Chesterfield, SC - Dear Ryan Schallenberger,
High school sucks.  GirlsGirls reviews
can be bitches. BoysBoys reviews
can be assholes. Stuff happens that makes you want to slam your locker and blow up the building – but you know all about that, don’t you? Yeah.  See, Ryan, I’ve looked at what passes for your Myspace, and I know you don’t even have a FacebookFacebook, and your social network is kind of jacked. But Ryan, Ryan, Ryan… don’t buy your ammonium nitrate on EbayeBay.
Yeah, I know. Columbine looks cool from where you’re sitting. Trenchcoat Mafia represent, and all that. All hail the underdog. I feel ya, kid, I really do. Adults who think their corporate life sucks really ought to give high school another go and remember. But here’s the thing – bombing the school? Unoriginal. It’s been done. See “Heathers”Heathers reviews. Christian Slater DIES in that movie, dumbass. Don’t be Christian Slater. Have you seen his career lately?
So you were gonna make a nail bomb or ten. Teach Chesterfield High a lesson they wouldn’t forget. Left audio recordings to be played after your death. Misunderstood, check. Revenge, check. Blaze of glory, check. Newsnews coverage? Well, you got plenty of that now, don’tcha, slick?  I know you’re really pissed at your parents for calling the cops. You know what? They probably didn’t even think it was for you at first. They probably looked at the package and went “WTF? You can make meth with that,” and it didn’t occur to them you had more devious designs. But you, you were smart, huh? Had it all written out, huh? “Columbine III”? That’s the worst name for a revenge bombing I’ve ever heard.
But all’s well that ends well. Nobody will be laughing at you in class, because you won’t be in class. You’ll be doing a little psych eval after your bond hearing tomorrow, and then you’ll either go inpatient or you’ll give the mainstream crime blogs and news media something to chew on for awhile as you stand trial and your lawyer talks about how you resented being bullied by future frat boys and their lipgloss Lolitas.
I feel for you, kid, I really do. But you’re an assclown, because seriously, did you even get positive feedback for the Ebay transaction? Next time, just smoke some weed or borrow your mom’s Xanax. It’ll make you feel rebellious and mellow all at the same time. Or, y’know, just create an alternate universe where you’re the ruler, like me.
LoveLove reviews, Imp Queen
3:15 pm on April 21st, 2008
You are the ruler and we love you!
3:56 pm on April 21st, 2008
All hail Impqueen! (you haven’t bought any explosives lately, have you?)
4:03 pm on April 21st, 2008
Don’t forget about the acne.
5:14 pm on April 21st, 2008
I commend his parents.
5:18 pm on April 21st, 2008
Me too. They did what was right instead of what was easy. Good parents, in my opinion.
7:04 pm on April 21st, 2008
Parents sought help from mental health experts when he slammed his head into a wall last week.
8:20 pm on April 21st, 2008
Was that the first time that happened, UC? Sounds to me like it could’ve happened before…repeatedly. That would kind of explain his violent tendencies.
10:08 pm on April 21st, 2008
Hmmm…I wonder if Ebay will ban the sale of fertilizer on their site now…..
1:37 am on April 22nd, 2008
great write up that is so directed at him ~
I do hope he gets a chance to read it ~
8:18 am on April 22nd, 2008
This was the funniest summary I’ve ever read. I howled my way thru it. Funny, funny, funny.
9:26 am on April 22nd, 2008
That littel blog was as scouring as an ammonium nitrate milkshake. How anyone looks at school massacres, with all the pain and distress and still thinks ‘Yeah! – I wanna be that guy!’ is beyond me. Big guns, rigid pipe bombs, massive explosions – don’t they cover symbolism and transference in Sex Ed?
9:45 am on April 22nd, 2008
Imp, your humor is scalding and so damned appropriate! Thanks for the laugh! Some “big boy” is feeling like a scared little kid right at this moment.
9:09 pm on April 22nd, 2008
Oh god! A Heathers reference. I totally thought that movie was hilarious. But then again, sometimes my humor is a little warped.
9:55 pm on April 22nd, 2008
Great write up….You are the fucking Queen!!!!
