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Judge Dismisses Child Porn Charges Against Man Who Filmed His Naked Children Mankato, MN – A judge has thrown out the child pornography charges field against the head coach at Minnesota State-Mankato after nude videos of his children where discovered on his work-issued Blackberry.

This past August,  police escorted 46-year-old Todd Hoffner off the field days after he turned his university-issued phone to the I.T. department to be checked out. He wasn’t told specifically why until he was arrested days later on child pornography charges over some videos found on his work phone.

The videos in question were of his nude children and investigators found the videos disturbing. They filed charges against him after conferring with the state prosecutor. Hoffner, with his wife constantly by his side, has said he is innocent from the beginning and that the videos were not pornographic. he stated they were just his three kids being silly in front of the camera after taking a bath.

These videos, two in particular that lasted a minute, reportedly show Hoffner’s 8-year-old boy grabbing his genitals and his two daughters, ages 9 and 5, bending over and spreading their asses apart for the camera. After his arrest, police confiscated computers and other equipment from Hoffman’s home but did not find any evidence to support the prosecution’s allegations that Hoffman was creating child porn. County social workers testified that after talking to the children and watching the videos themselves, they found no evidence to support that the couple’s children had been abused.

Still, assistant county prosecutor Mike Hanson said that the charges should stay and that a jury should decide for themselves if the videos were pornographic or not. “You typically have videos made to show to your friends or put on Facebook,” he said. “That didn’t happen here and it didn’t happen for a pretty good reason.”

But on Wednesday, Blue Earth County District Judge Krista Jass agreed with Hoffner, dismissing the case for lack of probable cause. She ruled the videos did not meet the legal definition of child pornography while saying the videos in question contained nothing more than “nude images of Defendant’s minor children dancing and acting playful after a bath. ”

After the judge dismissed the charges against him, Hoffner addressed reporters and gave a little more context surrounding the “pornographic” videos.  He said two of the videos were shot in June after his children took a bubble bath while he worked downstairs. His children “came down with towels on and asked me if I would videotape them,” Hoffner said. His kids had been working on a skit and wanted their father to record it.

Hoffner said he grabbed his Blackberry from a nearby table and began recording. “It started with their towels on,” he said. “They were singing, dancing and laughing. They were doing silly things, having fun.” The children eventually dropped their towels, and his son jumped in front of his sisters and “grabbed his private parts” in an attempt to sabotage the skit. (*I like this kid already*)

His daughters got upset with their brother and a few minutes later asked him to try recording the skit again. This time, Hoffner’s son pulled what we like to call a Jaded At Church, by running into view wearing nothing more than a football helmet. Hoffner said he thought it was funny, but stopped recording when he realized his son was “determined to mess everything up.” He never watched the videos afterwards, and had forgotten all about them until he was arrested.

Now that this ordeal is over, Hoffner hopes to get his job back. He’d been the school’s head football coach since 2008, but has been on administrative leave after the videos were found. A spokesman for the university said he would remain on leave pending the school’s own investigation and had no timetable for when that could be completed.

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  • CT

    Believe it or not I actually have to have a rule that my kids are not allowed to dance until they put on underwear after they get a bath. It seems as soon as they dropped the towel, the “I’ve got to groove it, groove dance” would start.

    On the other hand, my spouse would give his left nut if I would do a naked dance after every shower. Life sucks that way, doesn’t it?

  • Sam

    Hmm. So he was teaching them how to strip and got in trouble afterwards? Did he not tip them enough?

  • http://www.facebook.com/lorraine.nation.3 Lorraine Nation

    Sorry but my girls never bent over naked in front of their father

  • SayAunt

    Sounds like a “Little Miss Sunshine” skit gone awry.

  • LeaveMeBe

    What is it with kids and dancing nekkid? Especially little boys waving their little bits around? I have pictures of my kids when they were younger jumping naked on the bed after a bath, dancing in front of the fire naked after a bath and basically just running around being naked after a bath. I will say that I would have drawn the line at the bending over and spreading the ass cheeks. That’s a little too far across the line for comfort. I’m also a bit disturbed at the older two kids (8 & 9) behaving this way but not so much the 5 year old. My kids had a little more modesty at that age. Not much, but a little.

