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Murder Suicide Followed Unfounded Child Abuse ClaimLakewood, CO - This is a story that is getting press now because of recent interviews given by the in-laws and the investigation that followed Dave O’Shell killing his wife and then himself after he was accused of abusing his infant daughter. Later tests revealed the baby’s injuries may have been the result of a rare genetic disorder.

Tiffany and Dave O’Shell were Lakewood (Colorado) Police officers who, after meeting on the job, got married. Tiffany, an Army reservist, had attended the University of Northern Colorado studying child physical therapy. William David O’Shell was a National Guard reservist who was working on a doctoral degree in philosophy in his spare time.

“They got married, had the baby. Everything was going great for them,” Tiffany’s father, Paul Cuin, said. “Until all this happened.”

Alyssa was their baby. She was born in the spring of 2008. On the morning of June 16, 2008 – when Alyssa was about 3 months old – Tiffany reportedly noticed that Alyssa cried when her right leg was lifted during a diaper change. Alyssa then went to sleep in her swing, so Tiffany reportedly dismissed it, dropped Alyssa at her mother’s house for daycare, and went to work.

Tiffany’s mother, Jackie Cuin, also found Alyssa to be fussy that day and noticed that she cried whenever her right leg was moved. Jackie mentioned this to Dave when she dropped Alyssa by their home later. He reportedly saw no swelling so he decided to simply watch Alyssa closely that evening.

After he fed her, it was reported that she went to sleep. By the next morning Alyssa’s leg had swollen and Tiffany called her pediatrician. X-rays were inconclusive, so the pediatrician’s office sent Tiffany and Alyssa to Children’s Hospital in Denver for more tests. Dave met them there.

Although there were reportedly no outward signs of abuse, the hospital X-rays of Alyssa’s body would reveal 11 fractures in various stages of healing in her legs. The hospital called the Adams County Human Services Department.

Because the care of the baby was shared while Tiffany worked, the entire family became the subjects of a child-abuse investigation. Child protection workers took Alyssa, assigned her to a foster home, and opened an investigation.

A hospital report called her injuries “highly suggestive of nonaccidental trauma,” and noted that nothing in Alyssa’s medical history or physical exam pointed to a different cause.

Based on recommendations from both the hospital social services staff and the family pediatrician, though, two days later on June 19, an Adams County judge reportedly ordered “emergency medical testing” of Alyssa for genetic illnesses. The family was informed by Adams County child-abuse investigators that those “emergency” genetic tests had been scheduled for October.

The abuse investigation appeared to focus on Alyssa’s father, Dave. Tiffany had told an investigator that “the only thing that he’s done that I tell him not to do is hold her upside down. She is way too little for that.” According to reports, Dave readily acknowledged picking up Alyssa by her legs to kiss her belly — and questioned if that could have hurt her.

“Did I hold her too strongly whenever I was holding her by the legs? That’s the only thing I can think of,” Dave said. “I’d give her a kiss and put her back down.”

“Did she cry when you put her back down?” the investigator asked.

“No, she liked it. She gave a little smile,” he said.

Dave and Tiffany O’Shell were allowed to see their daughter only once in the two weeks that followed. Dave reportedly heard he would be arrested on felony charges — and become a police officer behind bars. According to the family, he said that he would “be fired, discharged from the military, lose his house, his wife, everything.” Dave was also told that he would need a criminal defense lawyer and about $50,000 for bail. The family said that he was growing more despondent day by day.

Tiffany, who had her own lawyer, told others that her lawyer recommended filing for divorce if she wanted her baby back. She reportedly talked wildly of going to jail herself, living on welfare in her grandfather’s basement, and Alyssa growing up without a father.

Sometime on the night of June 29, forensic investigators would determine that Dave retrieved two handguns from inside his house. While Tiffany was sleeping, he put one to the right side of her face and shot her twice. Then he stuck both guns in his mouth and pulled the triggers. Tiffany’s mother would find them the following day after Tiffany and Dave both missed appointments with their lawyers.

Coincidentally, on the same day that Tiffany and Dave were found dead, Alyssa’s foster mother – concerned about the baby’s lack of physical development and breathing – brought Alyssa back to Children’s hospital and independently requested the genetic tests that the judge had ordered 11 days earlier.