12:33 pm on April 23rd, 2008
From CNN’s article on the subject:
Acquaintances said they were surprised by the allegations against the straight-A student.
“He wouldn’t hurt a flea,” neighbor Carl Parker said. “People just don’t know him like I do. He’s a good kid.”
Students said Schallenberger often ate alone in the cafeteria. “I never thought he’d be the dude to do something like this,” said James Ford, a 16-year-old sophomore.
How many times will we hear about kids who hang out alone before we start offering them some social contact? To this day, if I see someone hanging out by themselves, I make it a point to walk over and try to strike up a conversation. What could it hurt? The worst that’s ever happened is the person acts unenthusiastic.
12:47 pm on April 23rd, 2008
I thought that after Columbine teachers and school administrators were supposed to be “trained” in watching for warning signs and risk factors. There wasn’t a single teacher who noticed this kid repeatedly eating alone?
2:13 pm on April 23rd, 2008
Athena, you are so right. Lonely isolated people are craving companionship, and even if they’ve become defensive due to their isolation, you can always break through to someone in the end if you persist.
Example; I used to do the same thing at my old workplace where we got lots of…um…psychologically disturbed people coming in. Some from drug abuse, some from just generally having a fucked up life. Anyway, everyone else would avoid them like the plague, and scatter whenever they came up to the front desk where I worked. I did the opposite, and went out of my way to accomodate whatever their problem was. I used to go out on my breaks and sit with them, share a cigarette and have a yarn with them about their day, their life, what was going on in their world. Without fail, and I mean WITHOUT fail, I ended up being a trusted friend of them. It didn’t happen the first time I was friendly towards them, but after time all of them were much calmer and happier when I was around and dealing with them.
I hope this kid gets some good help, and manages to build himself a support network of friends and family. He’s going to be out one day, and hopefully by then he’ll have enough in his life to feel thankful for that he no longer wants to destroy it and everyone else’s.
2:31 pm on April 23rd, 2008
Well, sure, Lizard, but still…From an administration standpoint, you can recognize a threat and still not be able to do anything about it. This kid could have been on a list or something, but what then? You can’t expell a kid for sitting alone…
Actually, I’d be curious about protocol at that point. I mean, I know they’re supposed to recognize these people…but what then?
Golden – I’m so glad to hear there are people who go the extra mile. You know, so many people take socialization for granted. We’re so used to being smiled at and talked to. I think about this kid, sitting alone, day-in and day-out, by himself…and my heart bleeds for him. It in no way, shape or form justifies what he was planning, but it ought to be recognized as a preventable social ill. It’s peers who act as a catalyst for these peoples’ destructive behavior – it’s peers who can prevent them from hitting that boiling point. I’d say that’s worth the effort.
On another note, from CNN: The acting U.S. attorney for South Carolina says a teenager accused of planning to bomb his high school will face a federal charge of attempting to use a weapon of mass destruction. The charge carries a possible life sentence.
2:41 pm on April 23rd, 2008
Oh, no, I didn’t mean expel him. But maybe…ask him how he is? I was thinking more along the lines of some sort of positive intervention (and “intervention” is really too strong of a word), but I can’t say I know what might be a good way of approaching him.
3:01 pm on April 23rd, 2008
I might think that adult intervention could actually exacerbate things. I mean, here you’ve got a kid who’s already feeling completely dejected and spiteful…Intervention by a teacher may seem insincere, and feeling as though he is being pitied could make the situation worse, no?
I don’t know either, Lizard. I can’t say I know what it’s like to be so consistently alone or, worse yet, the target of harassment by popular students. It’s got to suck somthin’ awful, though, to contribute to such depraved behavior.
3:10 pm on April 23rd, 2008
It just seems like there has to be something you could do in a case like this. I imagine if I were one of his teachers, I would be thinking, “Could I have stepped in somehow?” I’m trying to see what they have at the National School Safety Center Web site, but their server isn’t responding right now….