  • http://www.facebook.com/JaimeMConfer Jaime Confer

    how were the videos found? did he turn the phone in for another from the school? was it in for repairs? did someone else use it and go snooping? but the main question is, why the hell did you keep recording after the kids got naked? boys will be boys and try to ruin a good pic or video… but delete afterwards. and if your daughters dropped towels doing a “skit” why didn’t you say NO WAY and delete? something still seems odd

  • Andyman

    I know, right? There is a family photo of me wearing nothing but a holster/gun in the front. lol. I might have been four. My parents always loved to show that one to a new girlfriend.

  • Sam

    After a bath? Mine just surprise you whenever. The amount of times unsuspecting guests of ours have been treated to an impromptu rendition of the “my bum-bum!” dance, in stereo, to the beat of one or both of them smacking their naked bottoms… :)

  • EveryVillainIsLemons

    If he never posted them anywhere, how did anyone find out about them in the first place?

  • LeaveMeBe

    Mostly after baths. Once they reached two or so, the stripping off of clothes for no apparent reason seemed to stop. Usually they ran around in shorts and no shirt, which may be disturbing to some since I have a girl, but we live in Texas (it gets HOT) and I have never thought that it was fair that guys could go shirtless and it was frowned upon for girls so I let her do it.

  • LeaveMeBe

    LOL! That was so totally my brother with the holster and gun. He also had a hat and boots, though.

  • Andyman

    No boots on but I am pretty sure I’m wearing the hat. I think all kids have one of those pics. If they don’t, they should! No spreading the ass crack for the camera though. Don’t want any judges getting the wrong idea.

  • come_and_see

    My parents had an old VHS tape of me removing my diaper and running around the house naked when I was like two. They thought it was funny as hell.

  • Whatevn

    My daughter use to have this urge to run out the bathroom, nude, and shake her butt at the nearest person, after baths. I couldnt hide myself from laughing, the first time she did it so, after that, it was the best thing in the world for her to do. =_= Her grandfather would always sit there and question be on who made her start doign this, Questioning if some abuse was taking place that maybe I didnt realize. I finally had to put on my “mean” voice to get her to stop doing that

  • come_and_see

    Our brains don’t start developing the ability to see how our actions embarass us in social situations until we’re around 10. That’s why kids are so fearless about that stuff.

  • Athena

    …and?

  • OutOfBubbleGum

    Viewed by a County District Judge, an assistant county prosecutor, county social workers, Todd Hoffner and his wife, university investigators, Hoffner’s lawyers, obviously, isn’t considered to be distributing child porn?

  • newstarshipsmell

    Too bad law enforcement didn’t consider interviewing the kids before they arrested and charged him and dragged his name through the mud. Good job, guys.

  • LeaveMeBe

    Those questions were more rhetorical than serious. :)

  • tkaz

    School issued Blackberry went to IT & the images were found…

  • http://www.facebook.com/HamsterNinjaofDOOM Alecia Hendricks

    Well, obviously if her kids never did it these girls were raped or their father is twisted or something. Obviously.

  • tkaz

    I certainly have had plenty of times my children have waved a naked butt or penis at me after a bath…in fact my 8 yr old does Gangnam Style dance naked. And in the shower. And clothed. God, I wish the song would go away.
    But surely the guy realized that butt cheeks spread was not quality entertainment? Maybe the fear factor of Chris Hansen has me uber-careful….i don’t know. But I just wouldn’t record naked kids.

  • http://www.facebook.com/HamsterNinjaofDOOM Alecia Hendricks

    When I record my kids being silly I tend to forget about them until I stumble upon them later. I don’t think in the back of my mind that I could go to jail because my kid was running around naked, I don’t think of them in those terms so it doesn’t cross my mind. I think we’re all hyper sensitive to this kind of thing and start jumping at shadows.

  • sugarpie

    While I think it was in poor taste to continue to video tape after things got nakey, it doesn’t appear he was making child porn. While I think they were a little to old to be allowing the boy and girls perform in front of each other naked, I have a friend who believed it was natural for the whole family to be naked in front of each other. I was much more conservative. Either way, my son and her children both turned out fine.

  • alphatroll

    (oops, ignore please)

  • alphatroll

    Ha! Well to be fair, he wasn’t the one doing the distributing after all… ;)

  • newstarshipsmell

    Oh, well, next time just edit it to something ridiculous and inflammatory – I’ll play along.