On July 9, those test results would confirm that Alyssa had spinal muscular atrophy, a debilitating genetic disease that afflicts about one of 10,000 children. If the symptoms appear after a child’s first birthday, the consequences are less severe — poor muscle tone, weak legs and arms, a risk of broken bones and living in a wheelchair. If the disease appears prenatally or in a newborn baby, it’s reportedly considered to be a death sentence. I am sure that some of you can attest or refute this.

Tiffany’s parents say that Adams County Social Services were informed of the diagnosis but did not change opinion that Alyssa should remain a foster child.

“This diagnosis does not rule out the physical abuse that Alyssa suffered,” the caseworker wrote, because the types of fractures in her legs “are usually obtained when someone yanks or twists the limbs forcefully.”

At a child-abuse hearing on July 16, Adams County social services asked the judge to leave Alyssa in its care. Judge Katherine Delgado noted that Tiffany’s mother had been cleared as a child-abuse suspect and immediately ordered Alyssa turned over to Tiffany’s parents and granted them temporary custody.

In September, the family received an opinion from a specialist that the broken bones in Alyssa’s legs were attributable to her illness.

“I have spent 3 hours reviewing the xrays and the reports. The fractures are consistent with subjects with SMA,” spinal muscular atrophy specialist Dr. Gary Chan said in a Sept. 19 e-mail. “I would guess some of these fractures may occur at time of delivery, but most occurred after birth from normal handling. It does not surprise me that Alyssa had fractures noted at 3 months of age.”

On Oct. 28, 2008, Alyssa’s skin reportedly turned blue.

“She died upstairs in my arms,” Tiffany’s father, Paul, said.

The Cuins sued – seeking admission that the child protection team had played a role in their family tragedy – but they lost without reaching a jury. The hospital argued successfully that a murder-suicide was not a foreseeable consequence of a child-abuse investigation. Adams County social services also countered that government agencies are immune unless their behavior is willfully and wantonly wrong.

Tiffany’s father still struggles to forgive Dave. “He was a wonderful man. I loved him dearly,” he said. But “he had choices. He made the wrong one.”

That, he did.

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  • MCat80

    Wow – this is one of the most needlessly tragic stories I’ve read in a very long time…

  • Gee

    Wow Sad…. I have nothing to say about CPS. It just seems like when they should be there they are not and when there they just over do it. They can’t seem to get it right

  • Tundratot

    Did I read that right?  The “abuse” was discovered in June and, after some dicking around, the court ordered “emergency” genetic testing that was then scheduled to take place in October.  In October.  Four months later.  Yeah, that’s emergency testing.  Not.

    So, in the meantime, the infant stays in foster care while waiting for the medical profession to get to it. 

    I have no heartburn with the system being careful and keeping the baby out of the family’s hands when they suspect abuse.   However, if their first priority is to keep the family together, they should not allow a delay of months to occur just to get a test. If that test can make the difference between a baby returning to her parents, getting needed medical care, and being in an unfamiliar place while suffering from her broken bones, there is no damn excuse for a delay. 

    I figure that’s some kind of state funding — medical coverage crap.  And it’s inexcusable. 

  • reapre

    It’s really hard to comment. 

    If we only would have heard that the child had the broken thigh and they felt dad had done it…we’d all be sitting here saying off with his head.   Now we hear the whole story and change our minds.  I don’t get the murder-suicide.  I do understand his reasons for killing himself, though.

    Sucks, especially since little one died.

  • http://twitter.com/BaconIsMyNigga Shelby Burns

    I think this is the saddest thing I’ve ever read, on DD or otherwise.

  • LuvsHorror

    I was going to say something, but don’t know what to say. Just, congrats, cps, way to callously destroy a whole family. Now why not get out there and focus on the ones who do need help.

  • http://twitter.com/AngelsMom0806 Angels Mom

    “I do understand his reasons for killing himself, though.”

    Had to add that I misread the quoted sentence as “I don’t…” That’s what this response it to.

    I thought I understood true love until I had my son…I didn’t. I was married, I had a cat who I called “my baby” and I have close friends whom I do love dearly, but none of the compares to what a parent (should) have for their child. Especially a man with this daughter and a mom with her sons.

    Trying to put myself in his shoes for a second with my baby girl being taken away from me, my wife possibly doubting me, my family being questioned endlessly and them possibly questioning if I did her my baby it would probably drive me into a deep depression. Depression by nature causes you to think the worst…my wife is going to leave…I’ll never see my daughter again…I’m going to prison for child abuse. That kind of thing could cause one to snap….ESPECIALLY the thought of losing your child and there’s nothing that you can do about it (in your mind).