9:22 pm on April 23rd, 2008
I hate to be the badass here, but I’ve gone the extra mile and reached out to people and had it blow up in my face. I would never counsel a young woman to reach out to obviously disturbed men, for instance, such as this guy. Or the elderly person who lives alone to reach out to jsut anyone. A person doesn’t have to be obviously insane to be insane and dangerous. Didn’t we just have a story here about someone who invited an 18-year-old into her home and her neighbor’s cat ended up duct-taped and dying of perforated bowels?
So I’d say “reach out, but be careful who you choose.”
12:02 am on April 24th, 2008
Reaching out should begin in elementary school, when offers of friendship/mentorship by teachers or other adults is more readily welcomed, and the child getting attention by a teacher is respected, rather than ridiculed. And parents need to instill these values in their children, too. I tell my kids that they should be nice to everybody, and if they see a child who looks lonely, they should try to include them in group activities. As a result, the friends my children invite over on any given weekend could be from one of the wealthiest families in town, or the kid whose dad is absent, and whose mom is a crack whore. They all get the same amount of love and attention when they are here. They also are expected to follow my rules, and know that, while I will not ‘discipline’ someone else’s child – if they break the rules, they have to ‘earn’ another invitation.
I eat lunch with each of my younger children at school once a week, and I encourage them to bring a friend or two with them to the ‘family’ table at the end of the lunchroom which is there so parents can have a little ‘privacy’ with their children when they come eat with them. I think I have had each of the little girls in my daughter’s classes eat lunch with us at least once this year, and many ask if they can eat with us when they see me there. One day I had six of my 8-year-old’s friends at the table with us. And all of the girls (and some of the boys) will come over to me for a hug when they are leaving the lunchroom. Some of these kids would never get to eat at the ‘family’ table, if my daughters didn’t invite them to eat with us.
I have also received some really strange looks from people when I take my kids to extracurricular events. When four of my girls were all in clogging at the same time, and I was pregnant with my son, I went to the state fair to watch my girls perform. I was seated beside an older gentleman, and his eyes got bigger each time one of my ‘girls’ from the dance team came over to hug me and thank me for being there to watch them. Every girl in the group called me mom – and there were fifteen girls (in addition to my four) who were there that day. After about the tenth “Hi, Mom!” accompanied by a hug and kiss, the man looked around, then glanced at my 4 months pregnant belly (which looked more like 8 months – it was my sixth baby), and asked me incredulously, “Ma’am, how many kids you GOT there, anyway?” I just laughed, and told him they were all mine, I just only actually gave birth to 5 of them.
One of the girls in the group was from a home where both parents are hard-core drug addicts, and she was being raised by a grandmother with too little time to do much ’supervising’ of the girl’s activities. I knew the girl had a bad reputation, and had some serious anger control issues, but she came to my house frequently to spend the night with my daughter. As far a I know, I am the only adult she never swore at (or even around), and she actually told one of her classmates to STFU one day when a comment was made about my level of involvement in my teen’s life. I was not there, but my daughter told me the girl suggested to the other child that she was “just jealous that your momma don’t love you that much”. She had been in trouble many times, and had threatened her own grandmother, and hated both of her parents. She spent many nights at my house with my daughter, and never once broke one of my rules while she was there.
This girl quit school when she turned sixteen, and four months later, asked if I would homeschool her along with my daughter who I was homeschooling that year. I told her that I would, as long as she could follow all of my rules, and we were working toward getting a curriculum for her, when she decided to just get her GED instead. I am sure that I am not the only person who helped her along the way, but she always knew that she could call me if she needed a ‘mom’. The last time I spoke with her, she had just enrolled at a community college, and was going for a nursing degree.
There had to have been many times in this boy’s life when someone could have stepped in and given him some attention. Most people simply don’t know how, or don’t think it’s necessary to reach out to the ‘bad kids’ because their parents are alcoholics, or drug addicts, or on welfare – and everybody knows that kids of people like that will just continue the cycle…right? My daughter’s friend is living proof that that is not true. If I hadn’t completely believed that before knowing her, that would have made a believer of me. All of us can make a difference – if we only take the time to try.
