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13yr Olds Abigail 'abby' Williams & Liberty 'libby' German Found Dead In Indiana

Discussion in 'In The Mean Time' started by PsychoKitty, Feb 14, 2017.

  1. lithiumgirl

    lithiumgirl Pretty Nice Troll Bold Member!

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    So you are aware of the differences then because you can make the distinction.
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 15, 2017, Original Post Date: Mar 15, 2017 ---
    Nothing ...a big strong man subdued them and then murdered them.

    Its not their fault ... its the murderers.

    That is what is so sick about this crime ... all the kids that go looking for trouble and find it and then these girls ... out hiking doing wholesome day off school (which they both loved) things. Taking pictures ... enjoying nature and then this poison.
     
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  2. Kseniya

    Kseniya Member

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    Hey thanks a heap for keeping me occupied here :) I have felt like caca doo doo all day long, either cold or allergies BAD! Urghhh! But you helped me "whether" it out and kill the time till now that it's time for me to take my medicine and go to bed, and hopefully I'll get some rest but thanks again, ever sooo much! Nite
     
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  3. Muriel Schwenck

    Muriel Schwenck Well-Known Member Bold Member!

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    I live in a Mediterranean climate and my brother dresses like that.
     
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  4. cubby

    cubby Live Long and Prosper Bold Member!

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    Where I live, in Georgia, you'll find about 90% of the men over 35/40 dress like that. To me it's typical man fashion. From a distance this guy could be both of my sons, my stepfather, any guy going to the store, he just looks like everyman, no distinction to say he's anybody special.
     
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  5. TaupinJohn

    TaupinJohn Active Member

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    @cubby I'm glad you said that! I'm in Tennessee, and that picture was exactly that: Everyman. It's the generic of pretty much the entire male population over 35. And apart from the clothes, there's not too much to go on.

    I mean he doesn't seem to have any features that stood out (like a huge hawk-nose or a really long face.)

    And a lot of the homeless around here tend to wear a lot of clothes at once (sometimes they wear all they've got.) And I don't think this guy's overdressed for a high 40's sunny day, again depending on where you are, maybe it's the norm.

    Hoping LE has a lot more than they're letting on, because despite their best efforts (and the efforts of the girls) this is beginning to feel like a cold case in the making. The families must be going through hell as that becomes a possibility. Ugh.
     
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  6. Buffettgirl

    Buffettgirl Trusted Member

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    Out here in Oregon too. Why, even in the big city here. Flannel/jeans/ballcap and Carhartt are almost required out this way...
     
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  7. ScribbleMuse

    ScribbleMuse Active Member Bold Member!

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    Forgive me if I am repeating something. I do skip a bunch of posts in this thread because of the poor grammar makes some very difficult to read and work out the intention behind them.

    To reply to comments about why the girls did not call 911, I think it's because they are like many people in ignoring their instincts when they start nagging at them. Instinct apparently surfaced if what I have read about the recordings and attention the girls gave this man is correct and not just amateur analysis. However, many people are conditioned that today's age is safe and secure, and that it's "rude" to outright follow instinct to the degree that we MAY potentially show rudeness to people who don't deserve it.

    I bring this book up periodically but still highly recommend EVERYONE read it, especially women. The Gift of Fear explores the way that we are wired to sense some dangers and that we have reconditioned ourselves that it's just mean and rude if we attempt to ignore overtures that are deadly. Especially women, and the ways that we convince ourselves that we are equal to men in brute physical strength. It is not anti feminism to face the fact that on average, a woman will be weaker than a man. Yes, there are cases that are not this way, but as someone who has been hurt by others before, I now follow a personal safety rule of never allowing myself to get close enough to grappling or wrestling with any man, if possible. Just because a man looks smaller does not mean he's weaker. I'm a fairly large framed person, at 5' 8" and 150 pounds. I've been told often I'm "strong for a girl" though I'm sure that age is now making me weaker than I used to be. Still, I've been hurt by men who are tiny in comparison.