  • reapre

     “So, in the meantime, the infant stays in foster care while waiting for the medical profession to get to it.”

    I wonder if the child protection people would’ve fought to keep her out of the household after the disease had been found, and they had been made aware that her injuries were consistent with the disease, and not abuse?

  • JohnQknowitall

    Jesus Fucking Holy Christ Almighty… mother fucker… I am just floored… just floored.

    The torturous agony of these two young parents leading to a murder/suicide just makes me nuts.

    I understand wanting to protect the child, as anyone who reads the crap here does, but wow, there were were tests being prepared and no one was giving this couple the benefit of the doubt as the the couple were systemically being financially and mentally bankrupted.

    I wonder what I would have done in this same situation and it scares the shit out of me.

  • sugarpie

    This is a horrible story the whole way around.  Very sad.

  • LeaveMeBe

    I can understand where you’re coming from. And it makes sense in this case except it doesn’t explain why he killed his wife. That is a hard pill to swallow and just makes him look like a shallow coward.

    I feel for their families. :(

  • Cory

    That’s a really sad story I feel bad for the family.

  • Bulletproof

    I have no words except, my heart goes out to all involved…

  • http://twitter.com/AngelsMom0806 Angels Mom

    Who knows. Maybe his wife was depressed as well and feeling guilty about doubting her husband (imagine your baby being taken away LMB. You don’t know if she’s being fed properly, who’s holding her when she’s crying in the middle of the night, etc.) and in his depressed state he thought that he was doing her a favor. Men like to be protectors, it’s their nature. In his mind he may have felt he was easing her pain.  **shrug**

    Of course I have no clue. This is just so sad.

  • Gee

     Oh Stick around Shelby this isn’t even by far the saddest it gets worse unfortunately.

  • http://twitter.com/AngelsMom0806 Angels Mom

    Dream killer

  • kcjosh

    I am right there with you. It might be a paranoid thought but I’ve always been nervous about something happening to my child and then getting blamed for it. I know as a kid I was very active and reckless. I hurt myself numerous times doing stuff like falling off the bed. How many times have we seen excuses like that on this website in instances of child abuse? Amazingly sad for these parents that they couldn’t wait out a response to the tests but his life may have been destroyed anyway. The court of public opinion is a terrible one and if this got out people love to jump to conclusions.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_7N6KYE5OZO7WNUYTTYEDVWOINE Marysa Nieves

    I dunno, maybe Dad thought mom was actually the abuser, since he knew he didnt do it…..what a waste all around. Who could have guessed? Poor baby….

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_7N6KYE5OZO7WNUYTTYEDVWOINE Marysa Nieves

    If CPS hadn’t conducted an investigation & hadn’t taken the child out of the home while said investigation was going on, & then the story ended the way sooo many stories on this site do end, we’d all be howling about how CPS failed….hindsight is always 20/20.

  • Cassy_Again

    Although it is murder suicide, is it possible his wife was party to it? Perhaps he did the shooting to spare her parents the pain of knowing their daughter killed herself??

  • http://www.facebook.com/susan.m.goerke Susan M. Goerke

    TWO WEEKS.  That’s all folks, two weeks from the time the baby was placed in foster care to the time her father murdered her mother.  What an asshole.  The very day her committed the murder/suicide was the same day that meetings to discuss the situation were scheduled… everything would have been over soon, baby back home with mama like she deserved; back to live the remainder of her short life in the arms of her mother where she belonged.  Daddy dear stole that from baby and mama.  He had no right.  Did everyone miss reading the part where the grandfather (dad of the dad) states that Daddy Dearest was jealous and worried about his wife finding another man while he served time for child abuse?!  I don’t like the media spin on this, this isn’t some tragic story about a wrongly accused father, it’s a jealousy fueled murder and suicide.  What? CPS was just supposed to leave the baby w/the parents while they investigated?  Of course not.  TWO WEEKS people, never mind when the original testing was schedule, it was only two weeks before this dad gave up fighting and decided to murder his wife rather than risk her finding a new man, what a loser!  Would you give up after just two weeks?  Would any normal person who didn’t already have a history of controlling jealousy murder his wife?  Nope. No sympathy from me, except for the baby who was left to die w/o her mommy.