I’m not saying that this boy could have been prevented from doing what he did by having someone in his school reach out to him, because by the time you are that age, I don’t know if you can reverse that pattern. But it’s possible that if he had been included by more people, at a younger age, and had parents who made it their business to know what he was doing on his computer (and in the rest of his life as well), this might have been prevented.
I am not advocating that you allow your children to go hang out with the sluts and druggies in their school; my daughter is only allowed to go places with people whom I know beyond a shadow of a doubt have been raised with the same moral standards as mine. But I have never refused to let my children invite over ANY of their friends based on their reputation or that of their parents. They are simply expected to follow the same rules my kids follow while they are in my home. I have yet to have a child break one of my rules deliberately.
5:47 am on April 24th, 2008
hear hear Athena.
Firstly there’s a big difference between being sociable and accepting of other people IN PUBLIC, and putting yourself in danger with a clearly disturbed person by allowing them into your home. The VAST majority of people with psychological disturbances or issues are NOT violent but they are treated like lepers and outcasts by people because society is paranoid.
Of course, I’d never advocate a young vulnerable person, female or male, to reach out in a way that clearly is unsafe, but people shouldn’t regard simple normal social interactions, like a smile or a “hello” as potentially dangerous because statistically they’re not. It’s that belief (that normal interaction is dangerous) that is causing people to become more and more detached from each other.
7:35 am on April 24th, 2008
Again, I am not advocating for ignoring unpopular people, having been one myself for many, many childhood years. But I was stalked by a man whom I barely knew. I was ONLY socieable and friendly IN PUBLIC and did not invite him into my room nor into my life. He took it upon himself to find out where I lived, break down my apt. building’s door, phone me every night at 3 am and eventually drive me into hiding. I only want to add some shading to the “reach out and befriend” concept.
Though statistically improbable, that was no comfort when it happened and it scarred me.
Normal interaction is exactly what got me in trouble. It is wrong to ignore that women in particular are socially acceptable targets for unstable men, whether they are targets for stalking, rape, assault, harassment, robbery, or other things.
In my experience, a social loner is that way for a good reason. And while I say hello to everyone and try to treat everyone with social acceptance until they prove that I need to distance myself, it isn’t always that easy to create distance once its need is perceived.
Advocating for what has worked for you and telling your stories of friendship achieved is heartening, but I am hesitant to let it be the entire story. I may be reading your posts wrong because in that regard. If so, I apologize. But I want to be sure that anyone getting ready to reach out to strange, isolated people who are shunned by all take a little time to determine if it’s just habit that makes people avoid this individual, or just social ineptitude on the person’s part, or if there is a good and real reason to be cautious.
10:44 am on April 24th, 2008
I’ve been a lurker for a month or more now, but registered to comment specifically about this case. My heart absolutely breaks when I read about these kids and I generally have no where to go with it for discussion because my viewpoint is sort of, well…. not very popular. Then I read what Angel had to say and decided I might find a friend here.
So, here goes. I have a 16 year old son with ADHD and possible bi polar disorder. He’s been in trouble pretty much since the day he was born, primarily because he can sense a “fake” from a mile away. He has this sixth sense about people that is hard to explain, but basically, he can tell if a person is “real” or not. Will you like him for who he is? Will you tell him the truth? Will you be nice because you’re nice or because you’re a butt-kisser? That sort of thing. Unfortunately, he’s learned that most / many? people are just simply not genuine. Including authority figures. His early experiences in elementary school seriously scarred him forever, imo. He was active and “naughty”. Teachers hated it. They wanted him to sit still, be quiet and follow the rules. Standing in line was a skill he MUST learn. If he couldn’t stand in line, after all, how would he ever survive in the “real word?” No one let up. My husband and I were told by the principal that he was the “worst kid the school had ever had in their building.” The constant angry looks, arm-grabbing, “sit in the hall” and other disciplinary action, “redirection” and parent meetings were obviously noticed by the other students and their parents and he was left out by everyone, unless it was for the purpose of ridicule by the “good” kids and their “caring” parents, who would invite everyone in the classroom to their children’s birthday, except my son. Believe me, their children noticed and their parents actions were soon mimicked. By the time my son was in 2nd grade, he’d become a bully. His whole demeanor changed when he walked into the school – preparing himself for the wrath of every teacher, administrator, and student in the building. The bullying changed to extreme loyalty to those he decides he can trust, and a penchant for pot, which he readily admits to using to anyone who asks. It soothes his soul, he’ll tell them. He’s lonely, a bit angry, and misguided. But mostly he has little to no self-esteem and is scared to death about who he is and what it all means. At almost 17 years old, he has only a small group of friends who barely make it to school. All are in alt education programs, including my son, who attends school only 3 hours a day – it’s all he can manage. He still can’t stand in line, is impatient and lacks focus. But primarily, his fear of others – authority and peers, is overwhelming.