  • Athena

    Well, it is natural for people to be naked, but it’s not my style, either. Not conservatism, per se, I just don’t really live in a climate conducive to regular nudity.

    I’m glad you noted that both your kids and her kids turned out fine. There’s nothing wrong with liking clothing or not liking clothing. The problems arise when sexual overtones are applied to everything. Unfortunately, that’s a natural byproduct of American perversion (the fear/obsession created by our Puritanical roots).

  • alphatroll

    Oh, ok, let’s see… something about how the cops probably wanted to molest the kids? Or maybe something about not trusting the smelly nuclear clown man?

    …. ehh, I got nothin’.

  • JohnQknowitall

    This is odd, but “maybe, maybe not.” I get the judge’s dismissal, but why did he keep the video and how was it found?

  • http://www.facebook.com/christi.hillesheim Christi Hillesheim

    I am from Mankato. Todd Hoffner is a much liked, well respected man in our community. His intentions were not dirty, as the media would like us to believe. There is a “Friends of Todd Hoffner” group on Facebook with over 650 supporters of Todd and his family; to include doctor’s, pastor’s, marketing director’s…etc. It is sad to think that an innocent picture/video could potentially destroy your life.

  • http://www.dreamindemon.com Morbid

    “This past August, police escorted 46-year-old Todd Hoffner off the field days after he turned his university-issued phone to the I.T. department to be checked out. He wasn’t told specifically why until he was arrested days later on child pornography charges over some videos found on his work phone.”

    “He never watched the videos afterwards, and had forgotten all about them until he was arrested.”

  • VilulaNat

    Kids are kids, being naked for them at that age isn’t sexual. However, the adult in the situation should know better than to film it…. this is not a case of child porn, just another dumb parent. It’s one thing to have a naked photo of a small child at bath time, it’s just poor common sense to video them spreading ass cheeks. I’m sure it was funny and what parents would find “cute” and non-parents might find obnoxious lol, Just be smart enough not to video it.

  • alphatroll

    If he’s like lots of people I know, he may not even know how to delete a video.

  • Athena

    Agree. I’m all for erring on the side of caution, but when the stakes are this high, one must think very carefully about charging a man with something like this. I don’t blame the individuals who turned it over to the cops, or the cops who turned it over to the prosecutor. It’s not the individual or the cop’s job to judge the legality of something like this. But this prosecutor, like so many others, was irresponsible by pursuing this. I hope this man is able to have his life fully restored.

  • JohnQknowitall

    Thanks!

  • Patrick Richardson

    This was a stupid waste of taxpayers money by stupid law enforcement officials. Plus a stupid mistake by the father to forget he had naked photo’s of his kids on his work phone. How difficult would it have been to find out wether this was serious or not before trashing the fathers reputation in front of his peers. I think a lawsuit is in order against both the school and the police dept. then maybe they’ll think twice and work a littler harder to find out what’s going on before jumping to conclusions that could ruin a life and a family. Thank goodness the judge was competent.

  • Wildheart

    I have a video clip on my computer of my younger nephew at about 3 (he’s 9 now) after his bath streaking through the house calling himself “Nakaboy” (trying to say Naked Boy). His older brother used to do it too at that age, as did their dad who is my brother. I’d hate to think I could be arrested for having that adorable little clip of Nakaboy that could be used to severely embarass him later in life. ;)

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1106642961 Alice Hennen

    It’s not a good idea in this day and age to film naked children. My cousin used to do the stripdown, even if it was Christmas Day and all the relatives were there…we used to throw things at him lol. His sister cured it by pushing him outside and locking the door once. He was banging on the loungeroom picture window while my cousin and aunt were in hysterics!

  • JGo555

    Just because a pastor supports him does not make it clean. As we all know pastors aren’t exempt from “temptations”/human nature.

  • http://www.dreamindemon.com Morbid

    Thanks. Not sure why everyone is asking that.

  • http://www.facebook.com/christi.hillesheim Christi Hillesheim

    Agreed, but I know these pastors as they are my own.

