Jacksonville - Jonathan Tave was in the Duval County jail, was awaiting trial on charges of murder, premeditated murder, arson, armed robbery, possession of a firearm by convicted felon, and battery on detention officer. After Thursday morning, you can add four counts of sexual battery, aggravated battery of a law enforcement officer, kidnapping, two counts of depriving an officer of a means of protection of communication, possession of a concealed weapon by a felon and two counts of evidence tampering. This after he used a homemade knife to beat and rape a female corrections officer in the law library located on the fifth floor.
The woman is a veteran officer and was also a paralegal. She worked in the library and regularly assisted prisoners with legal research. The library is one of the areas of the jail that is not monitored by surveillance cameras. No procedures were violated, as it is common for pre-detention inmates to walk around inside the jail because they’re monitored by indirect supervision and officers control the doors and elevators inside.
“Through intercom systems we notify inmates it’s time for them to report to certain areas and they come out of their cells and traverse the hallways. So, in that respect you have to rely on their cooperativeness,” Jail Director Gordon Bass said.
In other words, they are confident that while they may be dangerous, the pose no threat to the public as they are contained. The 29-year-old victim carried standard correctional officer equipment consisting of pepper spray, handcuffs and a radio but she was unable to use any of these devices when accosted by the knife wielding, 6 feet 3 inches tall, 230 pound Tave.
“I think this is an indication of the type of people we house in our pretrial detention facility, and the kind of danger our corrections officers, men and women, face every day,” Sheriff John Rutherford said.
So, what do you guys think about this? Not Tave as much, as he is an obvious dickhead, but having female correction officers in this type of environment. I am not saying that a female can not do a man’s job, as I have seen some women that could kick my ass without breaking a sweat. But in a situation such as this one, where a female will be around violent men, should they be? Or should steps be made to specifically safe-guard female employees in this type of environment?
Here is a video report from news4jax.com with Diane Cho, a female news reporter with a hairdo that looks like three different haircuts on one head.
28 responses so far ↓
1
Mandella
Apr 18, 2008 at 10:06 am -I believe that women are fully capable of being correctional officers. I also believe that they are, unfortunately, targets of violence from men who may be stronger than them. That’s just a part of the job.
I do think that pepper spray is far less helpful than many would have us think. There is no substitute for knowing good self-defense techniques.
I have to wonder what kind of training they give these corrections officers, and how often they have to refresh themselves on what they’ve been taught? Was she given the skills she needed to keep herself safe on the job, or was she just given some pepper spray and sent on her way?
I feel just horrible for this woman. I can’t imagine she’ll ever want to return to work. How could she ever feel safe there again?
2
Morbid
Apr 18, 2008 at 10:10 am -She should have never felt safe in the first place, right? I mean, they are in a facility with violent offenders walking around.
3
Mandella
Apr 18, 2008 at 10:13 am -Good point.
Although, I think if I were trained to kick ass and take care of myself, I’d feel pretty safe just about anywhere.
I mean, seriously, had she had a black belt, she might not let her guard down and feel safe, but she wouldn’t have to feel scared either.
4
WryBread
Apr 18, 2008 at 10:22 am -I have mixed feelings on this one. I hate to say that women cannot have a job because of being female. On the other hand, if an individual woman can’t do the job, she shouldn’t have it. On yet another hand, why are possibly violent and dangerous criminals being allowed to stroll around and everyone is relying on their “cooperation” not to be bad boys? Can we say for sure that this guy wouldn’t have done exactly the same thing to a male law clerk whom he saw as vulnerable? Rape seems to be sort of “any port in a storm” activity in jail, so it may have been her vulnerability and not her vagina that attracted Creepo.
And what’s with that Wild Man hair and salsa dancer mustache? You know in court he’ll be in a suit and freshly groomed. I think maybe mug shots should be a part of the trial.
Low ears. Looks as if they are dragging his eyes down at the corners.