What he needed was… one adult authority figure to care about him AS HE WAS, and one friend to be as loyal to him as he is to those he cares about now.
I, too, have been a parent who encourages my children to include everyone. Race, creed, socioeconomic status, whatever. I live by the mantra that good is greater than “evil.” In other words, I don’t believe that kids battling behavior issues have a greater chance of “rubbing off” on kids that are not, than the “good” kids have of rubbing off on those battling issues. I believe that with time and patience, the latter scenario will win. My 20 year old daughter has always chosen her friends for who she knows them to be in their heart, not in their behaviors. She brought many a pot-smoking, beer drinking juvenile delinquent friend to our home (like lost puppies) to share a meal at our table. And like Angel, I never had a problem. They were polite and generally smart and charming kids suffering from loneliness, fear and anxiety on their journeys into adulthood. Many of them are now tattooed and pierced… and good, good people. Some continue to be lost, but I believe they will find their way because they are not alone.
The boy in this story should not have been alone. Our school systems have created a monster with the “no tolerance” policies, which is in direct conflict with the teaching of “tolerance” in the classroom! Our kids are being taught to “tolerate” (we can talk about that another time, can’t we?) the “losers” (disabled, minority, outcast, whatever they are that make them “intolerable”), but the administrators don’t need to. They don’t need to ask questions when a kid is acting out, they can just throw their hands in the air and say, we don’t tolerate it, it’s the policy. No thought has to go into their decision making regarding discipline issues because they have a “no tolerance” policy. A kid writes something on the bathroom mirror and they’re out. No questions necessary – there is a “no tolerance policy.” A student brings an aspirin to school and “we have a no tolerance policy” so the student is expelled. A boy kisses a girl on the playground during a game of tag (if they’re alllowed to play tag!), and they’re out – “no tolerance policy.”
Finally, I need to say this. Bullies and the sullen / lonely student are often suffering the same pain. They are simply acting out differently. The bully is looking for attention by making themselves heard and the sullen / lonely student is pulling into the fetal position to make themselves invisible. Our schools teach “anti-bullying” programs that encourage students to call the bully out for their behaviors. They’re taught to tell the bully “you can’t hurt me” and walk away, and other strategies to help students escape from and manipulate the bully. While I don’t necessarily disagree with that approach, I don’t believe it’s the answer. It’s missing at least this… invite the bully to join you! Include the bully in your games, parties, events, activities, and conversations. That’s what the bully wants in the first place! By telling the bully they aren’t hurting you and walking away we’re not stopping the bullying – we’re creating bigger and more sophisticated bullies, and our kids are being taught that “evil” is greater than good. That they have to ignore and shun and stay away from the “evil” one – not engage them and bring them to the good. The same is true for the sullen / lonely student. They act like they want to be left alone, but they don’t. In neither case will the inclusion of lost souls work the first time engagement is attempted. It will take often and consistent effort for these kids to come to the good. Giving up on them and the effort will only further isolate them.
I’m off MY soapbox now. And I sincerely, sincerely thank anyone who took the time to read this entry. Frankly, though, it was cathartic enough for me to just have had a place to write it.
Thank you.
11:10 am on April 24th, 2008
Actuallly, yes. He did get positive feedback:
http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/2008/04/ryan-schallenbe.html
On a side note, you wrote a great article. I like the way you approached it!
11:32 am on April 24th, 2008
Yoga – well said.