    Just a comment about how the girls may have likely taken the photos and video out of real suspicion, but that does not mean that they'd have reported their fears. More likely, they were actively talking up the fears in a way to make it exciting and fun pretend, but would have made it into an intentional game. My daughter at this age once contrived a whole story with her friend that one of our neighbors was a murderer, AND was possessed by a ghost of one of his victims. They'd stalk out at a window to plot and fill in their story. lol It was all nonsense, but I can see a real niggling instinct catching these girls about this guy and therefore the photos and video, but no 911 calls.

    ***Edited to add that the window that Darling Daughter and friend "stalked out" was in our home and viewing the front of the neighbor's house. I would have never let them sneak into anyone's yard and peer through actual windows owned by others.... lol
     
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    Last edited: Mar 15, 2017
  8. cubby

    cubby Live Long and Prosper Bold Member!

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    And they could have taken his picture simply because he was there. Maybe one of them was an aspiring photog and wanted to take a picture of a man against a forest backdrop or lone man standing on the railway bridge, who knows. Or they could have been scared, it's hard to tell unless there is more to a recording or a video.

    I used to think I was a fancy artsy fartsy photographer with my little instamatic camera, taking picture of trees and silhouettes and stuff. I am not a photographer, in the least.
     
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  9. Kseniya

    Kseniya Member

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    Not to take away from Abigail/Libby here but CRAZY story out in my neck of the woods happened today early this a.m., began with a house fire and 6 children running to the nearby Walmart calling 911 reporting a person in the house, and a deceased woman's body pulled from a lake with a baby found alive in the passanger seat (is in stable condition) and expected to live but was found "floating" in the SUV! It is believed the two incidents are connected; abuse, divorce see link if interested:
    http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/...cle_f87ce8cc-aebc-5026-8ded-4ecde9b0bb9e.html
     
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  10. Jaded

    Jaded No fucks to give Staff Member

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    That particular story has been posted in the forums:
    http://www.dreamindemon.com/communi...-suv-when-crews-arrived-at-silver-lake.88526/
     
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  11. Alf

    Alf Sometimes Cats Know Bold Member!

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    I updated the story here, Kseniya, from the information you posted. Thank you for the heads up.

    --Al
     
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  12. Kseniya

    Kseniya Member

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    Check this youtube video also says Ron Logan, the property owner in Delphi where the girls bodies were found was arrested, in the video the interviewer said he called the police department who confirmed he was arrested for a probation violation for DUI and how he found this ODD