  • http://twitter.com/AngelsMom0806 Angels Mom


    Did everyone miss reading the part where the grandfather (dad of the dad) states that Daddy Dearest was jealous and worried about his wife finding another man while he served time for child abuse?!”

    Actually I did miss that part. Let me go back and read…

  • http://twitter.com/BaconIsMyNigga Shelby Burns

     Pshh I don’tthink I could stop reading DD, it’s part of my routine now. I’ve lurked for a while, I’ve seen shocking, I’ve seen disgusting, and I’ve seen sad, but this one by far has hit me hardest.

  • http://twitter.com/AngelsMom0806 Angels Mom

    June 26: Dave visited Charles Cooper, Tiffany’s grandfather. Over a basement game of pool, he talked about going to prison.

    “I just cannot stand anyone else with Tiffany,” he said.

    Dave had heard he was about to be arrested on felony charges — and become a police officer behind bars. He would be fired in Lakewood, discharged from the military, lose his house, his wife, everything.He would need a criminal defense lawyer and about $50,000 for bail.

    Tiffany, who had her own lawyer, confided to a friend that her lawyer recommended filing for divorce if she wanted her baby back. Given a choice, her friend told her, always choose your child.

    June 28: Tiffany told her mother that Dave said he was “going to shoot people” so police would have a real reason to arrest him. Tiffany was getting desperate, too. She talked wildly of going to jail herself, living in her grandpa’s basement on welfare, Alyssa growing up without a father.

    From the article that was linked to in the posting it appears that they were both afraid. Not just him.

  • Pyncky

    I suffer from depression and chronic pain. There are many days when I wonder what I am waiting for. We all have to die, no one gets out of here alive, but we don’t have to be in constant (even with the narcotics) pain that the doctor says there is no treatment for and that it is going to get worse as time goes on. The only thing that keeps me out of the garage with the car running is my wife.

    If I were in his position, I would be out of here so fast it would cause a sonic boom.

    But I do not condone his killing his wife first, unless they had discussed it and she wanted it that way.  Gotta give him credit, he got the job done. Not like some of the people in the stories here who kill the first person and then botch the suicide.

    I know this is TMI.

  • http://twitter.com/AngelsMom0806 Angels Mom

    It’s not TMI. I am sorry about what you’re dealing with. I can’t imagine dealing with that along with depression. Thank God you have Mrs. Pyncky. Having that one person in your life make all the difference in the world doesn’t it?

    It may seem like it but I wasn’t trying to make excuses for him…I was just trying to make sense of such a horrible situation.

  • Eliza Berntsen

    That’s so sad. I have no words. What kind of an EMERGENCY test takes 4 months to wait for? The whole meaning of an emergency is that it’s urgent. Had these tests not taken this long this story would have been a lot more different. Although you never know what the baby’s sudden death could have done to them. There could have been the same result only a bit later.

  • Terence Ng

    Or, perhaps tales of successful work by CPS where a child is rescued before they’re severely abused or sick just doesn’t make for interesting (re:tragic re:heroic) headlines.

  • ultracreep

     I think they were so damned sure they had it right the first time that they could dick around on waiting to do the tests. Obviously not. Those tests should have been done immediately.

  • Gee

     I don’t think so.

  • kniption

    To AM: Thanks.  I was looking for the quote when you posted it.  

    To SMG: The problem with that quote – and many others – is that they are completely out of context.  I had no way of knowing if the grandfather asked him “Have you thought about whether you will divorce Tiffany so that she can find a husband after you are jailed?”  If asked that, I would not consider an answer of “I just cannot stand anyone else with Tiffany” to be a ‘murderous’ response.  They were jabbering over a game of pool, after all.   

    You say he killed her out of jealousy.  Did he?  I don’t know.  Maybe.  …or maybe he wanted to kill himself and then decided that would make her think he was guilty – so he took her with him.  In that case, he would have killed her out of be pride – not jealousy.  All I know for sure is that he killed her.  As to his motives, this is the Kennedy assassination to me.  I’ll never know what happened.

    I had three main interests in the story.  First, it seemed freakishly sad to me.  Second, the question of CPS’s methods and why they wanted to hold on to the child even after the grandparent’s had been cleared as good caregivers instead of just granting them custody.  …and third – and this is the biggie – the classic question of nature or nurture: Was he born a psycho or was he made a psycho? …and if he was born psycho, could he have made it through his life without anyone knowing he was psycho if this had not happened? 