11:33 am on April 24th, 2008
I thought it was an excellent post, Yogaluvr. And you will find acceptance here for almost anything you care to expound on, as long as it’s not hateful, hurtful, or advocating something illegal (although ‘illegal’ is a loosely defined word in that sentence, as I have often offered to ‘exterminate’ some of the more heinous people profiled here). You may not find agreement on everything you post, but as long as it is well written, and has some thought put into it, it will usually be accepted without creating a flying shitstorm.
So, welcome to the site! It’s always a pleasure to have a new poster offer an opinion. Keep coming back!
However, I think you may be right on this topic. You and I may be in the minority with our advocacy of unilateral inclusion for the children. I think a lot of people are simply more cautious than I am, and perhaps I should take a few pointers from them, as my friendly and accepting nature has gotten me severely screwed over a couple of times in my life. Not by kids, though, but by other adults. I am by no means naive, but I am a soft touch for kids, especially if it looks to me as if they are starved for affection. And those kids are usually easy to spot.
Also, just to clarify my position to Goldenchild and Wry, because it seems from their posts that they may have misunderstood part of my book-length post (LOL):
I will not allow my children to exclude or shun another child based on ‘popular opinion’. I will not refuse to let any of my children’s friends come to the house for dinner or a visit. However, if they break my rules, they will have to ‘earn’ the right to come back. Different situations call for different ‘atonements’.
That said, I will also not allow my children to place themselves or the family in danger. There are only a couple of my 14-year-old’s friends who are allowed in the house if I am out, and they are both female, and spend as much time at my house as they do their own anyway. My children may not have anyone over if I am out (except for the aforementioned two), precisely BECAUSE I hold my children’s safety as such a high priority. I will say again, though, that offering acceptance and affection is all it takes in most situations to turn a child onto a better path in life.
11:47 am on April 24th, 2008
Thank you LL44 and Angel.
I just have to say this… I ADORE my kid. I seriously, seriously do. And I totally believe one day it’ll hit like a ton of bricks, and he’ll be on his way to doing something to help himself. But he’s a pain in my yoga arse! And his friends are, too.
By the way, I have been known to create a flying shitstorm or two in my day, so I’m not afraid. But you should see how filthy my umbrella is!
11:55 am on April 24th, 2008
Angel and Yogaluvr – I couldn’t agree more. You both pretty much summed it up to a “T”.
You can’t judge kids by their parents or social status. You have to love a child and try to reach them, no matter their circumstances. Some you can reach, some you can’t. But if no one ever tries, how do you reach anyone?
I too, always tried to help the “unfortunate” – whatever the case. My mom, had different views, if they were into drugs, or any bad behavior, I was to not hang around with them and “pick up their habits”. It was a crock. I was told, “that doesn’t mean you can be mean to them, you still have to be nice”. I guess that is where the “fake” Yogaluvr’s son was picking up on came from, by others “just being nice to get by them”. Oh, well, Mom just wanted to look out for me. I don’t blame her, I just think it wasn’t the proper way to handle it.
And, just like all kids, what ever you are told not to do – you have to try — so the “bad” kids were my friends and I sought them out. I hope that I influenced some of my friends that “this is not the way things work” – others influenced me to some extent. Luckily I was hard headed, and like most teens, I knew I WAS RIGHT – so most peer presure didn’t affect or influence me. I didn’t care if I was the only one NOT doing it. Peer pressure meant nothing in the big picture. I had/have my own thoughts and set of morals, so I just stuck to them. Sometimes it turned out for the best and sometimes, I was just an idiot – but, at least, I stuck by what I believed in my heart and head to be the right thing or the wrong thing to do or not to do.
11:55 am on April 24th, 2008
So is the couch in the corner, where Imp is kept chained most of the time. If you want to have a seat there to chat with her, I suggest you bring your own handy-wipes so you can clean off a spot to sit.
12:02 pm on April 24th, 2008
“presure” – I mean pressure – should have proofread a little closer.
12:04 pm on April 24th, 2008
LOL – Hey, since you mention the couch – where did it go? You know the one right below the Einstein quote – where did that lovely couch go? I miss it.