    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017, Original Post Date: Mar 17, 2017 ---
    Ronald Logan is the owner of the property where the girls bodies were found
    And when I googled "Ronald Logan delphi arrested" the 5th link down
    "POLICE CALLS
    Carroll County Comet-Mar 4, 2014
    21, 8:57 a.m. - Recovered stolen auto, CR700N. at 900W., Delphi. Stolen vehicle ... RONALD LOGAN, 74, DELPHI, WAS ARRESTED.
    But when I clicked on the link I did not see his name in the list
    But does show he was "ARRESTED" on Mar. 4- -OH!!! in 2014
    Wonder what he was arrested for????
    Was it this website someone posted a pic of Ron Logan along side that of the suspect and noted how similar the two were?
    I look at this man and I tell you, to me, he appears to have a "family" resemblance to the suspect, although I know the police have already interviewed his son.
    I just can't help thinking there is a "link" between him, his property, and where the girls were found.
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017 ---
    Definitely agree with u 100% !!! It needs to be "cleaned up" better. I'm wondering if a police sketch artist can use a magnifying glass with a high power magnification and draw a pencil sketch of the face, because right now we don't have "a face." because right now all anyone has to work with is his clothes and a barely recognizable hat coming toward the camera.
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017 ---
    OMG!!! I was saying someone should do a pencil sketch of the face so everyone can get some kind of idea of what the suspects FACE looks like and I just now run into this website where someone did this CHECK THIS OUT! Scroll down about halfway down this site and you'll see the suspects pic and the sketch to the right along side it! Rest of the site looks very interesting too! EXCELLENT article! goes into great detail into why he's wearing what he's wearing etc...and other pertinent case information!
    https://robertlindsay.wordpress.com...-13-2017-liberty-german-and-abigail-williams/
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017 ---
    MUST READ LINK!!! I posted this link once and am reposting it so no one misses it! AMAZING article! Take this for example:
    "Sources people close to law enforcement confirmed that both girls had their throats slit. Funerals were open casket, and both girls had scarves covering their necks, more to cover something up than as clothing."
    Libby’s grandfather who raised her made an odd statement, “I know Libby. She put up one Hell of a fight.- - the only way the grandfather would have said that is if he saw the coroners’ report."
    The author of this article says: How do I know all this?
    I have also spoken to people close to the case, including those close to the search party and law enforcement investigation of this case. I also worked a bit with Indiana State Police and the FBI, sharing my POI’s and tips with them. However, LE did not reveal much information to me other than some cleared suspects. Other information is derived from my own theorizing about the case. This includes offender profiling."
    VERY GOOD ARTICLE!
    https://robertlindsay.wordpress.com...-13-2017-liberty-german-and-abigail-williams/
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017 ---
    This article I posted twice now says Ron Logan, the property owner where the girls were found, was in Lafayette, Indiana on Feb. 13th and the "suspect" may have known he would not be there, but there is no proof of this. and cited his Source as: Media
    In his article he also gives theory as to why it is believed the girls bodies were moved to the location they were found (Ron Logan's property) and states:" he believes suspect "transported them somewhere where he assaulted them either in his vehicle or at a residence, either his own residence, an associate’s residence, an abandoned residence, or a residence that he had use of." BECAUSE that area had been searched by search team prior to finding their bodies.
    https://robertlindsay.wordpress.com...-13-2017-liberty-german-and-abigail-williams/
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017 ---
    reading one of the Comments in "comments" section on this site I posted someone talking about Damien Echols said; I do believe he might follow Damien Echols because it being the 13th and the Iowa and indiana murder dates add up to 32.That is a significant number in the occult.[then said...] I know "devil worshippers" look up to Echols so wouldn’t be shocked if he is on Echols social media sites. and gave this example of how the number 32 was derived from the dates of the Abby/Liberty and Lyric Cook/Elizabeth Collin Case also killed on the 13th (7/13/12)
    2+13+17=32. 7+13+12=32 and 32 = Satanic covenant
    To which someone replied "I don’t find it to be by chance he chooses the 13th."
    The person Damien Echols was in with the the West Memphis 3
    along with two others, were arrested and convicted for the murder and sexual mutilation of three eight-year-old boys
    The author of the article I posted said the reason he chose the 13th was probably because 13 is an unlucky number. So it’s the “unlucky day” for the girls who his victims. He thinks this is funny as he has a sick sense of humor.
     
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  13. Keepalowprofile

    Keepalowprofile Chartreuse Bold Member!

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    Oh dear lord.
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017, Original Post Date: Mar 17, 2017 ---
    I feel the need to point out that there was a woman named Abigail williams date of birth 7-12-1680

    Everyone take note, her birthday is july 12th thats just one day before the 13th. Remember lyric cook and Elizabeth collins were murdered on july 13th.
    *eye roll.
     
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  14. cubby

    cubby Live Long and Prosper Bold Member!