  • FrownyFace

    I think people may be thinking that he was already suspected of having something on his phone and was asked to turn it over to IT. When I read “he wasn’t told specifically why until he was arrested days later,” I at first related that to turning in his phone, not to being escorted off the field… only because being asked to give his work phone to IT for no reason makes more sense to me than being escorted off the field days before his arrest without any explanation, so that’s where my mind went.

  • http://www.facebook.com/jessica.robinette1 Jessica Robinette

    I’m confused…did the 8 year old boy take a bath WITH the 9 year old and 5 year old girls? That’s inappropriate in itself. Dad should have told them to put clothes on before he filmed anything. He’s obviously educated and got some kind of sense. What the hell was he thinking? I don’t buy his story.

  • MyHovercraftIsFullofEels

    in my bathroom, i have family photos of various people, my parents, my siblings, my nieces and my kids all as babies taking baths in various sinks/tubs. Remember how long ago it was the thing to take professional naked baby photos. I have one of my uncle laying on a sheepskin blanket from some photo studio. It was 65 years ago. So if i make a copy for my cousin, am I distributing child porn?

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Rochell-Arnold/100000587657456 Rochell Arnold

    My kids are little streakers…..and while I have thought about using it as black mail for when they get older and have first date, this kind of shit is why I do not tape or take pictures of them…..I just stick to catching them picking their nose and crap instead.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Rochell-Arnold/100000587657456 Rochell Arnold

    Why is it inappropriate? They are just kids…..

  • EveryVillainIsLemons

    Yeah, but why did it go to IT?

  • EveryVillainIsLemons

    Because the reason that his phone went to IT isn’t particularly clear?

  • Athena

    I assumed, when reading it, that, “to be checked out,” meant he was having an issue with his phone and wanted to school’s IT department to take a look at it and see if they could correct it in-house before having to send it out for repairs or replace it. That’s usually my motivation when I’m having IT check out my equipment, anyway.

  • wastintime

    You mean like some kind of fact finding? Like maybe looking at evidence first? With investigation skills and whatnot? I think you watch too much tv. Everyone knows the investigation starts AFTER the arrest!

  • wastintime

    Meh, kids do this kind of thing. I think the 9 yr old and the 8 yr old are a little old for it, but there was nothing wrong with what he did. And who knows, maybe they are nudists.

  • CT

    AMEN

  • techsupp0rt

    A photo of me as a toddler (about 2), standing stark naked on the bank of a river, tipping back a wine cooler. Today that would mean all sorts of police!

  • abbys_mom

    I’d love to know the story behind the original person who turned him in…what kind of perv with their mind in the gutter sees kids horsing around naked, and a goofy brother trying to be gross and mess up the video, as child pornography? If the video is as described (clearly it must be, since that’s also how the judge saw it), then how can that be interpreted as something dirty? gotta wonder if it’s someone who had it out for the guy.

  • http://www.facebook.com/mary.wallis.7 Mary Wallis

    I’m thinking that county prosecutor has never had children…particularly a boy child.

  • wastintime

    I used to work for a cell phone store, it was company policy to report all videos and pictures containing nudity. Especially children. And if we had a business contract, the business had to be told as well. Most companies have strict policys about what content can be stored on their devices. Poor shmuck was just doing their job.

  • wastintime

    They never have? It seems to me that it would have happened. Unless he never bathed them, helped them dress, helped with potty training.

  • Sam

    I can understand that if it’s a phone supplied by an employer, but even with private phones? That smacks very much like Big Brother / Nanny State. Not to mention the data protection issues involved. I mean, obviously, if it’s something clearly illegal going on then by all means report it, but even your basic tit / dick pics? That seems wrong to me.

  • kimbev69

    I don’t buy his bullshit story of a “skit” give me a break first off who gave them the bath and why weren’t they told to go put their clothes on…maybe dad hoped to see some naked horseplay…i think a jury should have been given the evidence and what do social workers know anyway

  • kimbev69

    did they bend over and spread their butt cheeks?

  • kimbev69

    my daughter doesn’t have to bend over for me to clean her in the tub or out of it…i don’t know who bathed you but they must have did it for the view…and her dad would tell her stand strait and that’s not nice i mean a dad teaches something doesn’t he….unless they are all just pigs and expose their assholes to everyone…

  • kimbev69

    i wouldn’t call that person a perv…but someone that is thinking better safe than sorry, obviously the prosecutors thought it was disturbing to see 5 yr old anus on a video…as do i…if i saw it or heard of it i would call LE right away. take it from someone who unfortunately has photos of my sexual abuse out there somewhere … i don’t even have a childhood photo to begin with but there are nasty ones of me out there….naked kid pics is one thing and bath pics but come on a 5 yr old spreading her cheeks … why?