12:24 pm on April 24th, 2008
Wow…Some beautifully written posts, Angel and Yogaluvr. Yogaluvr, I found yours to be especially useful, as it is important for people to consider the elements that create a “bully” or “loner”. Ultimately, people are responsible for their own behavior, and bullying, or actions like Ryan was planning, are not tolerable and are deserving of punishment. However, it is advantageous that we try to understand and correct the things that contribute to the final product. Further ostracizing and belittling a kid like Ryan may be good for a laugh, but, ultimately, it is unproductive.
Wry – I do appreciate you trying to give the perspective some balance and I am glad you noted that your experience has not turned you into an unfriendly person. I suppose my comment about the individual being unenthusiastic being the worst thing that can happen was a bit overzealous. Still, we can’t discourage people from friendly, public contact with people who appear to need it because it went bad in one case.
12:43 pm on April 24th, 2008
Athena, no, I got what you meant and you’re amazingly similar to me in that respect, the bit I added on was in response to Wrybread.
These two paragraphs in particular I could have written myself!
And for Wry, I wasn’t so much disagreeing with you, because yes, people DO need to be careful, but more clarifying what I meant originally. It’s horrible what happened to you, and I don’t mean to be dismissive of it at all by speaking about the statistical likelihood of something adverse happening as a result of being sociable.
The truth is, as much as I’m very gregarious with people, for example what I did at work, I’m also kinda paranoid and “survivalist” in my internal psychological makeup. I’m very protective of myself, my family, and personal info that could backfire on me, and I kinda expect everyone to be the same (yeah dumb I know). So I don’t think to offer the other point of view like you did, because in my head that just goes without saying, you know? There does need to be a balance, and I’m happy you’ve provided it.
12:53 pm on April 24th, 2008
Being burned by the person (kid/adult) you try to reach out to is a tough one, but think of it this way… The kid in this story was being burned every day, all day. Maybe not by everyone, but by enough that he decided the real “good” guys in this world were 2 distraught teenagers just like him, and their answer was to kill a bunch of other teeangers. Just imagine if this kid’s perspective had been changed by one person who had the kahunas to reach out to him every day until there was a positive response? I’m thinkin’ this kid (and others?) might not have decided that the answer was to throw in the towel and just kill the problem.
namaste
1:04 pm on April 24th, 2008
namaste
You really ARE a yoga lover!
It’s actually quite appropriate given this conversation, though.
1:09 pm on April 24th, 2008
Goldenchild, you are quoting me, but addressing Athena. I just wondered if you realized you were doing this. I kinda figured you were referring to my post the first time, even though you addressed Athena then, too.
While I take it as a compliment to be mistakenly identified as someone who is as brilliant as Athena, she has an absolutely outstanding writing style which I could not even begin to approximate. Her posts are like a DaVinci painting, in prose. Mine are more like a fingerpainting kit most days – usually fun, but messy and all over everything!
1:12 pm on April 24th, 2008
I also feel that teachers are as guilty, if not more guilty than children. They allow this by the “good” kids and participate in it themselves. As adults, they should be reaching out instead of participating in childish behavior, further isolating the so called “bad” kids.
1:20 pm on April 24th, 2008
Heh heh, whoops. Perhaps I should go to bed…it is 3 am here after all.
*blush* my apologies Athena and Angel…it’s the two A’s, they confuzzled me.
1:31 pm on April 24th, 2008
What country are you in?
1:33 pm on April 24th, 2008
S’alright, GC.
I will forgive you this time, my child – but next time you shall be beaten! (said in my best scaryman voice). LOL.
Go get some sleep, or you’ll wind up like me – bleary eyed, and looking like a hag on crack! *snicker*
1:34 pm on April 24th, 2008
GC lives in Australia!
1:40 pm on April 24th, 2008
Welcome to the site, Yogaluvr. Thank you for posting – very nicely done, well thought out, and I appreciate your viewpoint.