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    Umm yeah! LOL:rolleyes:
     
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  15. Kseniya

    Kseniya Member

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    Wonder if this suspect is like my neighbor, He is approx in his early 40's, rarely ever see him in blue jeans muchless dressed like the suspect; usually in office casual or casual sport dress, so would never recognize him if he wore what suspect is wearing! Nice guy but in all the time he's lived here he doesn't talk to anyone too much. NEVER see friends, not even girlfriends, I mean NEVER!!! He told my husband what he did for a living once but we've since forgot, not relating to what it is he does exactly, but for awhile there I thought he was a undercover officer. Drives a nice car but it's not of any make, model or color that would draw attention to one. Oh he comes and goes at wierd hours, sometimes in morning and sometimes coming home at around 2:00 a.m. Is not a drinker. But he is a strange guy, despite being nice in passing conversation. He's so "low key" I forget he's our neighbor but just thought of him this moring and made me think this is probably what this suspect is like. Even had to stop and ask myself "I wonder if it's him???" (If the guy is from out of state) But shows you how "invisible" and how unoticed people can and do make themselves.
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017, Original Post Date: Mar 17, 2017 ---
    here's a pic of Monon Bridge with two people walking along it "looking down." I can see why due to the openings in the rail road ties. Does anyone know which end is the end you would access the bridge from first getting to it? The one closest up in the photograph or farthest away??? Because I was thinking, if the point of access from the entrance to trails and bridge were from the area closest up in the photograph, then he probably made them walk the length of the bridge to the opposite end where it would be less likely to run into people coming onto the bridge. Anyone got a take on this they can add?? Been curious about this.
    http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.town...c8229/58a39f2e294e3.image.jpg?resize=1200,803

    This suspect, by his clothing in the pic, gives us the impression he is a person that blends in with the general population of Delphi. But lets take a look at the BTK killer, (Bind Torture Kill) Dennis Rader a serial killer who murdered 10 people, for example. Who In his day to day life, worked for the home alarm systems company ADT from 1974-88, which gave him access to people’s homes who started ADT services, and also gave him the necessary knowledge to disable said systems. Then, from 1989-90 when the Federal census took place, he worked as a census field operations supervisor, another job accessing entry into people's homes! And up until 2005 when he was arrested, worked as a compliance officer and dog catcher. During all those long 17 years of activity and 31 years of remaining at large, he never once slipped up or showed any signs of odd behavior, psychological or emotional backlash that would intrude on his “normal” existence. He was married and had a long-lasting seemingly happy marriage in which he fathered two children, a son and a daughter, but not only was by all appearances, a normal hard-working family man, he was also a congregation leader at his church, which he visited regularly and a boy scout leader as well. The later occupation being used by him as a perfect alibi, as he snuck out at night from the various camps he went with children to perform some of the murders!
    So I ask again, is the suspect in this pic, by the clothes he is wearing, giving us a correct depiction of what he would "normally" wear? It is very possible that the clothes he is wearing are not what he typically wears and could be the reason no one has been able to recognize him, along without a clear pic of the face. Although I have seen worse than this shown on the news, in the way of photographs and lousy surveillance that have led to catching suspects, when calling ppl to come forth and identify. pic of BTK;
    http://www.kansas.com/news/special-...500/ALTERNATES/FREE_960/btk_rader_license.jpg
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017, Original Post Date: Mar 17, 2017 ---
    Am I in the wrong thread Muriel??? If I am how do I get there??? That is still one thing I noticed I'm not familiar with, what page to go to to post, I click on alerts and I assume it is the page where I last received a response to my post. Help me out here please
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017 ---
    Ok I know that last one was a bit long.....SORRYEEEEE said I wasn't going to do that but thought it made an interesting point on how "normal" serial killers can be, and fool you by their lifestyle and dress.

