthful than other alleged victims. It has become well known that those parts of our brains dealing with imagination and with memories, can become crosswired, and that some therapeutic techniques used in the past have facillitated this - thoughts and ideas being communicated to the person undergoing therapy that are then imagined but percieved as memories.This phenomenon has become known as False Memory Syndrome....

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/...sCustomisedMessage=&userIsAuthenticated=false

http://journals.cambridge.org/actio...e=online&aid=9001991&fileId=S079096670000389X

But nevertheless, the numbers of alleged cases of female abusers reported by adult victims later does appear to be much higher than the conviction rate. And this can only mean that either these accounts are much more likely to be untruthful than other accounts, or that such crimes are under-reported and/or under-prosecuted at the time when they are occurring, or some combination thereof. And most professionals in the field do now recognise that there is a significantly higher level of under-reporting in cases of male victims of female abuse.

You have made a whole heap of assumptions about female abuse of teenage boys often being less serious because the boys themselves are intrinsically more up for it to start with, and thus need much less persuasion or manipulation. You have presented no stats to back this up whatsoever. Nevertheless I do suspect that there is some truth to this assumption.

But it can be seriously overplayed. Because teen males themselves will often go around giving it large about how "up for it" they are. Never in a million years will most of them admit to being traumatised by any adult sexual experience. Far more likely to go around bragging about it. And - just as an example - very few 14 year old boys will admit to not having already lost their virginity, and will make false claims to their peers about the time they lost theirs. Yet statistically speaking, most 14 year old males are in truth still virgins. There is a massive element within the male psyche, particularly marked in young teenage males where sexuality is concerned, where the need to be seen as at least as much of a man as the next guy is strongly felt.This "macho imperative" is quite a pronounced one at that age. Thus, they would probably often go out of their way to downplay and hide any actual trauma and big up their own involvement at the time, and only be more honest about it later.

But I will limit my response to that for now, and look a bit later to see if I can find any stats or info that relates specifically to male and female sexual abuse of post-pubescent teenage children.

I will remain open-minded on this one, though, and open to persuasion, so it is possible for you to change my mind with a good argument backed by evidence. In fact, it is even possible that when I find the time to look for more statistical evidence myself, I might find stuff that adjusts my views before they even get to you, lol. I have no emotional or ideological investment in my current stance, other than an assumption of equality before the law.
 
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maybe so but thats if the 29 y o FB was somewhat attractive. this thing is far from attractive. lol

She ain't exactly Miss World I know, but this shouldn't really be about looks, and beauty is in any case very much in the eye of the beholder and can grow on you when you get close to someone.

I know your remark was only intended lightheartedly, and expressing witty comments to achieve a bit of a laugh is something we all do from time to time, and I found yours mildly amusing. So my more serious points are not directed at you personally.

But I don't think the attractiveness - or lack of - of any sexual offender should even be an issue when determining legal sanction.
 
being abused and raped by a person in authority is not something to chalk up to "fantasy". what the fuck, people? i am dumbfounded by the double standard employed when female on teenage male sexual abuse is laughingly excused as something that is "every boy's fantasy." how the fuck could you possibly know that? do you know this kid's history and the reasons that he would give in to a person of authority over him. abuse is abuse.

I am on your side with that one. Yes, there is from some an assumption that this kid is just a lucky bastard getting his dream come true. Yet we cannot for a single second know that. Not every kid gets off on the notion of sex with someone old enough to be their mom (or nearly so). I never did and the idea of it would have horrified me. So blanket assumptions are not helpful. The full truth and details have yet to emerge here in any case.

And I agree with your basic premise here. Abuse is still abuse, and a 29 year old adult in authority having sex with a 15 year old not only in her care but legally in her captivity, is clearly abuse, however much it may be sugar-coated.
 
Despite a Canyon County prosecutor’s recommendation of probation for Julie Elizabeth McCormick, the former Idaho Department of Juvenile Correction staffer was sentenced Friday to 20 years in prison with five years fixed for lewd conduct with a minor under the age of 16.

But 3rd District Judge Bradly S. Ford will retain jurisdiction for 365 days, meaning he could decide to release her within a year if she behaves well and responds to treatment programs early in her prison stay.

McCormick pleaded guilty in August to having a sexual relationship with a 15-year-old male inmate at the Juvenile Corrections Center in Nampa. But in exchange for McCormick’s help with the prosecution of an unrelated case, prosecuting attorneys offered to recommend a sentence of 15 years probation and no jail time.

http://www.idahopress.com/members/m...cle_4c62d140-b6e4-11e3-9ccb-001a4bcf887a.html
 
McCormick pleaded guilty in August to having a sexual relationship with a 15-year-old male inmate at the Juvenile Corrections Center in Nampa. But in exchange for McCormick’s help with the prosecution of an unrelated case, prosecuting attorneys offered to recommend a sentence of 15 years probation and no jail time.

So if she testified against someone in an unrelated case, that makes her less of a child rapist. Good to know.
 

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