  • Gee

    ” question of nature or nurture: Was he born a psycho or was he made a
    psycho? …and if he was born psycho, could he have made it through his
    life without anyone knowing he was psycho if this had not happened? ”

    Kniption I think this the question of the week!

  • Terence Ng

    Think about how many cases aren’t exceptional when they’re addressed, but potentially could be if nothing had been done. How many kids would have died? How many kids would have starved? 

    No one writes stories about kids who were rescued before something horrible happened, just as no one writes stories about someone almost being hit by a car, almost being attacked, or almost being raped, by virtue of the fact that they didn’t happen, because what happened wasn’t exceptional in the least.

  • http://profiles.google.com/coldlogic HAL 9000

    Its a testament to shittiness of our legal system that Dr. Cop knew being innocent doesn’t mean shit and saw only one way out. In the USA we may have the law, but there is no justice left in it.

  • Eliza Berntsen

    In my opinion, when it comes down to things like these, if the CPS does want some tests, or even if tests are necessary, they should be carried out immediately. I am pretty certain that if they were to be, there would be a lot less kids in care, even if temporary.

  • annagg

    I have a feeling I know what you’re going through. Right now my husband and kids are eating dinner in the dining room and I am laying in bed wishing I could die. I have degenerative disc disorder with fractures up and down my spine, arthritis, heart disease and strep throat. I also was sexually abused by my brothers father, my brothers and my second step dad. I was physically abused by my first step dad. I lived in a children’s home because my mom chose her husband over me, and I met my biological father 2 days before mt 18 th birthday, only birthday to try to fuck to try to fuck, I would off myself if it weren’t for my kids.

  • Lena60

    This is a sad and frustrating story.It irks me they would have to wait four months for emergency  tests.I feel for this family , or whats left of it. The dad, Dave, sounds like a bit of a loose cannon.I don’t know what I would do in this case myself ,but killing myself and /or my mate would be the last thing I would do.The baby dies anyways, Damn kniption! Put a knife in my heart and twist it why don’tcha.

  • JGo555

    Was this man missing a few braincells? Not to bash him but I’ll be damned if someone accusses me of child abuse & I will not fight the charges being that I am innocent & not only that but I’ll sue whoever I can find that I CAN & win.

    I am so sorry for all of them.

  • RydoLarsson

    Very sad story :(

  • AssWho?

    Obviously you have never had your children taken/kept from you with no cause, Its like having to let someone kidnap them, If it happens to be at someone else doing, or mistake that further that only compounds it. 
    Mine was 4 days and, didn’t know if i would ever see him again, or if the courts would help me (a man). Im sure I had to have threatened 100′s of people lives over those four days. I imagine its the furthest Ive been over that thin gray line of sanity.

     Wouldn’t wish it upon another human for any reason

    Not say he was right/wrong. Just saying, fuck with a mans kids or ability to see them and there is a good chance his mind will snap.

    Innocence was such a burden for this man, he opted for guilt. Horrible 

  • lespacino

     I wonder if he killed her for the same reason he killed himself. They were both cops. If they went to prison for child abuse they were going to suffer horribly and be killed anyway. As sad/tragic as this story is- in that they both needlessly died, because their daughter died, too, at least they didn’t have to suffer that, after getting her back- assuming they would’ve.

  • Tenbux

    I think god put a “kick me” sign on your soul.

  • Tenbux

     My immediate thought was this: If she really was talking divorce to keep the child, he felt betrayed and believed that she was going to blame him.  He would get convicted for a serious crime he didn’t commit, his career/life/etc would be permanently ruined, no one would ever trust him again, and he would not be allowed to be with the kid.  His situation looked hopeless to him and he resented all the above, so he shot his wife either out of anger or just plain ole spite.

  • TheAlphaSoup

    This might be insensitive and really off-topic, but I just put my contacts in when I read the first few sentences…and I read “Jackie Chan”. Then I woke my roomie up with my laughter.

    Now on to the rest of the article…

  • TheAlphaSoup

    WTF They wouldn’t let Alyssa be at her mother’s funeral! 

  • http://twitter.com/AngelsMom0806 Angels Mom

    I didn’t want to “like” your post because there’s nothing there to like. I am sorry what has/is happening to you.