    Just want to let you "ALL" know how much I LOVE this website!!!!!!!!! And "ALL" you guys, even the one's who've given me "a rough time of it," - -it wouldn't be near as much fun without you'ze! LoL But thanks so much for bearing with me as I got use manuvering around the website. I know sometimes my posts can be like reading The Great American Novel (far too lengthy!) and will try to refrain myself from here on out. Your constructive critism is WELCOME :kiss:
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017, Original Post Date: Mar 17, 2017 ---
    some great pics of the cemetery where Delphi cops swarmed around when bodies were discovered, near property where bodies were discovered and Monon Bridge
    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...iberty-German-14-Delphi-13-Feb-2017-20/page36
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017 ---
    Finally! Someone has the right idea! a SKETCH of the FACE of Suspect! I don't know what kind of drawing this is, I think a pencil would be more clearer as I think this too could be more clearer still. Without "a face/head" to those clothes, there is jusst not much to go on.
    https://robertlindsay.files.wordpre...5025082032118_8397740859158404533_n.jpg?w=500
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017 ---
    Someone recently mentioned: "that the girls may have been catfished from social media." This original rumor was relied upon by an odd statement by LE very early ion the case, “Parents need to be very careful of what their kids are doing on social media.” Adding to that were suggestive remarks from Libby’s friends about ODD ACTIVITIES on her Instagram page.- -you would think they would give us at least "an idea" of what they mean by odd activities!
     
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    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 17, 2017
  16. lithiumgirl

    lithiumgirl Pretty Nice Troll Bold Member!

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    Anyway @Kseniya ... you're correct ... serial killers are everyday people like BTK, and the person who murdered Abigail Williams and Liberty German is no different.
     
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  17. Kseniya

    Kseniya Member

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    getting more and more familiar with things around here, you've all been here for quite awhile but I tell ya, it was confussing, not the copying the quotes, but confussing that the text didn't stay "within" the box you typed in. It would just seem logical that the text is typed in the box it would "stay in the box!" LOL Getting use to your names 2, but I'll read a post or comment and when I go to mention someone said something I forget WHO it was cause I find I'm still getting who's who confussed, except for @JackBurton, I recognize his "DISLIKES" immediately to EVERTHING I post. Same 2 u Jack :mooning:
     
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  18. Mata Hari

    Mata Hari Dirty Gutter Bitch

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  19. Kseniya

    Kseniya Member

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  20. Mata Hari

    Mata Hari Dirty Gutter Bitch

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    “To have something like this in your own house, your own home - I just can’t get my mind around it yet, it’s really difficult,” Logan said. “I can’t comprehend it.”

    So he said, sounds like it definitely could have been a relative of his or something.
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017, Original Post Date: Mar 17, 2017 ---
    No, that was for DUI this search is about Libby and Abby.
     
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  21. Kseniya

    Kseniya Member

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    WOW! Property owner where girls bodies were discovered is ARRESTED and they are searching his house AGAIN! What is with this people?!!! Lets cross our fingers and hope and PRAY this leads to the killer and solving this case so the girls and their families can get justice! Video of newcaster on scene saying the purpose of the search is to "link" or clear him. On Twitter someone posted they been searching 2 hrs and someone else tweeted "Ron Logan did NOT commit that crime!!! WTF are they wasting time with him and his house for?"
    - -Well DUH but his house is where the bodies were found!!! ppl on Twitter asking if we are getting closer to an arrest. I don't think it's Logan but shave off the moustach, take off the glasses, dye the hair, maybe has a relative resembles him, the suspect? You tell me! also same manner of dress and hat!
    https://i.ytimg.com/vi/msBI38YeK4w/maxresdefault.jpg
     
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  22. lithiumgirl

    lithiumgirl Pretty Nice Troll Bold Member!

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    In your own home ... those are curious words ... who ever said Libby and Abby were in the house at all except him. I don't understand why this house wasn't searched the day the bodies were discovered ... the property is a crime scene ... I would assume every square inch of the property including any buildings could be called a crime scene as well.
     
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  23. TaupinJohn

    TaupinJohn Active Member

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    Wow!

    Anyone know what Ron Logan's son looks like?

    I know they've cautioned us not to get carried away in our thinking, but I am anyway. I'd never seen a picture (or tape) of Logan, but the similarities between him and Bridge Guy are remarkable. I wouldn't have thought Bridge Guy was quite that old, so I'm wondering if his son bears a resemblance to dear ol' dad?