  • http://pagansagainstchildabuse.spruz.com/ DodiaFae

    Yeah, but by 8, a kid should know that it’s inappropriate to be grabbing his genitals in front of people, and is it normal for a 9 year old and 5 year old to be bending over and spreading them in front of people? I mean, my kids are still young, and so they’re still learning (especially the toddler) that they should not be exposing their privates to people. A parent (or anyone) filming them doing those things is not only inappropriate, but sends the message to the children that it’s OK for them to behave this way in front of people.

    If for no other reason than that kids need to learn young *not* to behave this way (reasons include, but aren’t limited to, the fact that it sets them up for easy grooming by predators, and if they don’t learn this young, they can end up on a SOR for indecent exposure when they’re older) what this guy did was completely wrong. There are other consequences to consider, even if it was a perfectly innocent event.

  • Athena

    Yeah, the kid DID know it was inappropriate. That’s exactly why he did it, in an attempt to disrupt his sisters’ skit or whatever it was.

    Kids goof off, often in inappropriate manners. The very fact that it is inappropriate and gets a reaction is exactly what makes that kind of conduct appealing.

    And I disagree that a parent filming it gives kids the impression that it’s okay to act like that in front of people. It depends on how the father treats the situation. We don’t have the video, so we don’t know if he was telling them to stop, or explaining that it was inappropriate. But the simple act of recording behavior does not reenforce behavior unless there some verbal or behavioral support as well. Even then, it’s entirely possible to explain to a child that certain behaviors acceptable at home are not acceptable elsewhere.

  • wastintime

    No adult men showed their assholes to anyobe in this story. And I never said men were pigs,mayby you should calm yourself and read posts properly befor you reply. I was pointing out there can be compleatly inocent ways for a father to see somthing like a naked child bent over. I also poined out someplace else on this story that I think the two oldest childrens

  • http://pagansagainstchildabuse.spruz.com/ DodiaFae

    It wasn’t only the boy… the girls were bending over and spreading their cheeks. In my experience, girls don’t behave that way unless prompted. At 9, the older girl should definitely have known it was inappropriate, as well. If they were behaving this way, unprompted by the dad, he should have immediately stopped filming, sat them down, and explained why it’s inappropriate. They need to know they can’t do that in front of people.
    If a parent wishes to encourage their child to “know their own body”, it should be done in private. Not in front of people, and certainly not in front of a camera.

  • wastintime

    Two oldest children are too old to act like that.

  • http://pagansagainstchildabuse.spruz.com/ DodiaFae

    Do you have pictures of young girls bending over and exposing their genitals? Of boys grabbing their genitals? No? Seems like a completely different thing to me…

  • wastintime

    On privet phones the supervisers would have final say. I hated that job. I felt like a spy,I was only there for a month.

  • wastintime

    While I do aggre with you, theye should know better at those ages, it was not child porn. I would have stoped recording and told them to get dressed first. But thats just me.

  • Clyde The Dog

    Point to Dodia Fae….Athera 0

  • http://pagansagainstchildabuse.spruz.com/ DodiaFae

    No, it’s not just you. I would have done the same, and explained to them why it’s inappropriate behavior.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Rochell-Arnold/100000587657456 Rochell Arnold

    I was talking about the showering together. My kids occasionally share showers together, while I tell them not to do it occasionally it happens but as far as the nude dancing I agree because my kids know its wrong and why they should not be doing it. The shower thing I see as silly until they reach like puberty and at that point the I think its a huge issue but that’s just me.

  • kimbev69

    Where did you read me saying men are pigs? I said maybe “they” are all pigs in the family you know butt humour and fart jokes constantly stuff like that so maybe you need to read a little better and calm yourself down DAMMIT!!! Lol

  • kimbev69

    Completely innocent my asshole! So you would video tape it?

  • http://pagansagainstchildabuse.spruz.com/ DodiaFae

    100% agree!