    We really need a “dammnnn” button on here. 

  • newstarshipsmell

    CPS was concerned Dave might injure her again.

  • Deety

    I really feel for the choice she had before her. Would you leave your spouse to be with your child, if you believed they had done nothing wrong? If it was the only way to see your baby again? Would you want your spouse to leave you if it was the only way your child could have one of her parents with her?

    God what a shitty situation…

  • Deety

    Yes, totally aside from abuse and custody issues, when a baby is potentially sick, delaying testing for four months is inexcusable. If a parent did that, we would be clamoring for them to lose custody. Sad that those with the power to take custody see emergency medical tests as low-priority.

  • Deety

    Holy shit, I did not catch that it was only a couple of weeks. I just lost a lot of sympathy for dad.

  • tkaz

    THis is so sad. I’m just speechless.

  • annagg

    I also have chronic fatigue, so the Internet is my life. I love dreamin demon. I’m feeling better today, just weak… Please, fight for legal medical marijuana where you can. I am not into the stuff that treats my conditions, pot is safer, even with the risk of arrest.

  • DangerousKindOfSnark

    Please keep the medical professionals and the CPS/Court System separate. One of my boyfriends work in radiology and they are mandatory reporters, but that’s all they do. If abuse is suspected they report it. That’s all. Once reported social services takes it from there, the hospital has nothing to do with the family, the testing, or the court system. If the social worker sees merit in the doctors allegations it is taken from there to the police who come to the hospital. I know from personal friends that it is a horrible decision to have to make and accuse a parent of abuse and they don’t relish doing it at all.

  • DangerousKindOfSnark

    You really need to read The Sociopath Next Door. I think you’d really dig it. You can get it on Amazon, but it might be a free credit book on Audible.com.

    http://www.amazon.com/Sociopath-Next-Door-Martha-Stout/dp/076791581X 

  • rebecca lajcin

    I had my first son when I was 17. I obviously had no idea what I was doing but I was doing it. He is and always was a fast learner. Started walking when he was 8 months. So freaking cute. Looked like a little doll walking around. One day he tried to go from the kitchen to the back porch where there was a small step and tumbled over being so small. I live in the Midwest so it’s freezing in the winter and we always keep a space heater on the back porch. That little guy ran so fast and fell down that stair so quickly before I could make it to him and fell, on his face, on the space heater. Thank God he closed his eyes because he would have burned it but he had really bad burns on his little face. The hospital kept his father and I for hours on hours asking us to repeat what happened. I didn’t mind in the beginning but then one doctor came in and was a super bitch because we were a young couple and tried playing some mind games, talking about CPS would have to take him until their investigation was over. I FLIPPED SHIT!! I’ll cooperate with anyone when it comes to them trying to figure out what happened to a baby with burns on his face. But when I tell you a thousand times it was an accident and I can barely breathe from crying for hours that my baby was in pain and you tell me you’re going to take him…well you better kill me lady because my baby is only going with me!! I get livid even thinking about it. I can’t imagine what these parents went through.

  • http://twitter.com/AngelsMom0806 Angels Mom

    I actually voted to legalize medical marijuana in MI and it won…then the shit hit the fan with the law makers. It’s ridiculous. I will continue to vote and try to make my voice heard.

  • Patr1ckBateman

     Exactly. Only the uniquely awful cases get coverage. Then people read a bunch of them and say “oh man I don’t know what’s happening to the world”.

  • Patr1ckBateman

    I can see where the guy was coming from, but fundamentally disagree with his actions. Yes it would have been an unthinkable nightmare facing his wife leaving and being accused of abusing his own kid. Add to that mix being a cop in jail for child abuse? Whoa, would he last a day in there?
    But I believe that even when you’re at rock bottom, keep fighting. Especially when you’re innocent. You get accused of that and then kill yourself, most people are gonna say that’s an admission of guilt. If he’d just hung on, the evidence would have vindicated him. I could never lie down if someone accused me of something so disgusting, something I would never do in a billion years. And I would never kill my missus. Dude got depressed and desperate, made the worst choice.
    I know it sounds like bullshit self help mumbo jumbo but keep fighting. Never give up. Once this life’s gone that’s it. There’s no afterlife and no god, so make the most of this existence.