5
mom of 4
Apr 18, 2008 at 10:30 am -Exactly Morbid. Working in that environment means never letting your guard down or forgetting where you are. Inmates are like animals in that they sense fear, weakness, and vulnerability. Frankly it doesn’t sound like a good system in that library and inmates are very in-tune to things like that too. There is no surveillance, doors are locked and the female guard is alone? Surprised this didn’t happen sooner really. These are violent offenders after all. I’m glad the guards are getting tasers issued and I trust they will be properly trained in their usage. Depending on the circumstances a taser may very well have helped her.
6
Lilbay
Apr 18, 2008 at 10:44 am -Why would they not have two officers in this area at all times since it is the one place in the jail that is not watched with cameras?
Personally it sounds like a poorly ran prison. They should know where prisoners are always. They should know what they are doing who they are doing it with etc. Can you imagine the things that could be happening in there with such a free run of the place? YIKES
I am fine with lady corrections officers.
In this situation it was likely a situation this guy had seen that she is up there alone. He most likely did not see a camera and figured what the heck he may as well go for it. with the charges he faced anyway he was likely heading to jail so he figured what the heck.
Had they had the camera or had they kept two officers in that area at all times it would likely never have happened.
Even if it was 2 females working that post I seriously doubt he would have tried his hand.
This prison just sort of put here there like a decoy to test to see who would jump the line.
I would if i were here never go back to work there not due to what happened but due to how they protect and think of their officers. I would love to know how many female officers are in this prison.
7
Athena
Apr 18, 2008 at 11:02 am -Corrections officers, like any hazardous position, should employ STRICT physical requirements that should apply equally to both men and women. Sure, this will exclude more women than men, but thems the breaks.
What we’re seeing these days is a different standard set for women in regard to physical requirements. In the police and military, they often don’t have to run as far or as fast, be able to hoist themselves up a rope as fast, etc - all in the name of “diversity”. When you make exceptions like this, you are risking EVERYONE’s safety. I don’t want people’s life and limb risked just so that they can meet bullshit government quotas regarding women in the workplace.
It pisses me off when I see some 5′4″ female police officer. How the fuck is she supposed to protect herself, much less me???
8
impqueen
Apr 18, 2008 at 11:53 am -My little sister is 4′11″ and won her state juniors karate title by beating a six-foot male. Some women can handle it, some women can’t, just like men.
It’s prison. Why the hell were the prisoners out hanging around with only one officer there to supervise them? The guy was awaiting trial for murder, it’s not like he stole an alligator. I don’t mind prisoners having books, but couldn’t the library do cell delivery?
9
Athena
Apr 18, 2008 at 12:08 pm -My little sister is 4′11″ and won her state juniors karate title by beating a six-foot male. Some women can handle it, some women can’t, just like men.
Oh, I understand there are exceptions, which is why I advocate strict requirements that are applied equally. That’s not what happens, currently.
It especially bothers me, though, considering these people have been charged with the task of protection under intense circumstances. I was a kickboxer once upon a time, and I’ll tell you - I may have had wild success within a ring, or sparring with people much bigger than me, but if someone had given my opponent a knife and taken the rules away, the outcome could have been much different.
That’s why it’s important not to dilute the standard in an attempt to include females. In this case, or in the case of other hazardous jobs, you’re doing those who rely upon them a disservice and putting the employee in danger.
In a perfect world, every corrections officer would look like Big John McCarthy.
10
impqueen
Apr 18, 2008 at 12:15 pm -I’m a big fan of giving guards tasers. One taser to the crotch, and rape wouldn’t have been a possibility.
In this case, though, it sounds more like he came up behind the guard. And really, I don’t disagree with you, Athena. Female guards are in a particularly vulnerable situation if they’re left alone with male suspects awaiting trial for violent crimes. I know I wouldn’t be comfortable working that job.