  • MyHovercraftIsFullofEels

    Well my little brother used to bend over and grab his ass cheeks when he was nekkid like Jim Carey all the time “Let me ass you something”. We didn’t have cell phones back then tho. It’s not like the Dad was making them do it and that is the real thing, kids being forced to do things like that, not kids effing around being kids.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=736546181 Michael Heldman

    Sounds fishy, he’s got a vid of you spread cheek dancing too, huh?

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=736546181 Michael Heldman

    It doesn’t stop when we become full grown men either.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=736546181 Michael Heldman

    Your asshole?

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=736546181 Michael Heldman

    Excellent point, also nobody else gets charged with viewing child porn? I have always thought this about teachers that discover a nude pic on a students phone, why is the adult allowed to view it? blah, blah, blah safety, blah blah.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=736546181 Michael Heldman

    hmm, what’s in your phone pics Sam?

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=736546181 Michael Heldman

    As an IT, I can safely say, we love to check out your equipment ;)

  • EveryVillainIsLemons

    Okay, that makes sense.

  • Athena

    Your experience is very limited. In fact, it’s limited to the X-number of children you’ve bathed. With an older brother like theirs, it’s no surprise to be at all that these little girls would be goofing around in this particular nature. All the prompting kids this age need is to see one person do it once and get a “gross” reaction. Game on, at that point. That could have come from TV, for all we know.

    And who are you to say what this dad should have done? The only thing I’m willing to say he should have done was delete the video. But I’m going to leave his parenting decisions regarding a totally innocent and lighthearted activity to him.

    I get how uptight people can be regarding the subject of children and nudity, considering that sexual abuse is constantly in the news and is a primary fear of every parent. But how a parent chooses to ensure their children act appropriately outside of the home is up to them. Considering this particular story wasn’t about these kids doing this at school or when company was over, we have no reason to believe the dad has failed in that respect.

  • Athena

    Considering you didn’t even bother to spell my name right, you’ll have to forgive me for not putting a whole lot of stock in your comment. ;)

  • kimbev69

    Lol

  • wastintime

    I meant a inocent reason why a father would see his daughter nakid,like helping her gett dressed,helping her use the bathroom,please,just take a deep breath,calm the fuck down.

  • wastintime

    Okay,I see we both agree that the behavor was wrong. I have read your other comments anr we aggree on that much. So why dont we both calm the fuck down. Little girls should not behave like that,the boy is too old for that.

  • wastintime

    And I did misread your asshole post. Sorry.

  • kimbev69

    Exactly lol i took a xanax all is good lol

  • LeaveMeBe

    So I’ve noticed.

  • http://pagansagainstchildabuse.spruz.com/ DodiaFae

    Did he sit them down and explain why it was inappropriate behavior? And did he delete the videos? And whatever happened to teaching children some modesty, for their own protection if nothing else?

  • Sam

    Well, nothing *i’m* ashamed of… ;)

  • Athena

    For their own protection? This is exactly what I’m talking about. The fear of sexual assault is so thick, it creates bad logic.

    Prepubescent children goofing around, being immodest in their own home, in front of their own father, puts them in no danger whatsoever. To assume that, because they do it here, they will do it there is a logical fallacy. Kids have all sorts of behaviors that are limited to their households. I knew my audience, and it helped me grow into a well-adjusted, socially flexible adult.

    While we’re at it, when did we get away from “Children should be seen and not heard?” ;)

  • velvetjoneslives

    Hey, did you work on the McMartin preschool trial? How did that work out?

  • http://pagansagainstchildabuse.spruz.com/ DodiaFae

    If their own father doesn’t explain to them that it’s inappropriate, those children won’t know that it’s inappropriate to do that in front of others. To assume that, just because the adults in the child’s life know that it would be inappropriate for them to act that way in front of others, that the children know, is a logical fallacy The problem is that people do make those assumptions, and children don’t learn by osmosis. They need to be taught right from wrong. A friend of mine has a son who went into Kindergarten having had no experience with public restrooms, which is essentially what school bathrooms are. The bathrooms in his preschool were open (no walls) with no doors on the stalls (this was to prevent abuse). When he got to Kindergarten, he couldn’t understand why there were doors, so he’d open them on other kids in the bathroom. His parents and teacher had to explain to him about “personal space”, boundaries, and what is appropriate behavior. It never occurred to his parents that he might not already know these things.