1:41 pm on April 24th, 2008
Pooh, you are right. My son had a 1st grade teacher that I believe nearly destroyed him as a person. In fact, she bold-faced lied to me about something she claimed he did in class one day, while I was standing outside in the hallway observing through the doorway glass. She didn’t know I was there, I saw the whole incident unfold, watched as she humiliated my son, huffing and puffing at him, poking her index finger at him, etc.. in front of the entire classroom, saw my son begin to dig his heels in for the fight of his precious little 6 year old life (and watched his face crumble in a way that only a mom would recognize), and SURPRISE!!! Look who’s here! It’s mommy! I pulled him out of the room, threw her a look I hope she’ll never forget, and took him home for some cuddle time. Of course, this was only the first of many incidences I either observed or heard about (through my son, or his brother or sister, or occasional friend), my son weathered, and I can tell you, I stopped sticking up for him for a time. Thought my kid might just really be a bad egg. And sometimes he is, like most kids. But after a 2nd heartbreaking incident in 8th grade (his last “real year” of full-time school before he introduced himself to the medicinal effects of cannabis), where a teacher shouted at him in front of his classroom that just because he was a “troubled” kid didn’t mean he could jerk his chain (or some such ridiculous thing), I re-introduced the school to the wrath of my communication skills. Needless to say, I’m none too popular in this upper class, suburban, blue-ribbon winnin’, BMW driving school system. But it’s okay with me, because I seriously know that for the most part, my kid is right about one thing – another person’s heart. He calls ‘em as he sees ‘em, and he sees ‘em more clearly than they see themselves.
I’m TOTALLY not excusing him for bad behavior! He’s paid many the price for his decisions and behaviors, and will continue to do so. But we need to listen to these kids. They are telling us something in pretty much everything they do.
For the record, I am not the most patient parent in the world. I scream, stomp my feet and fight back with him when I should zip my lip and walk away for some deep breaths and a downward facing dog. Frankly, we don’t get along very well at all. But it will pass and one day we’ll be in a better place, I believe that as much as I believe that most of these kids will find their way. I believe the boy in this story could / would have found his way through it, if he had just waited one more day before placing that order. One more day.
Athena, yes I really am a yoga lover. Are you really a goddess?
1:41 pm on April 24th, 2008
Thanks, dude. Welcome to the site!
1:41 pm on April 24th, 2008
Thanks, Angel. Damn, we have international fame. Wooo Hooo!!!!
My son says, he’s moving to Australia, when he graduates college. Thankfully, he’s only a junior in high school. I want him to see the world, but damn that’s a long way to visit. Visits would be very few and I just think I would die without seeing him. I know, separation anxiety is already taking hold.
1:45 pm on April 24th, 2008
Thank you, Impqueen.
Wow! I feel like I should have something funny to say whenever I write in this little white box w/ blue border. Pressure. Tick tock tick tock… Nope, I got nothin’.
2:01 pm on April 24th, 2008
Agreed. Kids do have to be disciplined for bad behavior. I just think that it should be asked more often – “What is causing all of this bad behavior?” You can still discipline the child, but you can also try to work on the problem that is the underlying cause, thus correcting the desire to demonstrate such bad behaviors.
One example I can remember, was a kid I went to school with, would poke his finger in other kids lunches at school so they wouldn’t eat it. He would then eat their food. He got in all kinds of trouble and no one, including the teachers liked him. It turns out, the kid was not being fed at all at home. What he got to eat a school is ALL he got to eat.
Now while he should have handled things differently, and this is certainly not the case in this thread, the kid was just hungry not mean. This child could have been given time out or instructed to write sentences for his part. At the same time, the school should have been all over DCFS and his parents until this child had a better home life. I don’t know what the poor guy did over the weekends when there wasn’t school or during the summers – but you know his home life sucked. Thankfully, he was removed from the home and adopted by some loving people. He was a good kid from there on out.
Sometimes abuse and neglect are the reasons for bad kids. That’s why we, as a whole, must reach out to others not in the normal curve of things. When we reach out, it gives us the opportunity to do a couple of things: 1) find out why its occuring 2) the ability to act on the “why” if it is abuse or something of the sort that we can correct for the child 3) you could just be the “light” someone needed to see to turn their lives around. You know lead by example, type thing. Just seeing that someone, anyone cares about what is happening in their lives is often enough for a person to realize they are important.
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