I worked lockdown psych for awhile and occasionally had to go in to deal with a patient who was “going up” alone. My first year out of school I was attacked by a patient and I had few skills to deal with that. After that incident, I realized the facility was crap for not giving me the staff to handle situations like that safely and properly. Many nights I’d sit at my desk with one or two violent sex offenders staring at me, and that job didn’t last long. I suspect that had the on-duty charge nurse been a huge man with a nasty glare, the guys would have moved on down the hall.
11
michelle
Apr 18, 2008 at 12:29 pm -As far as I am concerned it depends on the job and the strength of the person. Let’s say I am in a second floor or higher burning building. I want the big ass strong MAN firefighter coming up the ladder and getting me.
12
Athena
Apr 18, 2008 at 12:40 pm -I’m a big fan of giving guards tasers. One taser to the crotch, and rape wouldn’t have been a possibility.
That’s a tough one, for me. In the interest of self-protection, it seems like a no-brainer. But tasers are responsible for an increasing number of accidental deaths. It seems much easier to kill someone with a police-issued taser than a night stick or, certainly, pepper spray.
Unfortunately, in this case, it doesn’t sound like it would have done a bit of good, considering she didn’t even have the opportunity to reach her pepper spray. I’m still amazed that there is a portion of a prison where inmates are allowed to wander, unrestrained, without camera surveillance. I hope this poor woman gets one hell of a severance package, as she’ll likely never feel comfortable returning to that job.
13
Totemic
Apr 18, 2008 at 1:36 pm -Fuck it, the criminals should have a chip placed in them. If at any time they are in violation of penal codes, flip the switch… chip explodes.
14
jenjen0135
Apr 18, 2008 at 2:03 pm -This wasn’t a prison–This was a county Jail. Most of these guys haven’t been “found guilty” because they are awaiting trial. This place seems to treat them like they are, truly, innocent until proven guilty. Some jails are a bit lax on security, or don’t necessarily have the funds or means to equip them with cameras, speakers, tasers, and the like…
I am a former police officer, 911 operator, and Jail deputy, and I have seen several men taken down by inmates, or just a guy on the side of the road that didn’t want to go to jail. Same difference. It usually requires a team of officers to control someone hell-bent on not complying–Looks awful on camera, but that is the way it is.
Had this woman had a taser, what is the likelihood that- the taser would be the FIRST thing that his inmate would have gone for and attacked her with to render her helpless???? He could have done that with or without a knife. ALWAYS remember that a weapon can be used against you just as easily as you can use it against someone else.
Male or Female.
15
Totemic
Apr 18, 2008 at 2:11 pm -I had an ex that was a WA Correction Officer. The self defense courses she was tought were all passive non injury style. I tought her some street moves, only because I didn’t think what they were teaching her would work against guys like this. Honestly, who cares if she kicks a perp in the nuts? I sure the fuck don’t. Thankfully in the time we dated, nothing ever happened.
16
jenjen0135
Apr 18, 2008 at 2:20 pm -Yep- Man or Woman–You are gonna have to fight dirty, just like the criminals do, if you really want to save your own ass. You can go through all the self-defense in the world, but I KNOW that the only reason they do those classes is so the City/ county Attorneys can say that they “trained” you to protect yourself, not to “harm” or to unnecessary physical harm to the inmate.
Right. Like the criminal gives a shit.
I got sick and tired of all the “good ole’ boys” bullshit (kinda like sheriff Mikey out in OK…) and I got the hell outta LE.
17
mom of 4
Apr 18, 2008 at 2:51 pm -Having been tasered myself (Yep I volunteered to be a perp for hubby when he trained officers how to use a taser) I can assure you I would rather be tasered than beaten and stabbed any day.
18
WryBread
Apr 18, 2008 at 3:45 pm -I agree with you — for all its good intentions “affirmative action” has boosted unprepared and less intelligent individuals of all types into jobs they weren’t qualified to hold — and I have worked with many. A very special hell for those of who can do the job and then are considered to be affirm-act hires because we belong to a minority.