    If they were to act like that in front of the wrong person, the adult in their lives that didn’t teach them not to could very well have set them up for sexual abuse.

    We got away from “children should be seen and not heard” when people started seeing children as individual people, not as miniature extensions of the parents, or dolls, or property. They need to be taught self control, not be controlled.

  • Clyde The Dog

    Affeenah?

  • MyHovercraftIsFullofEels

    Why was it inappropriate? Those are his children, are you saying that he should have been thinking his children were behaving in a sexual way. I certainly don’t think that about my kids. And I don’t buy into the fear mongering that everyone is out to rape or molest you. Same argument applies to saying that women who dress in short skirts deserve to be raped. Do you think that all those indigenous women with their titties hanging out are asking to be raped?

  • http://pagansagainstchildabuse.spruz.com/ DodiaFae

    What he should have been thinking was “Gee, I sure hope my kids know better than to ever do this in front of others, because you never can tell what they’re going to think about it.” (Which might be anything from “OMGs, these kids are so horribly behaved” to a paraphrasing of what has been said by pedophiles on pedophile forums, “Oh, yeah… I could hit that!”) And if they don’t learn that it’s inappropriate while they’re young, they’re more likely to get into trouble with that behavior when they’re older… like sending inappropriate pics to their SO’s cell phone, only to have their SO be a complete douche and send it to all his/her friends, or them exposing themselves to the wrong person, leading to them ending up on a SOR. I don’t know about you, but I’d hate for my kid to end up on a sex offender registry because I didn’t think I had to explain to them why this is inappropriate behavior.

    Not explaining to the kids the potential consequences of their actions is neglect.

  • http://pagansagainstchildabuse.spruz.com/ DodiaFae

    Also, statistically, 1-in-4 girls is sexually assaulted by their 18th birthday, and 1-in-6 boys is sexually assaulted by their 18th birthday. So it’s not fearmongering. If there were a virus or bacteria that were infecting that many children, people would be flipping out. But people don’t want to think about this, so it’s swept under the rug. And when did I say that children are asking to be raped or molested? I did not. No one deserves that. I’m saying that parents need to pull their heads out of the sand (or their asses) and teach their children some modesty to protect their children. Children who act out like this in public will definitely catch the eye of every pervert in the area. And if you don’t think there are that many, go to familywatchdog.us and type in your address. You might be surprised at how many sex offenders are in your area. You might be even more surprised at how many of them are on the SOR for offenses against children.

  • Heather_Habilatory

    no kidding.

  • Heather_Habilatory

    Wait. ALL nudity?! Even of people who are clearly adults?

  • Heather_Habilatory

    You don’t HAVE shame, Sam lol

  • Heather_Habilatory

    “Girls dont behave that way unless prompted.”

    Are you fucking retarded?

  • http://pagansagainstchildabuse.spruz.com/ DodiaFae

    There were 3 words at the beginning of that sentence that you left off. Are you fucking retarded?

  • wastintime

    Haha! I took a nap. Teething baby -no sleep

  • wastintime

    Yup,all nudity. The.thinking is,just because they are adults does not mean it’s consentual. It was so stupid, it did not matter how much they were enjoying it. I felt like I was being paid to be a perv.

  • MyHovercraftIsFullofEels

    And here I thought all this time that my children were safe inside our home. I guess I was wrong. I guess there is no safety anywhere.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1106642961 Alice Hennen

    What, grabbing your genitals or spreading your butt cheeks isn’t sexual?

  • MyHovercraftIsFullofEels

    You think little kids doing that is sexual. No wonder the world is so fucked up.

  • kimbev69

    Umm no did you?

  • kimbev69

    Ooh teething baby uh oh good luck with him or her

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=736546181 Michael Heldman

    oh la la

  • Athena

    You are the one making the assumptions. You are assuming that this father has not taught his children that this behavior is not appropriate outside of the home. You have no proof – not even reasonable speculation – to believe this.

    “If they were to act like that in front of the wrong person…” I’m amazed that this is a serious argument on your part. If there is a pedophile in their lives, a goof off session like this is not going to be the straw that broke the camel’s back, for Christ’s sake. The pedophile is not going to be suddenly overcome with desire and go chasing after them like a maniac. That’s not how pedophiles work, generally speaking.