    Not saying either of them are guilty. But thinking this is gonna lead us to our answers.
    I'll bet those families are experiencing every emotion on the color wheel right now, bless them.
    I so didn't want this to go cold.
     
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  24. JackBurton

    JackBurton Well-Known Member Bold Member!

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    Thought they went hiking at this park/more secluded wooded area, didnt know they were found ON someones property or anywhere near a home
     
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  25. thatsmallgrl

    thatsmallgrl Tiny Warrior - Too painful to copypasta! Bold Member!

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    I can't with the giant walls of text anymore.

    Could someone be so kind as to just pm me of they catch the asshole please?

    Thank you in advance.
     
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  26. Keepalowprofile

    Keepalowprofile Chartreuse Bold Member!

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    @Kseniya
    Jack is my favorite and least favorite person here.

    On topic
    I think its just a matter of time before there us an arrest and suspect named.
     
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  27. Muriel Schwenck

    Muriel Schwenck Well-Known Member Bold Member!

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    I'm with you! Thank goodness for www.google.com/alerts.
     
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  28. JackBurton

    JackBurton Well-Known Member Bold Member!

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    He could have been referring to the police search/investigation occuring inside/around his home, not specifically the crime itself or the girls themselves.

    The fact that they're just now searching the place suggests to me that they have absolutely jack shit on the guy. It took a long time to get a judge to sign off on them searching this in depth thru his shit because they simply had no reason to. Sounds like he owns a significant expanse of land and a couple bodies merely being found on one small sliver of it understandably doesnt grant law enforcement full rights to go stomping through someones farm house. Also, it could be that it took them this long to figure out WHO owns the property, figure out who they even need to contact and put on the search warrant and all that. That was part of what made that police search for that woman in the storage container on that sex offender real estate agents property so difficult. They had cell phone pings in a rural area if i remember right, but to go from that to singling out who owned that land(if anybody) and then searching through the significant acreage took considerable time.

    May not be anything to this guy whatsoever. The search very likely could just be a hopeful attempt by law enforcement at finding some more evidence in general, not necessarily singling out the landowner as the suspect. Anybody can walk along in a rural area and pass thru someones land or slaughter some folks in a landowners barn without that person being involved at all or having any knowledge of it.
     
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  29. Kseniya

    Kseniya Member

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    @TaupinJohn, THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!! I thought it was just me (seeing the remarkable resemblance!) and yes! It is REMARKABLE! You could almost wonder if the suspect isn't him they are so close but I believe he is a bit bigger (I think) but take those glasses off, shave that moustache, and his face looks "just like" the suspects (under same type of hat even!) And yes, I do believe they are finally on the right track to go back to the scene of the crime. I have been thinking that there is a "link" between that area behind his house where the girls were found, him owning the property, and the suspect knowing where this secluded area was located. Like the suspect has to have been someone who knows Logan, is related to him in some way, or is a friend of his kids, or friends of his kids or grandkids. Because if he's 74 he probably has grandkids in their 30's-40's. He even said his son use to play back where the bodies were found "with his buddies" I do feel sorry for the old man, he looks harmless, like a grandpa, but I think he is the key to solving this. Wonder if he would even cover up for a family member????
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 17, 2017, Original Post Date: Mar 17, 2017 ---
    ''
    How do I know I am in the Abby/Libby forum, or HOW do I get to it when I come to Demon's Den, because "normally" I come here and just pick up where I see the last comment in my Alerts and go from there. I've had two ppl tell me to go to the Abby/Libby site and I don't know wtf they are talking about, when I come here that's the only topic I see being discussed is Abby/Libby
     
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  30. Mata Hari

    Mata Hari Dirty Gutter Bitch

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    @Kseniya its not rocket science. Click on a topic and post on that topic.
     
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