In situations in which physical strength is an absolute requirement, yes, women should not be allowed in if they can’t do the work. But! It has to be certain that the standards are realistic to the job and everyone who meets them must be kept to that level of performance. Not just a one-time super-achievement of peak performance.
Does a pilot or bombardier need to do x-# of push-ups or lift x-# pounds? Is it realistic for basic training to set up a standard that only men can meet when the work itself may not require that skill set? There are many jobs that do not see combat. Is it okay to lower standards of physical strength in these cases? Or is that funneling men to the front lines unfairly because women are filling the support jobs?
What about the demonstrated fact, if you believe the studies, that women endure both pain and stress better than men? Is it sometimes better to have those qualities in a group than a collective ability to lift heavy weights?
Then, of course, there are the female nurses and medics who have always been in danger without anyone worrying much about the number of push-ups they can do.
I don’t know a great deal about military life and would like very much to hear from people who know more than I do. This is a very interesting arena.
19
michelle
Apr 18, 2008 at 4:19 pm -Army Vet here and I have to tell you there where large differences in the male requirements vs. female requirement.
Number of push-ups, sit-ups, 2 mile run time. My goal while in service was to meet the minimum male requirements, and I must say very proudly I did that.
20
Totemic
Apr 18, 2008 at 4:29 pm -I’ll behave then Michelle
21
mom of 4
Apr 18, 2008 at 6:15 pm -They have released more information. She was beaten and raped for over an hour. She also atempted to use her pepper spray, radio and cellphone but he stopped her each time.
http://www.firstcoastnews.com/.....yid=107382
22
Athena
Apr 18, 2008 at 6:18 pm -For OVER AN HOUR…and they’re saying no procedures were being broken? Their procedures were fucking WRONG, then. I hope she finds ground to sue on.
23
WryBread
Apr 18, 2008 at 7:46 pm -You speak the truth! Jesus, no fellow officer came to check on her for over an hour? And I also feel that guys with this kind of charges should be considered “presumed innocent until proven guilty,” but should be treated as “presumed dangerous until proven innocent.”
24
Harley_Tech
Apr 18, 2008 at 10:21 pm -Ahhhhhh, the lady likes the UFC?
R
25
Wonder
Apr 19, 2008 at 2:15 am -I was digging to see who he murdered in 2005, does anyone know the story ?
I found this page so sharing the link http://www.examiner.com/Subject-Jonathan_Tave.html
They are waiting to see why he didnt show up in court.
next court date is May 8
http://www.firstcoastnews.com/.....yid=107368
The officer is still in the hospital.
26
Angel
Apr 19, 2008 at 2:24 am -Why even bother with a trial for this guy? Just go ahead and insert the needle. This one can’t be fixed either. He’s a waste of oxygen.
27
bornagainpagan
Apr 19, 2008 at 7:20 am -All the good debate has been posted, so I’m being lateral.
another eg of subject-word confluence ie correctional officer-guard down.
Whether she slipped up or not, the lack of a buddy system sure let her down. That fucker is either a few sandwiches short of a picnic or knew he was going down on his charges already, and wanted to grab some pussy and prison rep before the big house welcomed him.
28
poolque
Apr 19, 2008 at 11:24 am -I was a Correctional Officer in Texas for a year; here are a few sad truths.
Most states have a shortage of correctional/corrections Officer so their standards mostly only require a High School Education, a clean record, and the physical stamina of anyone who at least keeps slightly active (though males and females wear held to the same standard).
Due to the small numbers of Officers to Inmates (about 38 to 1 if every Officer was on duty at the same time) a lot of Officers by them self when there should be 2 and my unit didn’t have camera surveillance anywhere.
Now my self defense train wasn’t that bad I don’t think it gave all the tools I needed but it got me started we only had refresher courses every year.
And the saddest truth is the biggest killer of Officers is complacency. She should have never felt safe she should have kept her guard up.
Now I don’t want to sound cold I think that this should have never happened, and I feel sad for the officer.
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