    As for your friends, that’s a totally reasonable situation. I can easily see how a parent could miss that sort of thing, and this was the little boy’s first experience at school. The children in this story are in a totally different situation. They were behaving a certain way at home. They are all school aged, and there is no report of them acting inappropriately at school… leading one to believe their parents have successfully taught them what is appropriate where.

    Also, children do actually learn by “osmosis”, as you put it. Simply witnessing the behavior of others goes a long way in teaching them what behavior is appropriate in what situation. This should be reinforced by the adults in their lives, and for all we know, it has been. But the fact that these school-aged children haven’t seen anyone dancing nude at school, or at the grocery store, or at Mr. & Mrs. Neighbor’s house means they almost certainly know better as well.

    Regarding the self control – If kids can’t relax their composure at home, where can they? Kids need to be allowed to be kids. Dancing naked and doing gross stuff to get a reaction out of their dad is a totally natural, innocent part of that, and it doesn’t need to be verbally beaten out of them unless the parent has reason to believe that behavior is spilling outside of the home.

  • Athena

    That’s actually really sad. Her grandfather stifled some totally innocent fun because he’s paranoid. Tragic, and all too common.

    You know, I was talking to a friend about this very thread yesterday, and he was explaining to me that his daughter, only slightly younger than my own, hates diaper changes, and it makes him really uncomfortable to change her in front of strangers, because he can only imagine that one of them is thinking, “Is he raping her or something?” It’s total bullshit that it should even cross his mind. But I understand it. It’s crossed my mind, too, as my daughter hates to get her diaper changed. It makes me so angry that it would even occur to us that a completely natural reaction to a diaper change might have strangers suspecting abuse. I don’t know what I’d do if someone actually said something along those lines.

  • velvetjoneslives

    My comment went right over your head, didn’t it? Do you even know what the judge ruled on? In order for the case to go to the trial and to a jury the prosecutor first must prove that a crime was committed. Juries are not suppose to determine that point, at least not trial juries(grand juries can). The judge ruled that the video does not meet the states legal definition of child pornography, therefor there was nothing for a jury to decide.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1106642961 Alice Hennen

    If it doesn’t have some hint of sexuality, then what is it? Little kids do that cause it feels good. Not sure what the butt spreading is all about, but little boys grab their genitals because it feels good to them.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1106642961 Alice Hennen

    Did you ever stop to think Dodia may have experienced (or known someone who experienced) sexual abuse? This is where the words “In my experience…” come into play.

  • MyHovercraftIsFullofEels

    I’m not sure I read the part of the story that said he was stroking his tiny cock. But maybe you watched the video. I’m mean who knew that every time my son holds his penis to pee, I should be reading more into it. Enough of this you are ridiculous. I’m tired of you.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1106642961 Alice Hennen

    He grabbed it. The girls spread their butt cheeks. Dad shouldn’t have filmed, it’s gross.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1106642961 Alice Hennen

    I would feel really icky about changing a baby’s nappy in front of strangers too. Not because people would think I’m a pervert, but because I wouldn’t want to expose a child to other random people against their will. My cousin thought nothing of laying her daughter down on a rock at the park to change her – while my other cousin was having school formal pics taken and the park was full of Year 12 students! That made my skin crawl, but not as much as hearing a story of a friend witnessing some lady change her baby’s nappy on a public bus seat and stinking up the bus! I’m sure babies would appreciate a little bit of privacy and I wouldn’t want to see a baby’s shit-covered buttocks anyway!

  • http://www.facebook.com/Leashaness Alicia Lynee’

    Ummm a man who records his naked children on multiple occasions, especially when said naked children are bending over and spreading their asses for the camera is a creepy pedo. Too bad he got away with it.

  • tami

    glad this case was dismissed!!! the same thing happened to a photography who took pics of her two girls jumping on the bed just goofing around and they were naked. she ended up going through a trial i believe, even had them taken away. I’m sick of society calling anyone and everyone a pedophile but not actually LOOKING FOR THE REAL ONES smh

  • http://pagansagainstchildabuse.spruz.com/ DodiaFae

    Proof? Have any articles? A name? Location? Arrest report?