  • TheAlphaSoup

    Lol? 
    The source article (http://www.denverpost.com/recommended/ci_20300073) said this was AFTER the murder suicide…unless that was a joke? I’m kinda tired, so I may be reading things wrong…

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/LFRWXJ3LPB6H23VQSADVLH6OCE Brightroses

    “Suspected” abuse in my eyes is not good enough cause to yank a child from its parents. You have to know for a fact that they are hurting their kid. People can disagree all they want but I know I am right. All you supporters of CPS have never had your world torn apart by them. I distrust every single one of them and most police too. It scares me because as a mother with a special needs child I know for a fact how easy it is for some moron with no common sense to believe my child to be a victim of abuse. When someone doesn’t understand something they always jump to the wrong conclusion and I know that people with children who are disease ridden are always gonna be at risk for suspicion. And those so called experts at CPS are not the brainiacs they think they are. The told me that a detached retina could be caused by spanking but the eye specialist and pediatrician said that is not true (my daughter’s retina detached while she was still in the hospital due to extreme prematurity by the way so I was already aware of her vision problems). I know some people would say better to be safe and prosecute a few innocent if it gets the guilty but that is such a backwards way of thinking. Laws are meant to protect the innocent–not matter what the age, and as far as the guilty ones who slip through the cracks–God will take care of them.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/M44KXXXG2R4JZ4LQBAPNDILZCA Robert

    So are we saying that cases like these are collateral damage? I have experienced something similar to this mans case. I had/have DCF in my life for somehting that was an honest accident. There have to be boundaries. When they are broken something must be done. It is their job to keep kids safe. These people have a lot of power in taking children from their families. With power comes responsibilty. If you ruin a families life someone should be held accountable. Agree?

  • Pyncky

     I’m sorry this has happened to you and I agree about the pot.  I take Oxycontin and Oxycodone, but would love not to. With my job, though, I cannot take the chance of using pot, they would take my certification away in a heartbeat.

    DAMN YOU, RICHARD NIXON!

  • Patr1ckBateman

     Oops, clicked the like button instead of reply. It’s 5.25 am here. Look, I am not sure how your comment relates to mine. I was not being flippant about the case, or dissing the authorities. I am just saying that the really bad stories always get in the news. There could be hundreds of stories about things going well, or times where things almost went horribly wrong, but that one horrible story gets the coverage. So it would be misguided to read all of those and conclude that the world is nothing but horrible things happening everywhere. Because a lot of good is there too. It’s hip to be misanthropic, but I believe it’s not the right attitude. Hope this clarifies.

  • annagg

    We know how you feel. Thank the good Lord, I own my own business. My husband works at a machine shop, and cut his finger open on a peice of metal this morning. He had to go to Concentra or Care One or whatever to get 3 stitches. His company requires a breathilizer and a weird drug test that he said he had to pee in, and it looked like a spaceship. The whole container, lid and all, slid into a machine that was the size of a toaster oven. He said it tested for everything and then some, highly advanced. Thank God, he was clean. We would lose everything if he peed dirty.

  • Wicked Smilee

    If only we had a “do-over” button,….

  • pikeman

    Someone hacked into your profile and is spamming DD with dangerous malware sites. You need to change your password if you get my message. That sucks.

  • DorianJ

    I join you in the pain gig. even with strong as hell pain killers and everything and the boat,I’m still in constant pain 24/7 because I have a genetic disorder that causes all kind of crap. its hard sometimes not to want to end it all. this story  is so sad. three lives lost. his parents must suffer something horrible affer all this.

    but man, double guning it is impressive. no fucking it up that way. wow.

  • BEastDuo

    It may not be so much that the tests were not preformed fast enough to fit the emergency standard of the courts, but the fact it can take up to a -year- to get results from such a test. I used to work closely with DVIS ( Domestic Violence Intervention Services) and even if a DVIS lawyer requested it, it would still take months. It partially has to do with the logging system, partially with medical laws regarding DNA, and how long getting the results from the testing actually takes. We are regaled with CSI: XX,XX, and Maury “You are not the Father!!” shows, and it has made society think we are rather more advanced than we actually are in the science of DNA. Just because you have DNA does not always mean you have a slam dunk, and it never happens in bite sized 45 minuet shows.

  • BEastDuo

    Forgive me if that sounded rehearsed or unintentionally condescending. I can’t tell you how many times I have had to make that point to people when I worked for the courts.